So I bought a handicap system membership and the number Im getting seems low to me...

[RocktimusPryme]

Good luck with that.....! Remember, with your handicap, ESC won't let you card more than a double on any hole.

I briefly read a little about that too. I think that depended on the difficulty of the course? I know I saw a chart that said you could card up to a 10 on some courses. That being said there snt much for easy muni courses out here

[mako224]

So I broke 80 for the first time yesterday, and decided to try and do something I had been putting off for a while. Which is establishing a real USGA handicap. I bought a membership to nethandicap.com.

First off what handicap system are you using? Second, you can't just scrounge up some old scorecards off the floor of your car and use them. You need to religiously enter every score no matter how bad moving forward. Third, it takes about 20 scores before your handicap is even close to reliable. Any less than that and a single good score will skew the handicap. Based on what you have said and the scores you mention it is way way too low.........if you were to post those scores on my home course which is a par 70 with a slope of 130 and course rating of 69.6 from the Blue Ts you would have a 13 to 15 handicap index. We use the GHIN handicap system thru the Philadelphia section of the PGA.

[Stacey_E]

First off what handicap system are you using?

That's not true. If you only have 5 scores then the lowest one counts. He isn't playing your course but let’s assume he did.

By entering the 5 scores the lowest one would count. That would be a 78. Then you would subtract the course rating of the blue tees - 69.6. you would get a difference of 8.4. That number would be multiplied by the standard slope for a USGA course (113) and divided by the slope of the course and tees he played (in this example 130). So that's: 78-69.6= 8.4 X 113 = 949.2 / 130 = 7.3 rounded to the nearest tenth. So 7.3 would be his differential if he played your course. Now he would only use the best 1 differential in figuring his handicap since he's only posted 5 scores. So if he were to average his keeper differentials, in this case only one, the average would obviously be ....7.3. Then the final piece of the puzzle would be to multiple the average of the keeper differentials by .96. So that would be 7.3 x .96 = 7.008. All numbers after the tenths are dropped without rounding so that would leave him with a 7.0 handicap at your home course from those tees, not a 13-15. NOW FOR HIS HOME COURSE STATS: 78-68.8 = 9.2 x 113 = 1039.6 / 125 = 8.3168 rounded to 8.3 8.3 x .96 = 7.968 and dropping everything past the tenths that’s.....7.9! So the system you are using is correct. As I said initially the lowest scores are disproportionately represented early on. I'll be the first to admit that it seems like a complicated system. But what makes it more complicated is misinformation by ill informed golfers. I'd highly recommend pouring over the link that ZEG posted earlier. There is a lot of good stuff there. AND YES...haha...Your handicap WILL go up. I know from experience that by the time you get about 10 scores entered you will have a clearer picture of what your handicap actually is. Keep in mind the USGA handicap system is based on measuring your POTENTIAL as a golfer, not your average round. As for Equitable Stroke Control, it is not an issue until you are officially updated and notified of your handicap when the first revisions come out. But after that, to be completely accurate you will need to know how that works. Here is how it is described on the GHIN website. These stats are true regardless of your handicap club/system. By the way a course handicap is the number of strokes you are given on a particular course and may vary from one course to the next. It is from THAT handicap that you decide how many strokes are the maximum you can take on a hole. Q. What is ESC? A. All scores for handicap purposes, including tournament scores, are subject to the application of Equitable Stroke Control (ESC). This mandatory procedure reduces high hole scores for handicap purposes in order to make handicaps more representative of a player's potential ability. A handicap determined from scores to which ESC has not been applied may not be termed a Handicap Index. Course Handicap Maximum Number 9 or less Double Bogey 10-19 7 20-29 8 30-39 9 40 and above 10 Please visit Section 4-3 of the USGA Handicap System manual for further reference.

[RocktimusPryme]

First off what handicap system are you using?

They are all recent score cards and the 99 I put it was the worse Ive shot in months, so I wasnt being generous to myself. And Ive kept track of my stats for a while now because I had been planning to use a handicap system but just hadnt got around to doing it. Breaking 80 out of nowhere sort of motivated me, go figure...

And Im using a site called www.nethandicap.com

[Stacey_E]

I input 5 scores 78, 88, 88, 89, and 99

its not really that tough of a course 68.8 / 125.

TO THE OP

One more thing. You can make an assumption based on the scores you have already. It won't be offical, just an assumption. You will need to post a total of 13 scores before you are counting your 5 lowest differentials. So if you figure the differentials on the 5 scores you have now....you come up with these differentials. 78, 88, 88, 89 & 99 become these differentials: 8.3, 17.4, 17.4, 18.3 & 27.3 If you average those 5 differentials you get 17.74 then multiply that average by .96 you get 17.0 when you drop everything after the tenths. So what does that mean? If you score no better than a 99 by the time you get to 13 scores (or 8 more scores) you know your handicap will be no more than 17.0. Now that is the only assumption you can make for sure and it is obviously not official. But if you go shoot 100+ the next eight times out you will have no worse than a 17.0 by the time you post 13 scores. But something tells me you won't AND CONGRATULATIONS ON BREAKING 80!!!

[mako224]

That's not true. If you only have 5 scores then the lowest one counts. He isn't playing your course but let’s assume he did.

Thats a nice dissertation but I was only speaking in general terms. He stated he normally averages around 90. He also mentions he just broke 80 for the first time and he found some scorecards in his car with scores of 78, 88, 88, 89, and 99. A player in this relm will likely be a 13 to 15 handicap if he were posting his scores at my home course. I was not implying that those 5 scores in the GHIN system would give him a specific handicap.

