Do you really care about P.E.D's?

[flap]

Damn I started a good one Huh?Listen If Pavorati needed cocaine to hit a certain note and I was paying 1000.00 for a front row seat I would send Bubba to get the blow cause I want to be entertained for my money.If todays athelets want to shorten life to entertain me and my money I say go for it .

[N.V.M.]

Damn I started a good one Huh?Listen If Pavorati needed cocaine to hit a certain note and I was paying 1000.00 for a front row seat I would send Bubba to get the blow cause I want to be entertained for my money.If todays athelets want to shorten life to entertain me and my money I say go for it .

i don't think you are considering the message that would send out to all the youngsters out there trying to become professionals at their sport. would you give your kid a couple of lines before the big game?

[FIJIGolf23]

i don't think you are considering the message that would send out to all the youngsters out there trying to become professionals at their sport. would you give your kid a couple of lines before the big game?

He obviously doesn't care, N.V.M. That's the dumbest and most selfish point of view on Performance Enhancing Drugs that I've ever heard. So you are admitting that you could care less about these people? You could care less about the image it sets forth for the youth now and what potential effects it could have on future youth? What about the kids that are pressured by that coaches to take a Cortizone shot so they can numb up their knee, shoulder, etc. so that they can play? And since you are paying to watch this event then you want them to destroy themselves and promote a negative image towards sports for your enjoyment? That's sad. And DirtCheap, I can play this game too. You say that andro isn't banned and then you post up a link to back yourself. Here goes.... http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/per...-drugs/HQ01105

Androstenedione Androstenedione (andro) is a hormone produced by the adrenal glands, ovaries and testes. It's a precursor hormone that's normally converted to testosterone and estradiol in both men and women. Manufacturers of synthetic androstenedione, through vigorous marketing efforts, have claimed that their products increase your body's production of testosterone. According to proponents of andro supplements, an elevated level of testosterone allows athletes to train harder and recover more quickly. Scientific studies that refute these claims are now emerging. In fact, these studies show that supplemental androstenedione doesn't increase testosterone and that your muscles don't get stronger with andro use. The Anabolic Steroid Control Act of 2004 classified andro as a controlled substance, adding it to the list of banned anabolic steroids and making its use as a performance-enhancing drug illegal. Side effects of andro differ for men and women. In men it can actually decrease the production of testosterone while increasing the production of estrogen. Side effects in men include acne, diminished sperm production, shrinking of the testicles and enlargement of the breasts. In women, side effects include acne and masculinization, such as deepening of the voice and male-pattern baldness. Andro might also stunt your child's growth. In men and women, supplemental androstenedione can decrease high-density lipoprotein (HDL) cholesterol (the "good" cholesterol). Lower HDL levels put you at greater risk of heart attack and stroke.

Another one....

