Weight Forward... Not Just for S & T

[delav]

I've been working on improving my impact position and ball striking over the last few months. Being a student of the "traditional" swing, I think that I've placed far too much emphasis on loading and unloading the right side during the swing. As a result, I've gotten fairly good while having flaws (slight flipping) at impact, and consistency with my has been holding my scoring back. As a lower scorer, I assumed I was doing everything right. Wrong.

Today at the range everything clicked. I began working on shorter shots with my weight forward, placing a big emphasis on having a solid left side at impact and maintaining an awareness of my weight throughout the swing. As I began to drive my hips toward the target and really favor the left side through impact, my ball contact, shot shape and trajectory vastly improved.

I was able to play 9 today, and I haven't been happier in months. My divots were finally well ahead of the ball position, and I picked up about 15-20 yards on each iron in the bag. I'm thrilled, and I'm convinced that the shifting of the weight taught by many pros and players is misinterpreted and leads many players to never learning a proper impact position. For me, keeping my head still just behind the ball and learning to hit solid shots with a firm weight bias on my front foot was the ticket to the best GIR round of the season.

Thanks eric for all the harping on this concept.

[iacas]

Awesome work, and glad you've stumbled onto something on your own. Really good.

I do want to clarify something too. If you pre-set 55% or even 60% of your weight forward at setup, you'll still technically "transfer your weight" to your right foot. It won't feel like it because we're used to transferring almost 90% of our weight right in the... uhh... the other kind of swing. But in S&T;, since your chest goes right, your arms go right, etc. (well maybe not etc., but your chest and arms and stomach are heavy), there's still a weight transfer to the right side to maybe 60% right. It just feels like the weight stays left because we're used to going back 90% or more.

A good drill for any kind of golfer is to spray paint a thin line on the ground and then just try to take a shallow divot (but don't just brush the ground) in front of that line. See how many times in a row you can do it. Pay attention to what your body's doing. There's a "trick" to doing it and it's the key to striking the ball better.

Anyway, indeed. Good stuff delav.

[deronsizemore]

A good drill for any kind of golfer is to spray paint a thin line on the ground and then just try to take a shallow divot (but don't just brush the ground) in front of that line. See how many times in a row you can do it. Pay attention to what your body's doing. There's a "trick" to doing it and it's the key to striking the ball better.

With this drill, I assume you like to have the ball sitting on top of the line at address? I've seen vids where people do this but put the ball just in front of the line which of course should give the illusion of the divot being taken after the the line and render the drill useless?

[iacas]

With this drill, I assume you like to have the ball sitting on top of the line at address? I've seen vids where people do this but put the ball just in front of the line which of course should give the illusion of the divot being taken after the the line and render the drill useless?

No ball. Just take a divot in front of the line. You set up to it like it's the ball, but no ball. I'm sure you can do it as a scratch golfer but the difficulty goes up with the golfer's handicap.

[Kieran123]

Weird, I was about to start a thread about this same thing.

I had been in a good spot around 3 weeks ago, broke 80, but then could not get good contact and started shooting high 80's again, mainly thinning shots which I hadn't done in a long time.

The last 2 nights, I went to the range and have been putting more weight on my left foot, and man, crisp contact!!!! I would thin maybe 3 or 4 out of the 100 range balls I hit, but still, not the type of thin that rolls along the ground, it still got up O.K.

The biggest change was with my hybrids. Having my weight on my left leg more has given me back confidence in these clubs. Straight and crisp. I hope I am on to something here, going to the range again tonight.


Still working on my hooking driver...getting better though.

Iacas, when I have my weight on my left foot for my driver, I seem to get under the ball too much and it skies it bad. I can't seem to incorporate the same thing I was doing for my hybrids/irons with my driver....any tips?

[delav]

I do want to clarify something too. If you pre-set 55% or even 60% of your weight forward at setup, you'll still technically "transfer your weight" to your right foot. It won't feel like it because we're used to transferring almost 90% of our weight right in the... uhh... the other kind of swing. But in S&T;, since your chest goes right, your arms go right, etc. (

Thanks Eric. I agree with you here. With a slight weight bias on my front foot at address and working on my weight at impact, I had the illusion that i wasn't "shifting my weight." Looking at the video afterwards told a different story. Without thinking of a "weight shift" I found a subtle loading and unloading on the inside of my right foot.

Does this mean I'm on my way to being one of them now?

[iacas]

Iacas, when I have my weight on my left foot for my driver, I seem to get under the ball too much and it skies it bad. I can't seem to incorporate the same thing I was doing for my hybrids/irons with my driver....any tips?

The driver requires the biggest hip push forward on the downswing. You're probably coming into the ball incredibly steep, and the hip push forward puts in secondary axis tilt (i.e. your head "leaning back" from your belt - but not because your head has moved, only because your hips have pushed forward). You can get away with 60/40 at impact with irons and even a hybrid, but with a driver it's imperative that you get to 90/10 or so.

Does this mean I'm on my way to being one of them now?

Maybe...

I'm off for French Lick guys. Good luck!

