chasm

A lot of the different responses here depend on what people regard as "penal" rough. The semi rough where I play is dense enough for a ball to settle down in (I've lost plenty of balls there) and certainly lush enough to compromise one's chances of making good contact. So I'd certainly be happier playing a 5-iron from the fairway than a seven or eight iron from the semi rough, because with the latter I'm much more likely to lose control of the shot.

Yes, it has healed properly. But as with most such injuries, there's a permanent slight change in the shape of the joint and I'd bet money on it meaning that my swing would be slightly different from the previous version, even if I'd been trying to keep it the same. There's no problem once you're fully mobilised, though.

There isn't an issue unless they invite you to partner them in any kind of pairs competition. If you know they're a vanity handicapper you'll find a way to politely decline.

I have a set of G25s. They came in a couple of boxes with each iron individually wrapped in plastic bubblewrap.

There are far more vanity handicappers than sandbaggers. (We call the latter "bandits" over here). Many of the vanity handicappers are to be found among the older members who used to be able to play to lowish handicaps and are pretending to the world (and maybe themselves) that they're as good as they used to be. Typically their strategy involves putting in the minimum number of cards in a season that is required to maintain an active handicap (three) and submitting only their best cards, so their handicap rises at a positively glacial pace even though they usually don't play within ten shots of it. I occasionally get paired with a 68 year-old who is off nine, and has a declared ambition to retire from the game without ever having got out of single figures. He almost never breaks ninety.

If you talked on your 'phone at my club you'd be asked to leave the course. They're banned.

A couple of years ago I had a separation of the left shoulder. I was in the middle of a six-year break from golf at that time, but returned to the game at the start of this year. The lay-off, and the slight alteration to the shape of my shoulder caused by the injury, made me come to the same conclusion as you - I needed to start again as if I was a complete beginner, forget my previous bad habits and take it as an opportunity to get things right this time around. The most important thing I did was take some lessons before those bad habits became ingrained again. I wasn't a complete beginner, of course - the basics of grip, stance and so on were still there - but having the advice of a pro from the outset meant that I am evolving a swing whichis markedly different from, and more orthodox than, the one I had before. I'm optimistic that I'll end up a better, more consistent player as a result. The one thing I'd say about the injury is to ensure that you do enough physiotherapy to restore as much mobility to the joint as you can before you get into full swings with your golf clubs. If you try to do too much too soon I'd say there's a danger that you'll end up developing a swing that is compromised because you are trying to compensate for the lack of freedom in the joint. So take your time, would be my advice.

This is the guidance given to members and visitors at my club: The R & A have issued guidelines in the “Rules of Golf” to combat Slow Play. Extracts from these rules are detailed below: [b]The Basics[/b] Keep up with the group in front If you lose a hole, call the group behind you through Be ready to play your shot when it is your turn Leave the green promptly [b]Time a game should take around Brancepeth [/b] For “normal golf” it is important for the Committee to set targets for round times. As we know, there is not a “one size fits all” model for round times but it is important that the targets are achievable without being too soft. Rounds should take no longer than the following: Two-Balls 3 hrs 10 mins Three-Balls 3 hrs 30 mins Four-Balls 3 hrs 50 mins [b]How players can help to minimise round times:[/b] Be aware of your position with regard to the group in front. Do not concern yourself with the group behind; the fact that you are not holding them up is irrelevant as it is your group’s responsibility to keep up with the group in front. If you feel that your group is falling behind, advise the other players in your group. If your group is behind, try to catch up quickly. If you lose a clear hole and are delaying the group behind, or if there is no group in front of you and you are delaying the group behind, invite the group behind to play through. Do not wait until it is your turn to play before putting your glove on. Do not wait until it is your turn to play before calculating your yardage and selecting your club. Look at your own line of putt while the other players in the group look at theirs (within the bounds of normal etiquette). At the green, position your bags so as to allow quick movement off the green to the next tee. Move off the green as soon as all players in your group have holed out Mark score cards at or on the way to the next tee. If you have the honour, consider marking the score card after you have teed off. Play a provisional ball if your ball may be lost outside a hazard or out of bounds. If you keep up with the group in front, you cannot be accused of slow play.[/i]

Had an 86 today, which is decent, by my standards. I seem to be driving the ball better, and my wedges and short irons were OK. Long irons and fairway woods need work, though, as does my short game. Can't read a green to save my life at the moment.

