Why is there still a fear of the Lob Wedge?

[Fourputt]

i personaly find no use to a "lob wedge" the highest i go is 58 and thats even to much sometimes. And as for bounce it should not matter if you have a grinded sole becuase you can change the bounce by tweaking your grip

I bought my 58° X Tour back in September because I was going to be playing a couple of courses which have much faster greens (and more sloped) than my home course. I just had a feeling that it would come in handy. I already have a perfectly good 60° that lives in the spare bag in my garage, but I wasn't even tempted to take it. As it turned out, the 58° was perfect.... it's more forgiving than the 60, but still gives me the opportunity to hit a nice flop shot.

I've found that I go to it more and more as I practice with it and use it in situations on the course. I've even played rounds where I use it for everything around the green for the practice except for bunker shots (I love my CG11, and I don't want to scar up the X Tour). That gives me some good practice "under fire" so to speak. Then at times like last week when I was in jail behind a 20 foot spruce tree I can hit the near full swing flop and lay up over the tree and land it softly on the green. Maybe still a 2 putt, but better than no shot at all. But my "normal" go to club around the green is still my 52° X Tour.

[ozgolfer63]

The simple point that others are making is that if you're going to use a club with often disastrous results or so infrequently that it's basically useless, you may as well get to 14 clubs some other way. Thus, no lob wedge.

Maybe I'm missing the point here but I would have thought that any club that can help your short game, particularly within 20-30 metres of the green should be in your bag regardless of your handicap. I have a gap wedge (52) and a sand/lob wedge (58). My lumberjack type swing isnt really a factor in using these clubs because 95% of the time I'm using these clubs from 50m metres or less of the green. These are the clubs that most golfers use the most frequently, albeit not with a full swing. If I hit 5 out of 7 good chips with my lob wedge and then blade a full shot over the back of the green your telling me to dump my lob wedge??

What you should be telling people is to add as many wedges to their bag as they can, get rid of that hybrid you hit once every 3 rounds and stick in another wedge!!

[tjy355]

...The crux of both arguments center on these two ideas, I think: 1) you don't need a lob wedge because you can and should learn to hit all of your greenside shots with one wedge, either the sand wedge or pitching wedge. 2) learn to use the lob wedge, especially if you are missing a lot of greens, it is an invaluable tool.

While not a lob wedge proponent, I certainly would never advocate the exclusive use any

one club for greenside shots. EVERY shot should be evaluated individually and the type of shot and choice of club should be made only after considering all of the present conditions including the lie of the ball and the distance and terrain between the ball and the hole.

[Fourputt]

Maybe I'm missing the point here but I would have thought that any club that can help your short game, particularly within 20-30 metres of the green should be in your bag regardless of your handicap. I have a gap wedge (52) and a sand/lob wedge (58). My lumberjack type swing isnt really a factor in using these clubs because 95% of the time I'm using these clubs from 50m metres or less of the green. These are the clubs that most golfers use the most frequently, albeit not with a full swing. If I hit 5 out of 7 good chips with my lob wedge and then blade a full shot over the back of the green your telling me to dump my lob wedge??

What Erik was saying is that the LW is NOT a scoring club to a player who doesn't have the time or the inclination to practice it. I've seen more high handicappers carry a LW just because they read something, or saw a tip on TV, not because they really have a clue how to use one. In their hands that club is a detriment to their game, not a boon. Like all facets of the game, it takes practice to be proficient at chipping with a 60° wedge effectively, and for most it takes more practice time for the LW than it does either a PW or 9I. The design simply makes it necessary to be more precise in your ball striking with the higher lofted club than it does with standard wedge. It's a fact that most high handicappers don't practice the short game much, and they simply lack the skills necessary to take advantage of the LW. For those who do practice, then more power to you....

And what is your issue with hybrids? I play the one that I still carry at least 5 or 6 times each round... maybe more than that. I use it for full shots, escape from trouble, tee shots, long chips. Most of the guys I know do the same. It's one of the most versatile clubs in my bag.

