Demo Day: 2016 = Free Shaft Upgrades

[WUTiger]

Stonewolf Golf Club, my home course, hosted Callaway, Mizuno and Ping reps for Saturday's demo day.

The big story this year: Several club manufacturers are offering shaft upgrades at no upcharge. Lots of options in drivers and FW, plus quite a few in irons, etc. Some of the more exotic shafts still bring an upcharge, so check to make sure if more $$ is involved.

I had gotten to sample their wares of our three guests in Orlando, so this was follow-up.

For Callaway, I revisited the XR 16 drivers, the Apex irons, and the Mack Daddy and MD3 wedges. The Mack Daddy wedges, with the high toe, give you an extra margin of error when you blast out of really shaggy turf - less likely to scoop under the ball.

I ended up getting the XR 16 Pro driver with the Fuji Speeder 665 Evolution II TS R.flex shaft. The head was 10.5*, set to 1* open to lessen my chances of missing left. I try for a draw, but the regular XR 16 was a draw - or a hook or pull. The Pro version kept me straighter - the TS shaft has a little less torque than my current driver - and the really solid hits went about 15 yards longer than my current RazrFit.

(Callaway lists its various shaft upgrades in its online catalog).

For Mizuno, I focused this time on the JPX irons. I liked the JPX-850 Forged best, but the fitter recommended I go with the regular JPX-850. (Same advice as Orlando). JPX comes with a variety of XP and graphite shafts as standard.

For Ping, I tried out some of the G drivers, the G irons, and the Glider wedges. For G, GMAX and "I" irons, Ping offers six different shafts as standard - no upcharge. On wedges, the Glider SS (standard sole) grind worked best for me on GW and SW. For LW, I would also consider the ES (Eye sole - concave hollowing at mid-sole).

Also, I tried out Ping's reworked Anser putters with True Roll Face inserts, which feature a hollowed out area behind the face's sweetspot which helps keep the putts on line. The Anser Classic has a slot on the sole, and no aiming line. The reworked Anser-2 has no sole slot, and has an aiming line. The Classic felt better inside 15 feet, but the Anser-2 worked better overall, and really moved the ball out on long putts without me having to muscle it.

[newtogolf]

Great post and observations.  

I went to a Demo Day today as well, so rather than start a new thread I thought it would be better to add on to yours, hope it's okay.  Taylor Made, Titleist, Ping, Callaway, Mizuno and Blast were there.  I was mainly there to meet with manufacturer reps and take pictures but the inner club ho in me had to test some clubs too.  

I'd been reading so much about the M2 irons I tried them first, they are rocket launchers.  I hit my AP2 716 5 iron about 175 yards but was hitting the M2 almost 200 yards.  I thought the M2 would be ugly too look at at address but it wasn't as bad as I thought.  The clubs are thick and there is a fair amount of offset but they didn't bother me as much as my old Diablo Edges did.      

I tried out the M2 driver and 3 wood but wasn't that impressed, it looked, felt and performed like previous TM Burner / RocketBallz versions. The M1 woods were pretty impressive.   The driver was pretty forgiving and after a few adjustments to loft and weight I was consistently hitting them over 240 yards.   

From Callaway I gave the Apex Pro 16 irons a try.  Nice irons, felt great but they didn't perform much differently from the AP2's and MP-25's I already own.  I also tried the XR 16 driver but didn't like the sound and the performance wasn't any better than my Great Big Bertha.  

At the Titleist booth I tried the 716 T-MB and 716 CB.  I liked both clubs but the CB was a little less forgiving and shorter than the AP2, maybe one day I'll be good enough to play them.  The T-MB is an interesting iron, it looks like it should be less forgiving but it actually is pretty forgiving and long.  I never tried the T-MB irons when I bought my AP2's because I thought they'd be less forgiving but I'd definitely suggest to someone considering the AP2 to test the T-MB too.

I hit the Ping G driver, which I liked even more than the G30.  My drives went long and straight but I want to compare it head to head against the GBB and M1 before I make a purchase.  I did buy the G 3 wood, I could hit it well off the deck and from a tee though I went with a stiff shaft because the regular shaft wasn't working well with with the way I load the club on my downswing.  