[Stacey_E]

First off what handicap system are you using?

Thats a nice dissertation but I was only speaking in general terms. He stated he normally averages around 90. He also mentions he just broke 80 for the first time and he found some scorecards in his car with scores of 78, 88, 88, 89, and 99. A player in this relm will likely be a 13 to 15 handicap if he were posting his scores at my home course. I was not implying that those 5 scores in the GHIN system would give him a specific handicap.

Well to be more short winded for you...

Your first assertion was to question the legitimacy of his handicapping system. Your second assertion was to question the recording of his scores. You then went on to make a generalized estimate of what his handicap would be at your course. I'll agree with your third point, 20 scores makes the handicap most accurate. And I think the original post was asking if those 5 scores would give him a handicap of 7.9 at this point in his scoring history, which I proved mathmatically that it would. And finally it takes a dissertation to explain how the USGA handicap system works to a person new to the system. I dare say there are scratch handicappers that have no idea how their handicaps are calculated.

[mako224]

You assumed I was questioning the legitimacy of his handicap system. It was just a question. What's that old saying, something about "Never assume cause you'll wind up looking like......."

Second, if you are going to post scores on a handicap system you have to do it right. It goes back to the integrity of the game. So since you mention it, you're darn right I'm questioning his methodology. Perhaps I should ask about mulligans and putting out as well.

[Stacey_E]

if you are going to post scores on a handicap system you have to do it right. It goes back to the integrity of the game.

I'll agree there as well. You are preaching to the choir on that one.

[RocktimusPryme]

Second, if you are going to post scores on a handicap system you have to do it right. It goes back to the integrity of the game. So since you mention it, you're darn right I'm questioning his methodology. Perhaps I should ask about mulligans and putting out as well.

Im pretty sure I mentioned somewhere in this thread, probably the first post, that I putt everything out, and take correct penaltys. I dont think I mentioned mulligans, but I dont take them, unless its a stipulation in a bet. And in that case I wouldnt post the round. As a matter of fact most rounds when Im gambling I dont really keep a score because I just pick up and concede on holes where i have no chance

[zeg]

Watch that dropping rounds due to concession. There are specific rules about how many holes you can play before you're supposed to estimate the missing holes, and generally on a concession, I think you're supposed to post with the expected number of strokes to hole out.

My guess is that your handicap will be all over the place (between 7 and 17) until you get to 20 posted scores. So enjoy the time in single digits -- my best round ever still hits the cap at 36.4, so I'm quite jealous/impressed

[tjy355]

You assumed I was questioning the legitimacy of his handicap system. It was just a question. What's that old saying, something about "Never assume cause you'll wind up looking like......."

Wondering what is was about his original post that made you question his methodology? When you first join a club and don't have a handicap, how do you get one? You turn in some of your recent scores. Gotta start somewhere. Not everyone keeps all of their old scorecards. Some start with one score. He found 5 scorecards with legitimate scores so he turned them in.

[mako224]

Aren't you supposed to start posting scores from when you join the handicap system moving forward. You don't just find some old scorecards laying around and post them. Would it not then be OK to just make up some scores that he feels fall within his average as well? Of course not.

[RocktimusPryme]

Aren't you supposed to start posting scores from when you join the handicap system moving forward. You don't just find some old scorecards laying around and post them. Would it not then be OK to just make up some scores that he feels fall within his average as well? Of course not.

Dude I play like 4 times a week, none of those cards were more than 10 days old. And I kept them around specifically because I had planned on getting a program like the one I got. I just happen to be a professional procrastinator.

[mako224]

Then why ddn't you say "I posted my most recent scores" Instead you said...

I scrounged some old scorecards off the flooboards of my car. Including the 78 thats now hung on my wall, I input 5 scores 78, 88, 88, 89, and 99 including total putts, gir, and fir.

Sorry but it doesn't pass the smell test. Whatever though.....its your handicap. Can we play for money? I'll even give you a stroke.

[RocktimusPryme]

Mostly because I didnt think I was going to have my intergrity questioned when I was simply asking someone to explain the math of the system to me. I also know Ive mentioned I dont play that well when Im gamlbling somewhere, though it may not have been in this thread. That being said if Im getting 18 strokes yes Ill play.

[Stacey_E]

To the OP...maybe you could keep us updated on how your handicap fluctuates in the first few weeks? I'm not sure how often your handicap is updated though. It might be more like the first few months before you get to see the big picture. Regardless, it might be helpful in explaining to others who have just went on a card what to expect as the scores come in.

[RocktimusPryme]

To the OP...maybe you could keep us updated on how your handicap fluctuates in the first few weeks? I'm not sure how often your handicap is updated though. It might be more like the first few months before you get to see the big picture. Regardless, it might be helpful in explaining to others who have just went on a card what to expect as the scores come in.

its the 15th and the 1st of every month and sure I will. I wanted to get 10 rounds in by the 15th but I think Im gonna come up just short. I shot a 90 yesterday because I putted terrible . Had 21 putts on the front, missed several 4 footers which I dont normally do. Im thinking its going to come in right about 13 or 14 after I get a decent amount of rounds posted. That being said Im more confident in my game now than Ive ever been, Ive been slicing strokes off my average round by alot as of late. So time will tell. I understand where the questions come from, because I play with people all the time, who kick balls out of bad lies and give themselves 3 footers. But Ive always taken care NOT to be one of those people. And it just gets under my skin to be questioned when I know I score properly, but have no real way to prove it. Its an in-defensible position.