[deronsizemore]

No ball. Just take a divot in front of the line. You set up to it like it's the ball, but no ball. I'm sure you can do it as a scratch golfer but the difficulty goes up with the golfer's handicap.

Ah, gotcha. Well, while my handicap still is around scratch, the way I've been hitting the ball lately you'd think I was more like a 15. lol. Lots of flipping going on which I'm slowly working to fix by incorporating some stack and tilt into my swing. Funny thing is that a friend of mine who learned from Andy and played on the Hooters Tour for a bit used Stack and Tilt before it was really labeled as "Stack and Tilt" and showed me a few things with it around seven years ago had me hitting the ball great after a range session. After that I just stopped using the method... not sure why. The more I read, the more it makes sense.

Along with having a newborn baby, I've succumbed to the fact that my golf game this year is going to struggle, so I've decided to just work on incorporating swing changes at the range when I can as playing actual rounds of golf are going to be few and far between. Doing the same thing over and over yet expecting different results (like I've done for years now) isn't cutting it for me.

The driver requires the biggest hip push forward on the downswing. You're probably coming into the ball incredibly steep, and the hip push forward puts in secondary axis tilt (i.e. your head "leaning back" from your belt - but not because your head has moved, only because your hips have pushed forward). You can get away with 60/40 at impact with irons and even a hybrid, but with a driver it's imperative that you get to 90/10 or so.

Driver is the thing that I'm having the most difficult time "getting." A lot of the stack and tilt principals are geared toward getting the golfer on a steeper angle on the downswing, no? Since most golfers are too shallow which makes them impact the ground before the ball. Everything you hear talks about hitting the ball on the upswing with driver. With your weight 90/10 with driver at impact, wouldn't you be hitting down on the ball similar to an iron? I'm asking because I don't know... this is just the feeling I get. I think my biggest problem with getting my weight forward is that I get it forward but my upper body likes to follow and get forward as well rather than staying back while letting my lower ball slide.

[Fozcycle]

Hey delav,

I just read this article in an old Golf magazine (October 2007) and thought it may be for you.


http://www.golf.com/golf/instruction...652866,00.html

I sent it t a friend who is a Lefty and was having problems pushing off from the backswing due to plantar fascia in his left foot.

He tried it last week and said it not only helped relieve the pain, but also helped his swing.

[iacas]

A lot of the stack and tilt principals are geared toward getting the golfer on a steeper angle on the downswing, no?

My wife's yelling at me (not really, let's say she's being incredibly insistent) to pack so this will be short. Sorry...

Short answer: no. Not steeper at all. Common misconception, because the tucking the butt (sliding the hips forward) AND the "jumping" (closely related, those two are) both shallow the approach into the ball quite a bit.

Since most golfers are too shallow which makes them impact the ground before the ball.

That's not really about being shallow or steep - it's about where the low point is. A LOT of people I see are incredibly steep. That's how they take the massive divots... sometimes four inches behind the ball. Or six.

Everything you hear talks about hitting the ball on the upswing with driver. With your weight 90/10 with driver at impact, wouldn't you be hitting down on the ball similar to an iron?

a) 50%+ of the PGA Tour hits slightly down on the driver. S&T; likes basically a fairly level hit with the driver.

b) Where your weight is is somewhat irrelevant - your upper center doesn't move forward, creating that "tilt back" coming into impact. I could go on for an hour about this but again the wife... suffice to say though that the same moves that shallow the downswing (hips pushing forward, you "jumping") also shallow out the driver.

I think my biggest problem with getting my weight forward is that I get it forward but my upper body likes to follow and get forward as well rather than staying back while letting my lower ball slide.

BINGO. If your upper body slides forward you get INCREDIBLY steep on the ball because you have to throw the clubhead straight down at the ground or you would take a divot a foot or so in front of the ball.

The lower body (tailbone, whatever) HAS to push in front of the upper center, which should remain fairly stable. See the "hip slide" thread for some pictures of a bunch of pros - almost none S&T; - doing this.

[deronsizemore]

Short answer: no. Not steeper at all. Common misconception, because the tucking the butt (sliding the hips forward) AND the "jumping" (closely related, those two are) both shallow the approach into the ball quite a bit.

I see. I guess I got that general idea from reading this article a long time ago:

http://www.golfdigest.com/golf-instr...acktiltcritics where Andy responds to Mike Bender.

BINGO. If your upper body slides forward you get INCREDIBLY steep on the ball because you have to throw the clubhead straight down at the ground or you would take a divot a foot or so in front of the ball.

Yep, and this is has always been my problem. When I can force myself to keep my upper center back I can hit the ball really well; I just don't do it often. Even when I don't it's not like I'm out there hacking it around, but it's definitely not one of those solid feeling shots that seem to zing through the air. It's usually more of a weak wipe and often a fade out to the right.

Anyway, I know I got off topic. I'll leave it at that. Thanks!

[delav]

Just had a -1 35 (1 eagle, 1 bogey and 7 pars), had several birdie putts that should have dropped. Really happy with all the help in this thread from others. Thanks again!