Ouch. That's a hell of a lot of money. The entry fees over here vary considerably, from zero to many thousands of pounds at the more famous and exclusive clubs in densely-populated areas. In my part of the country there are a lot of clubs, few of whom are operating at full capacity. As a result almost all of them have waived their entry fees entirely in order to encourage new members to join, and that is the case in large parts of England outside the South East. So you can join my club for no money up front and £720 per year, with no additional monthly costs apart from locker hire, competition entries so on. And there are cheaper clubs in the region. As you can see, golf is relatively cheap over here. And the policy of allowing visitors to play is one reason for that. If we didn't collect the income from visitors who wanted to play the course, the fees would rise considerably - though not to anything like the levels you describe. Having said that, one must also bear in mind that most British clubs function at a more modest level, in terms of facilities, than the American private clubs. Fewer staff, smaller clubhouses, relatively low levels of expenditure apart from that required to keep the course in decent shape.

This is very good advice. In my experience, a lot of high handicappers would make fewer really costly errors, and therefore score better, if they played a lot of the par 4s as par 5s, thus attempting fewer ambitious shots that were at the limits of their capabilities. Taking that approach has certainly helped me.

LOL. If you'd seen my meltdown on the greens yesterday, you'd know how easy it is to take three shots from inside forty feet. Four from 100 yards is child's play.

All very true. And obviously the high handicapper (me, for instance) is going to make a poor contact often enough to make it sensible to lay up rather than attempt the carry over a hazard that would require me to hit my best possible shot. But if there's no particular trouble in the way I'm going to take the club that will get the required distance if I hit it properly. My "average" distance, counted to include the bad shots, is completely unhelpful in terms of planning my way round the course, because I'll almost never hit it the "average" distance. i'll either hit it properly or screw up and be much shorter, or off-line. There's no point in taking a five iron rather than a seven when I'm 150 yards from the green just because I sometimes mishit it.

My home course is Brancepeth Castle, about 5 miles from Durham City in North-East England. It's a parkland course of 6400 yards off the competition tees, laid out in 1924 by Harry Colt. There's a stream running through the course that has carved a ravine, and Colt made us of that to create some fairly spectacular and intimidating holes. In particular, four of the five par 3s on the course demand that you carry the ravine - two of them are just over 200 yards - to plateau greens. Miss them and you're going to struggle to get up and down. It's a decent challenge, looks excellent - great views from the course, including those of the mediaeval castle for which it is named - and is a pretty friendly place. Visitors welcome, so if any of you Americans happen to find yourself in the vicinity while on vacation...

If my fairy godmother could just give me a swing, it would be Fred Couples. Love watching it, and the tempo is sublime. I wouldn't try to copy it, though, it's incredible to me that he gets the clubface back to the ball. If I were trying to copy one, it would have to be something more orthodox like Scott or Donald.

I shot an absolutely horrible 95 yesterday. Out in 51 including 25 putts. The greens are quickening up as the weather improves, I badly misjudged the pace on the first couple of holes and then went completely to pieces, getting tentative, leaving the approach putts short and then missing three- and four-footers right, left and centre. It was atrocious, I was hitting the ball quite well but couldn't get the ball in the hole.

Casey needs to qualify for pretty much everything in the US because he has done so little over there because of injuries. He won't need to qualify for the Open in the UK because he's been a top-ten finisher in that a couple of times. (I actually have a bet on him for that at 80/1, because a couple of weeks ago I noticed he was coming back to form, and I'm pleased to say his odds have shortened considerably following his performance at the Memorial). I hope he does qualify for the US Open and that he does well. He's a great ball-striker, and has a reputation for being a really nice guy, and he's had a tough time.

Thanks for the explanation. I understand the distinction, but I'm not talking about "daily fee courses". Most clubs in the UK are private and owned by the membership, and in a position, if they wanted to, to restrict playing to only members and their guests. But very few don't accept visitors, largely because they want the income, but partly because it is mutually beneficial. Lots of people want to play a variety of courses occasionally, and clubs allowing visitors makes that easy to achieve. The very few that don't allow this tend to be extremely expensive and exclusive. Of course, there are restrictions. My own club will only allow visitors to play on weekdays or late in the day at the weekends (in the unlikely event they can get a tee-time on those days), and a lot of tee times are reserved for members-only. Just a different tradition, I guess.

