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Downhill Par 3s


iacas
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Page 52 of Golf/Aug06 says to take the following clubs on downhill par 3s:

[pre]Elevation
Change
(Feet) Adjustment
20 Same, grip down
30 Drop 1 club
45 Drop 2 clubs, grip down
60 Drop 2 clubs
75 Drop 3 clubs, grip down
90 Drop 3 clubs[/pre]

Shouldn't that say (in order): grip down, drop 1 club, drop 1 and grip down, drop 2, drop 2 and grip down, drop 3?

I mean, maybe I'm being really dumb here... but right now I'm thinking the editor(s) missed this one or something...

Erik J. Barzeski —  I knock a ball. It goes in a gopher hole. 🏌🏼‍♂️
Director of Instruction Golf Evolution • Owner, The Sand Trap .com • AuthorLowest Score Wins
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Then again, the same article also says "You might not expect it, but the ball will roll more once it hits the green on downhill shots" which makes no sense - it'll be coming more "down" than "forward" if the green is lower than you. Balls roll more hitting to an uphill green - they've got a stronger forward vector than a downward vector than they normally would.

WTF?

Erik J. Barzeski —  I knock a ball. It goes in a gopher hole. 🏌🏼‍♂️
Director of Instruction Golf Evolution • Owner, The Sand Trap .com • AuthorLowest Score Wins
Golf Digest "Best Young Teachers in America" 2016-17 & "Best in State" 2017-20 • WNY Section PGA Teacher of the Year 2019 :edel: :true_linkswear:

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The ball will definitely be traveling "more downward" on that kind of shot for the same reason a ball hits flatter on an elevated green.

Jeff Gladchun

In my bag:
Driver: TaylorMade R7 Quad, 9.5°, Aldila NV
3 Wood: Titleist 904F, 15°, YS-6+ StiffIrons: Titleist 695CB 3-PWWedges: Titleist Vokey 252.08, SM56.10 SM60.08Putter: Odyssey White Steel #5 Center-ShaftBall: TaylorMade TP Black / Titleist ProV1xHome Course: Oakland Hills...

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I am also wondering what effect ball trajectory would have. I can hit high or low draws and fades, all of which have a big affect on how quickly a ball stops, how far it flies, etc. Seems to me that club selection table is only meant for someone with exactly the same trajectory and spin with every club? Am I missing something?

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Roy McEvoy is my hero.

In My bag
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Wilson Invex Strong 3 and 5 wood

Maxfli Revolution 3-PW Irons

Cleveland 54/60 wedges

Odessey XG #7 Putter

 

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and it may be just me, but i dont think i would be able to tell the difference between a 70 and 90 foot elevation change...especially if its 200+

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and it may be just me, but i dont think i would be able to tell the difference between a 70 and 90 foot elevation change...especially if its 200+

I agree.

I played a course in Maine last summer called Sugarloaf. It had a par 3, 180 yds with a 160ft elevation change. I was lost on club selection. As my first 6 iron sailed over the pines behind the green looking like it would still be in the air after nightfall, I realized I may have mis-clubbed a bit... Wound up hitting an 8 real easy and catching the center of the green.

****************************************
Roy McEvoy is my hero.

In My bag
TM Burner 9.5 S Flex

Wilson Invex Strong 3 and 5 wood

Maxfli Revolution 3-PW Irons

Cleveland 54/60 wedges

Odessey XG #7 Putter

 

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I agree.

Damn that's impressive! You hit an 8-iron 180 yds!? I hit an 8-Iron (On level grass) about 135. I know there was large elevation change in this shot, but hot damn, that means you're still flying the ball 180.

Driver: 907 D2 10.5 - Diamana Blue 65 Shaft
3-Wood: 906 F4 15.5 - Graphite Design YS-6+ Shaft
5-Wood: 906 F4 18.5 - Diamana Blue 75 Shaft
Irons: Rac TP CB Irons; 5.0 Flighted Rifle Shafts, 1 degree flat.
Wedges: Rac TP Black 52:08; 56:12Putter: Scotty Cameron Studio Select Newport 2 - 35"B...

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Damn that's impressive! You hit an 8-iron 180 yds!? I hit an 8-Iron (On level grass) about 135. I know there was large elevation change in this shot, but hot damn, that means you're still flying the ball 180.

No it doesn't...

No club, not even a pitching wedge, comes down straight on level ground. Even pitching wedges hop forward before the spin grabs and they pull back. Here, I made an image to illustrate. It's not perfect, but it'll give you a general idea.