At the end of testing the other clubs I went back to hit the M2 irons some more.  While I was hitting all the other clubs I couldn't stop thinking about those 200 yard shots I was hitting the 5i.  I asked for the 7i to see how I hit that and I was pretty pleased to see I was hitting a 7i the distance i hit my current 5i (175 yards).  I then tested a pitching wedge which was going about 135 - 140 yards, compared to the 120 in my current set.  The ball had a nice high arc and landed with minimal roll out, just what you want from a pitching wedge.  

The M2's are game changers in terms of distance, I just am not sure if there's a benefit to hitting a M2 5 iron 200 yards versus the 4 hybrid I use today.  I'd also have to change the wedges I carry to fill the hole between the M2 A wedge and my current 56* sand wedge.  I'd most likely have to go to a 54* and add a 58* wedge.  

It's fun to watch others react to different clubs and based on the time I spent people watching, the M1 and G drivers seem to be the most popular.  In terms of irons, everyone was getting a fair amount of interest though the M2 seemed to be the one people were embarrassed to try and most impressed by.  Based on what I saw, Callaway is losing some ground back to Taylor Made, seems appending the 16 to all of their club models isn't getting people very excited.  Most people couldn't even tell the difference between the XR and XR 16 woods and irons so I'll be curious to see what their year end numbers look like.  

Mizuno was also less active than I expected.  I know Mizuno isn't well known for their woods and drivers which is what a lot of people were testing but even their irons weren't getting the attention I'd expect.  Most of their models were announced and on sale at the end of last year so it could just people were already familiar with their offerings.    

I spent very little time on the putting grounds as I'm happy with my current putters but Scotty Cameron was the big hit there.  

 

[WUTiger]

@newtogolf,

Glad to have you join in. Good comparisons on your part.

As for the M2 irons, it would be good if you can hit them on a launch monitor - see if you get a consistent 200 yards, or if you have trouble with hot spots on face, leading to distance variance. 

As for TM vs. Callaway, this year Callaway touted its partnership with Boeing and the resulting Speed Step crown and the laminar airflow improvements for the XR 16 driver and woods family. The improvements might have had more impact if they came a year earlier when the XR line got launched.

TM got a boost for the M2 by introducing them the day before the PGA Show demo day in Orlando. @SavvySwede got in a day early and reported on the event.

Callaway likely will get a boost, as will the other OEMs, from the multiple shafts available for no upcharge. This may convince golfers to go ahead and buy a driver, as they're getting basically a custom build with the included options.

Mizuno and Ping move steadily along, adhering to the old rule of two years (or more) for each club model.

[Mr. Desmond]

Always enjoy an equipment thread.

Callaway began the big push for additional no upcharge shafts at least as early as last August with the GBB (19 shafts), which is still, I think their best driver for most golfers because of the perimeter weighting, shaft length is more manageable at 45.5 (not 46), you don't lose much going to 45, and it is slightly higher in headweight than the XR16, which can offer more head feel. It is draw biased in the 10.5 and up, but the APW and opening it up offsets the bias. You can customize  each Callaway driver at callaway.com by going through a purchase and seeing available shafts and the free and upcharge shafts. Online discounters will have lower upcharge fees.

Haven't tried the XR16 but owned the XR and enjoy an adjustable weighted driver.

I think the Callaway CF16 iron is very shaft dependent, it is shorter heel to toe, but the cup face tech really helps on forgiveness and as to having no dead spots on the face - very toe forgiving. I am trying it next month against the PXG at a fitting with more shafts - the Accura i Series and Mitsubishi OT graphites. I tried the CF16 in a liteweight shaft and it was not the best fit, but the feel was forged like soft with a pleasant click, and even with a poor fit the added 20 yards in a 7i was somewhat exciting for an older guy. What you've got to watch with the new distance irons is that they have very low spin and depend more on the higher launch to stop the ball on the green.