http://www.nutrabio.com/News/news.st...trol_act_2.htm

Anabolic Steroid Control Act of 2004 (Enrolled as Agreed to or Passed by Both House and Senate) S.2195 One Hundred Eighth Congress of the United States of America AT THE SECOND SESSION Begun and held at the City of Washington on Tuesday, the twentieth day of January, two thousand and four An Act To amend the Controlled Substances Act to clarify the definition of anabolic steroids and to provide for research and education activities relating to steroids and steroid precursors. Be it enacted by the Senate and House of Representatives of the United States of America in Congress assembled, SECTION 1. SHORT TITLE. This Act may be cited as the `Anabolic Steroid Control Act of 2004'. SECTION 2. AMENDMENTS TO THE CONTROLLED SUBSTANCES ACT. (a) DEFINITIONS- Section 102 of the Controlled Substances Act (21 U.S.C. 802) is amended-- (1) in paragraph (41)-- (A) by realigning the margin so as to align with paragraph (40); and (B) by striking subparagraph (A) and inserting the following: (A) The term `anabolic steroid' means any drug or hormonal substance, chemically and pharmacologically related to testosterone (other than estrogens, progestins, corticosteroids, and dehydroepiandrosterone), and includes-- (i) androstanediol-- (I) 3b,17b-dihydroxy-5a-androstane; and (II) 3a,17b-dihydroxy-5a-androstane; (ii) androstanedione (5a-androstan-3,17-dione); (iii) androstenediol-- (I) 1-androstenediol (3b,17b-dihydroxy-5a-androst-1-ene); (II) 1-androstenediol (3a,17b-dihydroxy-5a-androst-1-ene); (III) 4-androstenediol (3b,17b-dihydroxy-androst-4-ene); (IV) 5-androstenediol (3b,17b-dihydroxy-androst-5-ene); (iv) androstenedione-- (I) 1-androstenedione ([5a]-androst-1-en-3,17-dione); (II) 4-androstenedione (androst-4-en-3,17-dione); (III) 5-androstenedione (androst-5-en-3,17-dione); (v) bolasterone (7a,17a-dimethyl-17b-hydroxyandrost-4-en-3-one); (vi) boldenone (17b-hydroxyandrost-1,4,-diene-3-one); (vii) calusterone (7b,17a-dimethyl-17b-hydroxyandrost-4-en-3-one); (viii) clostebol (4-chloro-17b-hydroxyandrost-4-en-3-one); (ix) dehydrochloromethyltestosterone (4-chloro-17b-hydroxy-17a-methyl-androst-1,4-dien-3-one); (x) *1-dihydrotestosterone (a.k.a. `1-testosterone') (17b-hydroxy-5a-androst-1-en-3-one); (xi) 4-dihydrotestosterone (17b-hydroxy-androstan-3-one); (xii) drostanolone (17b-hydroxy-2a-methyl-5a-androstan-3-one); (xiii) ethylestrenol (17a-ethyl-17b-hydroxyestr-4-ene); (xiv) fluoxymesterone (9-fluoro-17a-methyl-11b,17b-dihydroxyandrost-4-en-3-one); (xv) formebolone (2-formyl-17a-methyl-11a,17b-dihydroxyandrost-1,4-dien-3-one); (xvi) furazabol (17a-methyl-17b-hydroxyandrostano[2,3-c]-furazan); (xvii) 13b-ethyl-17a-hydroxygon-4-en-3-one; (xviii) 4-hydroxytestosterone (4,17b-dihydroxy-androst-4-en-3-one); (xix) 4-hydroxy-19-nortestosterone (4,17b-dihydroxy-estr-4-en-3-one); (xx) mestanolone (17a-methyl-17b-hydroxy-5a-androstan-3-one); (xxi) mesterolone (1a-methyl-17b-hydroxy-[5a]-androstan-3-one); (xxii) methandienone (17a-methyl-17b-hydroxyandrost-1,4-dien-3-one); (xxiii) methandriol (17a-methyl-3b,17b-dihydroxyandrost-5-ene); (xxiv) methenolone (1-methyl-17b-hydroxy-5a-androst-1-en-3-one); (xxv) 17a-methyl-3b, 17b-dihydroxy-5a-androstane; (xxvi) 17a-methyl-3a,17b-dihydroxy-5a-androstane; (xxvii) 17a-methyl-3b,17b-dihydroxyandrost-4-ene. (xxviii) 17a-methyl-4-hydroxynandrolone (17a-methyl-4-hydroxy-17b-hydroxyestr-4-en-3-one); (xxix) methyldienolone (17a-methyl-17b-hydroxyestra-4,9(10)-dien-3-one); (xxx) methyltrienolone (17a-methyl-17b-hydroxyestra-4,9-11-trien-3-one); (xxxi) methyltestosterone (17a-methyl-17b-hydroxyandrost-4-en-3-one); (xxxii) mibolerone (7a,17a-dimethyl-17b-hydroxyestr-4-en-3-one); (xxxiii) 17a-methyl-*1-dihydrotestosterone (17b-hydroxy-17a-methyl-5a-androst-1-en-3-one) (a.k.a. `17-a-methyl-1-testosterone'); (xxxiv) nandrolone (17b-hydroxyestr-4-en-3-one); (xxxv) norandrostenediol-- (I) 19-nor-4-androstenediol (3b, 17b-dihydroxyestr-4-ene); (II) 19-nor-4-androstenediol (3a, 17b-dihydroxyestr-4-ene); (III) 19-nor-5-androstenediol (3b, 17b-dihydroxyestr-5-ene); and (IV) 19-nor-5-androstenediol (3a, 17b-dihydroxyestr-5-ene); (xxxvi) norandrostenedione-- (I) 19-nor-4-androstenedione (estr-4-en-3,17-dione); and (II) 19-nor-5-androstenedione (estr-5-en-3,17-dione; (xxxvii) norbolethone (13b,17a-diethyl-17b-hydroxygon-4-en-3-one); (xxxviii) norclostebol (4-chloro-17b-hydroxyestr-4-en-3-one); (xxxix) norethandrolone (17a-ethyl-17b-hydroxyestr-4-en-3-one); (xl) normethandrolone (17a-methyl-17b-hydroxyestr-4-en-3-one); (xli) oxandrolone (17a-methyl-17b-hydroxy-2-oxa-[5a]-androstan-3-one); (xlii) oxymesterone (17a-methyl-4,17b-dihydroxyandrost-4-en-3-one); (xliii) oxymetholone (17a-methyl-2-hydroxymethylene-17b-hydroxy-[5a]-androstan-3-one); (xliv) stanozolol (17a-methyl-17a-hydroxy-[5a]-androst-2-eno[3,2-c]-pyrazole); (xlv) stenbolone (17b-hydroxy-2-methyl-[5a]-androst-1-en-3-one); (xlvi) testolactone (13-hydroxy-3-oxo-13,17-secoandrosta-1,4-dien-17-oic acid lactone); (xlvii) testosterone (17b-hydroxyandrost-4-en-3-one); (xlviii) tetrahydrogestrinone (13b,17a-diethyl-17b-hydroxygon-4,9,11-trien-3-one); (xlix) trenbolone (17b-hydroxyestr-4,9,11-trien-3-one); and (xlx) any salt, ester, or ether of a drug or substance described in this paragraph. The substances excluded under this subparagraph may at any time be scheduled by the Attorney General in accordance with the authority and requirements of subsections (a) through (c) of section 201.'; and. etc. etc. etc .