Viewed from the other side of the pond, this is an interesting and quite surprising thread. Surprising in that so many Americans who play golf regularly seem not to be members of a club. Over here in the UK I'd say the vast majority of those who play the game regularly - by which I mean one or more times a week, weather permitting - will join a club. They'll do so for any number of reasons, but probably the most important is that it's cheaper than the alternative. My own club, for example, is not one of the cheapest in the area. But annual membership costs £720 (around $1100) and there are no additional fees to play the course, though there are small entry fees for the competitions. Visitors are welcome, green fees are £44 per round. So the arithmetic is simple. If I played the course 20 times as a visitor I'd have already spent significantly more than it costs to be a member for a year. And since I play twice a week, it's a no-brainer. Contrary to the idea that joining is only for rich people, you'd have to be rich to choose not to join, if you play a lot. I don't find playing the same course regularly to be boring, it's a Harry Colt course and pretty challenging for the ordinary player. And we have reciprocal deals with a number of other clubs locally, so I can play their courses now and again at reduced rates. Clubs vary, of course. There are still some with a reputation for snobbery, and there are certainly plenty that ordinary working people couldn't possibly afford to join. But in most of the UK (I'll make an exception of London and the South East) there are plenty of clubs to go round, so in general, fees are affordable. I'm interested that the American experience seems, on the evidence of this thread, to be so different.

It doesn't matter what's "right", as far as I can see. All that matters is that you know how far you hit each club and play accordingly.

I am not a good golfer. I played on-and-off earlier in my life, and this year, since retiring, I have put some time in and hope to learn to play properly. Returning to the game has been educational. I hadn't played for several years, so I decided to start again from the beginning and take some lessons as if I were a complete beginner. It's paying dividends. I am trying to avoid repeating my old bad habits, and to trust the advice of the young pro with whom I'm spending one hour a week. And after 4 months of this I am playing to 18 and feel that getting into the low 80s is possible. My advice to anyone who is shooting above 100 is to invest some time and money in lessons. I would never have been able to diagnose and correct my most basic faults without the advice of a pro, and the more lessons I have had, the more I ahve begun to understand the swing. As a result I am beginning to be able to practice effectively, identifying what is going wrong and making adjustments accordingly. Without the knowledge imparted by the lessons woth the pro I wouldn't have got to that stage. I'd just have been practicing, and reinforcing, the same faulty swing that had me in trouble in the first place.

McIlroy is a streaky player. When he's hot, he's hot. When he's not, he's terrible. The first two rounds at the Memorial pretty much sum him up. He's going to have some spectacular victories, but in my opinion he doesn't look like developing the sort of consistency that would allow him to grind out 10 majors. One of the more attractive things about the game at the moment is how many very, very good young players there are. It's impossible to predict how things will look in ten years time because most of us have probably never heard of the kid who is going to be the best in the world.

Hello all. My name's Charlie, I live in North-East England. Having played golf irregularly earlier in my life, other priorities meant that I hadn't played at all for nearly ten years. But having been fortunate enough to retire a little early, I decided in January to return to the game aged 59 and devote some time to trying to learn how to do it properly. The backswing is a little shorter than it used to be, I find I can't hit the driver more than about 240 yards, and I am battling an irritatiing tendency to push everything out to the right, but so far it has been fun and I seem to be making progress. There seems to be a lot of useful information and advice here, so I'm looking forward to participating in the forum.

Having been out of the game for nearly ten years, and returning to it aged 59, it's fair to say I've been working on just about everything. However, the two things that are in the forefront of my mind at present are keeping the steady head - I have a tendency to sway slightly, especially with the driver - and tempo. My bad shots are almost always a result of my snatching at the transition, so I'm focussing on giving myself time to change direction before turning on the power.

I agree with the consensus here. Don't spend money on new equipment until you feel you can take a reasonably consistent swing to the pro for a fitting. I came back to the game after a ten-year absence a few months ago. For four months I continued to use my 15 year-old clubs and took regular lessons to get myself back into it - ten years of ageing and a shoulder injury had changed my swing a bit, to say the least. I'd probably hit more than 8000 balls before I felt my new swing had begun to evolve to the point at which it was worth investing in a new set of irons - which I have now done. If I'd gone to get fitted as soon as I came back to the game, I seriously doubt that I could have made an informed choice. In fact, it's arguable that I should have waited longer - but like everyone else, I have a weakness for new stuff...