Erik J. Barzeski —  I knock a ball. It goes in a gopher hole. 🏌🏼‍♂️
Director of Instruction Golf Evolution • Owner, The Sand Trap .com • AuthorLowest Score Wins
Golf Digest "Best Young Teachers in America" 2016-17 & "Best in State" 2017-20 • WNY Section PGA Teacher of the Year 2019 :edel: :true_linkswear:

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The hardest part about downhill par 3's are when the wind is blowing. You may think you can still reach that 180 yard downhill par 3 with an 8 iron, but with a stiff breeze in your face it is going to kill that ball even more than you think.

A cross-wind is even more fun.

Fairways and Greens.

Dave
 

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Erik, I'm no physicist, but I did take physics this year and we studied projectile motion. The ball would approach the second green at more harshly inclined angle than the elevated green (more downward) for a few reasons: the ball would be slowing down due to air resistance and its speed downwards would be increasing because of its prolonged "exposure" to gravity. Those two factors would dictate that (using your graph as an example) the ball would land on the very front of the lower green.

am I missing something?

Jeff Gladchun

In my bag:
Driver: TaylorMade R7 Quad, 9.5°, Aldila NV
3 Wood: Titleist 904F, 15°, YS-6+ StiffIrons: Titleist 695CB 3-PWWedges: Titleist Vokey 252.08, SM56.10 SM60.08Putter: Odyssey White Steel #5 Center-ShaftBall: TaylorMade TP Black / Titleist ProV1xHome Course: Oakland Hills...

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am I missing something?

Yeah, you're missing the fact that I never said it was an exact representation:

It's not perfect, but it'll give you a general idea.

It just demonstrates that the ball carries further forward because it's not dropping straight down, not from an 8-iron or even a pitching wedge. That's all. I never claimed it was a true representation of golf ball flight.

Erik, I'm no physicist, but I did take physics this year and we studied projectile motion. The ball would approach the second green at more harshly inclined angle than the elevated green (more downward) for a few reasons: the ball would be slowing down due to air resistance and its speed downwards would be increasing because of its prolonged "exposure" to gravity. Those two factors would dictate that (using your graph as an example) the ball would land on the very front of the lower green.

On a further (and unrelated) topic, projectile motion doesn't have much to do with a golf ball in flight. High school physics treats projectiles as not having any resistance other than gravity. A golf ball's flight is affected not only by air resistance, but also the spin put on the ball. This prolongs its upward flight.

True (i.e. high school physics) projectiles follow parabolic flight. That's why a 45° launch angle gives you the most distance in high school physics, yet a launch angle of 12 degrees with a spin of 2500 RPM is desired for maximizing driver distance. Specifically, a golf ball in flight looks like:

Erik J. Barzeski —  I knock a ball. It goes in a gopher hole. 🏌🏼‍♂️
Director of Instruction Golf Evolution • Owner, The Sand Trap .com • AuthorLowest Score Wins
Golf Digest "Best Young Teachers in America" 2016-17 & "Best in State" 2017-20 • WNY Section PGA Teacher of the Year 2019 :edel: :true_linkswear:

Check Out: New Topics | TST Blog | Golf Terms | Instructional Content | Analyzr | LSW | Instructional Droplets

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I like all the physics... On level ground, I can stand on an 8 iron and get 150 out of it. I normally play it around 135-140 because I lose accuracy when I swing hard enough to hit it 150. But, if you "hood" the club or hit a low draw with it, you can add about 10% to the yardage. This hold true with almost any club. Just put it back, deloft it and swing away. At least that's what I do when I just refuse to club up.

****************************************
Roy McEvoy is my hero.

In My bag
TM Burner 9.5 S Flex

Wilson Invex Strong 3 and 5 wood

Maxfli Revolution 3-PW Irons

Cleveland 54/60 wedges

Odessey XG #7 Putter

 

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I have hit a 180 8 Iron. Problem was, I was trying to hit it 140 and skulled it over the green into oblivion. Come to think of it, I think I have hit 180 chip shots before.
Driver: 9.5° 905R Stiff Aldila NV 65
3 Wood: 15.° Pro Trajectory 906F4 Stiff Aldila VS Proto Blue
Hybrid: 19.0° 503 H Stiff Dynamic Gold S400
Hybrid: 21.0° Edge C.F.T. Ti Stiff Aldila NVS
Irons: 775cb 4-GW w/S300 Sand Wedge: Vokey 58° Puttter: Laguna Mid-Slant Pro PlatinumBall: ProV1Bag: Li...
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Note: This thread is 6463 days old. We appreciate that you found this thread instead of starting a new one, but if you plan to post here please make sure it's still relevant. If not, please start a new topic. Thank you!

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