Do a little research before you attemp to insult someone you don't know. It may keep you from looking like a fool. (next time anyway

It seems as though you should not be so quick to pass judgement on this fellow....

[golf_junkie27]

You sure about that?

I'll make this simple for you. When I make a comment such as "Andro has been banned", it's because it's true. Another member posted a comment confirming this. Taking a quote from 1999? To prove your point? When there are hundreds of articles and links that show that andro has been banned? I'll give you some credit. At least you did not argue that blood doping is illegal in sports. You should look up the term for training in high altitude. It's not "blood doping." As for looking like a fool, I'd say "Take a look in the mirror." I don't argue with people when I'm not versed in the subject. If I am unsure, I use this little website www.google.com . Additionally, look back at my posts. I never insulted you. Next time, when someone uses the control a governing body type has over an industry, you won't compare it to someone eating an apple.

[flap]

Well if you want to get me started here goes.If your kids have to watch TV to find a hero then what the hell are you doing in the house?If you are telling your kids they can be professional atheletes do your self a favor and just pay for college cause 99% of them ain't gonna make it.

[FIJIGolf23]

Well if you want to get me started here goes.If your kids have to watch TV to find a hero then what the hell are you doing in the house?If you are telling your kids they can be professional atheletes do your self a favor and just pay for college cause 99% of them ain't gonna make it.

That's an awfully depressing way to look at it. Every kid watched professional sports growing up and said, "Man, I want to make the game winning touchdown." Or, "I want to sink that 10 footer on the 18th hole at Augusta to win the green jacket." I don't know if my future kids can be professional athletes or not, but I know one thing for damn sure, I'm going to encourage them to try. Telling your kids that they can't be something that they want to be is sad. That's just telling them to admit defeat, roll over, and be a nobody for the rest of their life. You may choose to do that with your children, but I sure as hell won't be taking the same approach.

[Lemay427]

i look at it as cheating. I think all records/achievements should be stripped for any professional athelete.

let the wrestlers in the WWF do the steroids and HGH. Its not a sport and the acheivements do not mean crap.

[Lemay427]

in regards to flaps comment about kids/pro sports......

ya i would agree with fiji golf. anything is a possibility and if they have the drive and some natural ability anything is possible. admitting defeat before the battle (when you actually have a chance at winning) means your a coward. your right about 99% do not make it. but there is a 1% chance that you could so you might as well try.

[N.V.M.]

does anybody else find it interesting that Mark McGwire didn't even come close to getting into the Hall of Fame yesterday?

[Norm66]

My concern about the PED controversy is that due to the manufacturers staying one step ahead of the testers it'll lead to witch-hunting when a guy goes on a streak yet tests negative. If it was truly an easily verified black & white, user/non-user climate I'd be all for rigorous testing. As it is though, with the lists of drugs that are ok if prescribed by a doctor or just not on the banned lists etc. it leaves too much open to interpretation by the media and by fans alike.

As an aside, I'm one of those guys who doesn't think that just because somebody is good enough to play pro ball, golf, hockey etc. that that makes them a role model for somebody else's kids. Being saints (role models) to kids is simply not in the job description of pro athletes, they're there to compete and win. Parents IMHO are too quick to try and force role model status on sports stars. In many cases, they're just not good ones and they can't be forced to be.

[FIJIGolf23]

As an aside, I'm one of those guys who doesn't think that just because somebody is good enough to play pro ball, golf, hockey etc. that that makes them a role model for somebody else's kids. Being saints (role models) to kids is simply not in the job description of pro athletes, they're there to compete and win. Parents IMHO are too quick to try and force role model status on sports stars. In many cases, they're just not good ones and they can't be forced to be.

Whether or not parents force on their kids that these athletes should be looked at as role models is completely aside the point. These men and women that call themselves professional athletes are on tv all the time. They don't have a choice that their lives are scrutinized and the media blows everything to ungodly proportions.

Kids see these successful men and women and think, "wow, I want to be like that." It doesn't matter what parents do because kids have an imagination that places themselves in their shoes.

[Norm66]

Fiji, I'm not sure I follow. The first paragraph seems to agree with me while the 2nd paragraph kind of disagrees. IMHO it's on the parents to teach their kids who are and who aren't good role models.