ball touching a rake

[Paradox]

Playing a round with a friend over the weekend and one of his shots came to rest against a bunker rake.  Obviously, you have to move the rake but what I wonder is do you replace the ball or play it from where it may end up?

[Fourputt]

Originally Posted by Paradox

Playing a round with a friend over the weekend and one of his shots came to rest against a bunker rake.  Obviously, you have to move the rake but what I wonder is do you replace the ball or play it from where it may end up?

Remove the rake.  If the ball moves it must be replaced. No penalty.  If it fails to stay where it was, then it must be placed in the nearest place where it will remain, but no closer to the hole.  If the ball lies in a hazard (bunker or water hazard), then it must be placed in the hazard.  If there is no place where it will remain at rest within the hazard and not closer to the hole, then it may be dropped outside of the hazard with a one stroke penalty.

[GaijinGolfer]

Replace the ball.  The rake is considered a, "loose impediment" and may be moved as long as you place the ball back where it originally came to rest.

[Fourputt]

Originally Posted by GaijinGolfer

Replace the ball.  The rake is considered a, "loose impediment" and may be moved as long as you place the ball back where it originally came to rest.

No, the rake is a moveable obstruction.  Loose impediments are natural objects.  If the ball was against a loose impediment, then if the ball moved when you removed it, you would incur a one stroke penalty.  If the ball and the loose impediment both lay in a hazard, then you would not be allowed to move it.

Obstructions

An “obstruction’’ is anything artificial, including the artificial surfaces and sides of roads and paths and manufactured ice, except:

a. Objects defining out of bounds, such as walls, fences, stakes and railings;

b. Any part of an immovable artificial object that is out of bounds; and

c. Any construction declared by the Committee to be an integral part of the course.

An obstruction is a movable obstruction if it may be moved without unreasonable effort, without unduly delaying play and without causing damage. Otherwise, it is an immovable obstruction.

Note: The Committee may make a Local Rule declaring a movable obstruction to be an immovable obstruction.

Then Rule 24-1 reads:

24-1. Movable Obstruction

A player may take relief, without penalty, from a movable obstruction as follows:

a. If the ball does not lie in or on the obstruction, the obstruction may be removed. If the ball moves, it must be replaced, and there is no penalty, provided that the movement of the ball is directly attributable to the removal of the obstruction. Otherwise, Rule 18-2a applies.

b. If the ball lies in or on the obstruction, the ball may be lifted and the obstruction removed. The ball must through the green or in a hazard be dropped, or on the putting green be placed, as near as possible to the spot directly under the place where the ball lay in or on the obstruction, but not nearer the hole.

The ball may be cleaned when lifted under this Rule.

When a ball is in motion, an obstruction that might influence the movement of the ball, other than equipment of any player or the flagstick when attended, removed or held up, must not be moved.

(Exerting influence on ball – see Rule 1-2)

Note: If a ball to be dropped or placed under this Rule is not immediately recoverable, another ball may be substituted.

[Dormie1360]

Originally Posted by Fourputt

No, the rake is a moveable obstruction.  Loose impediments are natural objects.  If the ball was against a loose impediment, then if the ball moved when you removed it, you would incur a one stroke penalty.  If the ball and the loose impediment both lay in a hazard, then you would not be allowed to move it.

Then Rule 24-1 reads:

Just to add, if in a hazard the penalty is 2 strokes for moving the loose impediment.  If you are moving loose impediments when searching in the hazard, no penalty unless you move the ball during the search, then it's a 1 stroke penalty and the ball must be replaced.

If you moved a loose impediment in a hazard, other than searching, and caused the ball moved, 2 strokes for moving the loose impediment. I don't think you get another 1 stroke penalty for the ball moving, however it must be replaced.  Otherwise another 2 stroke penalty for not replacing the ball.

[Paradox]

Oops! Looks like my friend actually rang up some penalty strokes, then.  Neither of us knew whether to play it as it lay or replace it..and he chose the former.  So would that be a 1 stroke penalty for playing from the wrong spot?  Just to add..it wasn't a round for money or anything..we were just catching up after having not seen each other for a while.

[Dormie1360]

Originally Posted by Paradox

Oops! Looks like my friend actually rang up some penalty strokes, then.  Neither of us knew whether to play it as it lay or replace it..and he chose the former.  So would that be a 1 stroke penalty for playing from the wrong spot?  Just to add..it wasn't a round for money or anything..we were just catching up after having not seen each other for a while.

2 strokes.  If he would have replaced the ball, there would have been no penalty.