[Stacey_E]

I have to ask one question of the thread. This is not meant to be argumentative or sarcastic in anyway. I'm just curious and admittedly ignorant to the facts on this one....

What exactly makes the lob wedge inherently harder to hit?

I find a 7 iron easier to hit than a 5 iron due to the increased loft and shorter shaft. And for me the 9 iron is easier than the 7. Also I'm a steep swinger and find that a steep swing works quite well with a wedge (if you are playing the appropriate bounce on that wedge). You can hit down hard on the ball driving it into the turf and the loft of the club makes the ball jump up quite well.

I just had to ask, without calling out anyone's post specifically, if there was some information I was lacking that would explain why a higher lofted wedge would be harder to hit?

[-BAMA-]

i once hit myself in the head with a lob shot... im more afraid of the ball than i am the wedge itself.

i still play my LW about 12-15 times per 18 holes... and i still flinch a little bit after contact...

[ozgolfer63]

Hello Fourputt
I have no issue with hybrids at all, I carry 3 Callaway heavenwoods (2, 3, 4) luv em. I was trying to make a point regarding "the steep over the top swing" being unsuitable for a lob wedge. I think you'll find that the hybrid has overtaken the lob wedge in the popularity stakes (in the never ending search for distance and accuracy) and unless Im mistaken I'd wager that that "steep over the top swing" that didnt work with your fairway woods is not going to do diddly squat with your hybrid. If you are going to judge the suitability of the lob wedge on the basis of people trying to emulate Phil Mickelson then lets be fair and judge the suitability of the driver for "most" golfers based upon their J B Holmes style mentality.

[zeg]

What exactly makes the lob wedge inherently harder to hit?

I think it's because as you increase loft, the window for clean contact starts getting smaller. If you raise/lower the head a little bit in your swing, you're more likely to miss the sweet spot vertically. This effect rapidly becomes more pronounced above 45deg loft.

Imagine trying to hit with a ridiculously highly lofted club -- say 89deg. If you hit absolutely perfectly, you'll get a nice high shot. If you're off by just a hair over the thickness of your club downward, you'll totally miss under the ball. If you're off upward, you'll get some degree of blade. Since you were swinging for a virtually straight up trajectory, this blade is going to send the ball much much farther than your intended shot. There are probably other factors, but this has been my theory as a major contributor...

[Fourputt]

I think it's because as you increase loft, the window for clean contact starts getting smaller. If you raise/lower the head a little bit in your swing, you're more likely to miss the sweet spot vertically. This effect rapidly becomes more pronounced above 45deg loft.

This is exactly the reason. There is less room for error because there is a smaller area on the clubface that allows solid contact. The more lofted the club, the more precise your ball striking must be to achieve anything close to your goal. A mishit that might cause you to miss the target (either long or short) by 8 feet with a PW would likely result in missing the target by several times as much with the same mishit with a LW. It's just the nature of the beast.

[ozgolfer63]

You cant be serious with these arguments!! So we can all hit our sand wedges (56) without any problems but add 4 degrees of loft and all of a sudden the sweet spot disappears from the clubface?? Hold a lob wedge and a sand wedge (or pitching wedge for that matter) against a golfball and look at the size of the clubhead against the ball. There isnt a smaller area of clubface because as the loft increases so does the size of the clubface and therefore the sweetspot. Not to mention the fact that the chances of making precise contact with the shorter clubs is in large part due to the shorter shaft lengths.

[David in FL]

[QUOTE=ozgolfer63;232715]

If I hit 5 out of 7 good chips with my lob wedge and then blade a full shot over the back of the green your telling me to dump my lob wedge??

QUOTE]

Personally, if I had a club that I only hit well 70% of the time, then I'd reconsider whether that club belonged in my bag.......

But that may just be me.