Edited April 24, 2016 by Mr. Desmond

[newtogolf]

10 hours ago, WUTiger said:

@newtogolf,

Glad to have you join in. Good comparisons on your part.

As for the M2 irons, it would be good if you can hit them on a launch monitor - see if you get a consistent 200 yards, or if you have trouble with hot spots on face, leading to distance variance. 

As for TM vs. Callaway, this year Callaway touted its partnership with Boeing and the resulting Speed Step crown and the laminar airflow improvements for the XR 16 driver and woods family. The improvements might have had more impact if they came a year earlier when the XR line got launched.

TM got a boost for the M2 by introducing them the day before the PGA Show demo day in Orlando. @SavvySwede got in a day early and reported on the event.

Callaway likely will get a boost, as will the other OEMs, from the multiple shafts available for no upcharge. This may convince golfers to go ahead and buy a driver, as they're getting basically a custom build with the included options.

Mizuno and Ping move steadily along, adhering to the old rule of two years (or more) for each club model.

I plan to hit the M2 irons on a launch monitor this week just out of curiosity.  I'm pretty confident that I'll see 200 yards for 2 reasons, I hit the 5 iron multiple times and the distance was pretty consistent between 190 - 200 yards and that was with using beat up range balls.  The 5i ball flight was higher than my current 5i ball flight, overall the technology in them is pretty impressive.  

I like the Callaway XR16 woods and hybrids, they are a bit longer than the XR they replaced.  I was just sharing what I overheard others saying because they had both XR and XR16 heads and people were confused which was which.  People seem accustomed to Titleist using the same naming convention of the years but aren't used to Callaway and TM doing it.  

The no upcharge shafts are a great value but many golfers (especially mid - high handicappers) don't appreciate the subtle and not so subtle differences in the playing characteristics of different shafts.  They get self conscious and give up on the process too quickly.  They hit a few balls and depending on whether or not they like what they see they either buy the club with the first shaft that looks good or get discouraged and move on to a different driver.  Better players seem more willing to work through the different shafts the manufacturer offers and really appreciate the difference the shaft makes. 

 

2 hours ago, Mr. Desmond said:

Always enjoy an equipment thread.

Callaway began the big push for additional no upcharge shafts at least as early as last August with the GBB (19 shafts), which is still, I think their best driver for most golfers because of the perimeter weighting, shaft length is more manageable at 45.5 (not 46), you don't lose much going to 45, and it is slightly higher in headweight than the XR16, which can offer more head feel. It is draw biased in the 10.5 and up, but the APW and opening it up offsets the bias. You can customize  each Callaway driver at callaway.com by going through a purchase and seeing available shafts and the free and upcharge shafts. Online discounters will have lower upcharge fees.

Haven't tried the XR16 but owned the XR and enjoy an adjustable weighted driver.

I think the Callaway CF16 iron is very shaft dependent, it is shorter heel to toe, but the cup face tech really helps on forgiveness and as to having no dead spots on the face - very toe forgiving. I am trying it next month against the PXG at a fitting with more shafts - the Accura i Series and Mitsubishi OT graphites. I tried the CF16 in a liteweight shaft and it was not the best fit, but the feel was forged like soft with a pleasant click, and even with a poor fit the added 20 yards in a 7i was somewhat exciting for an older guy. What you've got to watch with the new distance irons is that they have very low spin and depend more on the higher launch to stop the ball on the green.

I didn't like how the XR16 driver sounded, the aural feedback between good shots and bad was poor imo.  Performance wise, it wasn't as good as my GBB and given the sound it was just not something I was going to spend a lot of time testing.  The XR imo was a better driver than the XR16 is.  

 I didn't try the CF 16, just the Apex Pro 16 which were supposed to include the cup face tech.  I liked them but I didn't see enough improvement over my AP2's to want to replace them.  

I had hoped Cobra would have been there because I've heard a lot of positive things about their King LTD and LTD Pro drivers and 3 woods, as well as the new King forged irons.  

My wife was pretty relieved that I only came home with a new Ping G 3 wood and a Blast swing analyzer so I didn't have the heart to tell her I'd be testing some irons and drivers this week.