[Stacey_E]

I think it's because as you increase loft, the window for clean contact starts getting smaller. If you raise/lower the head a little bit in your swing, you're more likely to miss the sweet spot vertically. This effect rapidly becomes more pronounced above 45deg loft.

Good explanation there! To help us visualize this you used the extreme of an 89* wedge. That's a method that usually works. By that I mean it's hard to conceptualize when you imagine a few degrees of change in the face, but by using an extreme example the argument seems to make more sense. Thanks for the input on that one!

So we can all hit our sand wedges (56) without any problems but add 4 degrees of loft and all of a sudden the sweet spot disappears from the clubface

Although I have to agree, it's just 4 more degrees than the SW. And everyone loves the sandwedge.

Personally, if I had a club that I only hit well 70% of the time, then I'd reconsider whether that club belonged in my bag.......

Honestly, I doubt that many mid and high handicappers hit the ball solid more than 70% of the time regardless of the club. That's not to say that they hit terrible shots 30% of the time. There are a lot of shots on the course that fall in between perfect and horrible. And while I don't know the exact stats on this, I'm sure there are many touring pros that don't hit their drivers into the fairway 70% of the time and none of them would consider playing without the driver (well, maybe Mickelson). I know most amateurs, (especially 10s and above) hit their driver well less than 70% of the time. But that's another thread. My point is, that if I pulled out every club that I had bad experiences with, I would have a bag and some balls.

[Fourputt]

You cant be serious with these arguments!! So we can all hit our sand wedges (56) without any problems but add 4 degrees of loft and all of a sudden the sweet spot disappears from the clubface?? Hold a lob wedge and a sand wedge (or pitching wedge for that matter) against a golfball and look at the size of the clubhead against the ball. There isnt a smaller area of clubface because as the loft increases so does the size of the clubface and therefore the sweetspot. Not to mention the fact that the chances of making precise contact with the shorter clubs is in large part due to the shorter shaft lengths.

You are posting yourself as an 8 handicap.

YOU ought to be able to strike the ball pretty consistently. We are talking about guys who play to 15 and up, and those who don't practice this very specialized club. Because of the angle of attack on the ball and the loft of the club, the sweet spot IS effective reduced with a higher lofted club. I'm amazed that a single digit capper can't see that very obvious effect. It's just simple physics. And we DON'T all love our sand wedges. I never use mine for anything BUT bunker shots. I do love it for that, but only that. I have other wedges that take care of the finesse shots from FW and rough, and do it better for me. My SW has 14° of bounce (which is what I like in a SW), and that is great for sand, but hard to deal with in any sort of tight lie, even an ordinary FW lie.

If I hit 5 out of 7 good chips with my lob wedge and then blade a full shot over the back of the green your telling me to dump my lob wedge??

So you are saying that if you only hit 5 out of 8 shots well with a club you wouldn't try to find a better solution?

That's only a 62% success rate, which in my mind is terrible. Darn right I'd dump that club in a heartbeat. In fact, I have... it's called my 60° LW... I do just fine now with a 58°, and that appears to be my personal cutoff point. Yours may be different. Just for the record, I don't advise anyone to "dump" any club. We aren't trying to argue with anyone, just offering advice. I offer what insight I can from observation and personal experience, but everyone is entitled to make their own choices and live with their own mistakes. I simply advise caution in jumping to a difficult club just on the recommendation of someone on an internet forum. High handicappers should learn to use the more user friendly wedges first, then if and when their game and their situation actually requires the addition of a LW, by all means try one. But keep in mind that a LW doesn't have to be 60°... a low bounce 58° like my X Tour will handle 99% of the shots you need a 60° for, but it's just that little bit easier to hit consistently.

[rangerat]

I carry a 60* wedge, use it a lot, have great success with it, love it. In my opinion, I think the "fear" of the club is because it is not as easy to use right out of the gate. People try it and are initially baffled by it and give up on it in a very short time. It does take some practice and gained confidence. I practice with this club more than any other club simply because my back yard is about 85-90 yards; perfect for this club. I play with a guy who has a lower handicap but admits that he lacks confdence with a 60* thus is scared to even try it most of the time. He does carry one but only uses it in what he sees to be the "perfect" situation for the club.

[David in FL]

Honestly, I doubt that many mid and high handicappers hit the ball solid more than 70% of the time regardless of the club. That's not to say that they hit terrible shots 30% of the time. There are a lot of shots on the course that fall in between perfect and horrible. And while I don't know the exact stats on this, I'm sure there are many touring pros that don't hit their drivers into the fairway 70% of the time and none of them would consider playing without the driver (well, maybe Mickelson). I know most amateurs, (especially 10s and above) hit their driver well less than 70% of the time. But that's another thread. My point is, that if I pulled out every club that I had bad experiences with, I would have a bag and some balls.

Note the context. I was responding to a post that talked about blading a ball over the green one or two times out of every 7 shots. While mid to high handicappers may very well do that anyway, if they're using equipment for which their game isn't well suited, they're only exaserbating their problems.......no matter how much they like the equipment in question......and choosing a shot (and club) that's better suited to their skill level will generally improve their scores and handicap. If they choose not to do so, it doesn't hurt my feelings though, I tend to win more matches that way!

[Stacey_E]

Note the context.

Although I didn't directly reference it, I did note the context.

As for the second part I could not agree more. I haven't tried a flop shot during a match in a couple of years. I know the percentages of me pulling the shot off, even without pressure are slim to none. To be honest, I play the percentages around the green a lot. Some of my best par saves this year were by putting with the hybrid. My course can get a little bare in the summer. And when those bare lies turn wet, it's chunk city for a less than perfect wedge. But I know my worst putt with a hybrid, in these conditions, are way better than my worst chips that only move a foot. Yes we need to choose a shot that better suits our skill levels. But for me, sometimes that is a lofted chip with a 64* wedge. If I'm short sided in the rough I know that a low percentage shot for me, at my skill level, would be an opened face sand wedge blast. But a higher percentage shot for me is to just take the 64* and hit down with a preset wrist cock and let the club do the work. But I also admit I have room in the bag for these tools because of my lack of prodigious length; I get no more bag coverage by adding long clubs. But as I said originally...It's not how but how many. And as you basically said, we should all stop trying to pull off shots that aren't in our skill set. That's very sound advice indeed.

[zeg]

You cant be serious with these arguments!! So we can all hit our sand wedges (56) without any problems but add 4 degrees of loft and all of a sudden the sweet spot disappears from the clubface?? Hold a lob wedge and a sand wedge (or pitching wedge for that matter) against a golfball and look at the size of the clubhead against the ball. There isnt a smaller area of clubface because as the loft increases so does the size of the clubface and therefore the sweetspot. Not to mention the fact that the chances of making precise contact with the shorter clubs is in large part due to the shorter shaft lengths.

Well, I don't have a 60deg wedge to compare, but my 56deg SW definitely shows less face to the ball than my PW. A 60deg wedge would have to be about 10% longer in the face than a 56 to have the same projected height, which is possible I guess.

IMO the shaft length shortening is a big reason that a wedge is easier to hit than a 3W, but the difference in length between wedges is pretty minor. I'd be surprised if this makes a whole lot of difference to club head control. It's also been mentioned here (I think), but the higher you expect your trajectory to be, the angrier you are going to be when you hit the ball a little thin. There are many competing effects that will be of different importance to different players. All that said, if you hit the ball well with a club, use it...

[wachesawgolfer]

Do you play on nice turf and lots of grassy rough? If you do, a lob wedge is a must and forgiving with a little practice. If you play on boggy, thin turf ground or hardpan, a lob wedge is not the best club to use off those lies even if you practice a lot with it. It more about course conditions than the club. Some clubs play all year but do not overseed so there is almost no turf by February, we are putting if we can at that point from anywhere around the green. No lob wedges in sight.