Driver Comparison with Launch Data

[klineka]

I am currently looking for a new driver, currently I have a old Cleveland hibore driver with numerous dents on it. I have never been able to hit it well and definitely was not fitted for it.

Tonight I went to Golf Galaxy to look at some of their used drivers. After hitting a few, I think I have it narrowed down to two, Taylormade R15 and the Taylormade M2 2016 model. 

A couple of specs on each one I hit. The R15 is the 9.5 degree, with the launch angle adjusted to "higher" to help with my lower launch angle. The shaft was speeder 67 X flex.

The M2 is the 10.5 degree, adjusted to the "higher" launch angle, with the 50g Regular flex shaft. 

 

This first one is with the R15. I left every shot in there including the mis hits since those can and do happen when on the course.

 

This next set is with the M2

 

I can see that the total distance is the exact same between them, the M2 carried a little bit further on average, but if I take out the really bad drives, the ones that carried less than 200, then the R15 averaged 222 and the M2 averaged 225 so not really that much difference. I don't really know what to look for in the other numbers like the launch angle and spin rate which is why I am posting these here. Both of these looked good when I was hitting them, and I felt confident hitting both. Based on the information above, would I be better off with one of these vs. the other, or is it a toss up? Based on my swing speed should I try to find and test a M2 in a stiff flex shaft instead of the regular, or would that not matter too much at my handicap level (roughly 18)? Price isn't too much of a factor, the R15's around around $150 and the M2's are around $200 based on the quick searches I have done so far. 

 

[saevel25]

You might want to watch out on that launch angle. For your swing speed it is way too low. You probably want something near 14-16 degrees if launch and spin rates in the low 2000's.

You should be able to carry the ball near 240 yards with a ball speed at 140 mph. 

[klineka]

1 hour ago, saevel25 said:

You might want to watch out on that launch angle. For your swing speed it is way too low. You probably want something near 14-16 degrees if launch and spin rates in the low 2000's.

You should be able to carry the ball near 240 yards with a ball speed at 140 mph. 

Ok thanks that is helpful, would increasing the launch angle come as a result of me increasing my angle of attack and hitting up on the ball? I always have had a very low ball flight with my current driver but I never really knew how to fix it. That is why I adjusted both drivers to the "higher" launch setting. 

The m2 definitely had a higher launch angle, it looks like the last swing with the m2 was pretty close to the numbers you stated, 235 carry, 14.6 launch angle and 2500 spin.

The highest launch angle with the r15 was only 12, with most being 6-8 degrees. 

Would the shaft have had an impact on the launch angle or is it mainly the angle of attack and club loft that determine launch angle?

Edited March 1, 2017 by klineka

[saevel25]

5 minutes ago, klineka said:

Ok thanks that is helpful, would increasing the launch angle come as a result of me increasing my angle of attack and hitting up on the ball?

That and how you are fitted for the club. 

[klineka]

@saevel25 and others that might see this, I have been looking into the R15 more, right now I am thinking about getting the 12 degree model with a stiff shaft. I think the stiff shaft and the higher club angle should help increase the launch angle. If I find that the ball has too much spin or is launching too high with the 12, I could adjust it down to like 10, correct? Or would I be better off getting the 10.5 and adjusting that up to 12 for the time being as I work on getting a more upward AoA?

[saevel25]

7 hours ago, klineka said:

@saevel25 and others that might see this, I have been looking into the R15 more, right now I am thinking about getting the 12 degree model with a stiff shaft. I think the stiff shaft and the higher club angle should help increase the launch angle. If I find that the ball has too much spin or is launching too high with the 12, I could adjust it down to like 10, correct? Or would I be better off getting the 10.5 and adjusting that up to 12 for the time being as I work on getting a more upward AoA?

It's tough to raise the launch angle and maintain lower spin with out hitting up on the ball. If you hit down you will end up either going with mid launch and higher spin or lower launch and lower spin. It is tough to fit high launch and lower spin with a descending angle of attack. 

[1badbadger]

I've looked at your launch numbers @klineka, and I might be able to provide some insight...

One thing that may be affecting your launch is your current driver.  You mentioned that you have been playing a Cleveland Hi-Bore, correct?  The Hi-Bore was designed a little different than other drivers.  The sweet spot was in the middle of the face where most players naturally try to hit the ball. Most modern drivers though, including the models that you tested, work best when the ball is hit just above the center of the face.  Hitting the Hi Bore slightly above center produced horrible results...ballooning shots that spun too much and went nowhere...

If you were hitting the R15 and M2 in the middle of the face, the ball will launch lower than optimum.  Hitting it slightly higher on the face will improve your launch angle and ball speed.

I understand your line of thinking about keeping all the shots because on the course we don't always hit it perfect, but in a test like this mishits will just skew the averages, so I would not factor those in (like shot #10 with the R15 for example).

A couple of things that are a little strange....you hit quite a few shots with both drivers, and your swing speed varied between 97-106 mph.  Yet your efficiency ratings (smash factor) was exactly 1.40 on every shot.  This doesn't seem right.  Obviously shot #10 with the R15 that was launched at 2.1* was a mishit, so I would expect the efficiency rating to be lower on that shot, but it was the same as shots that you launched at 11*. Or 6*.  It sticks out like a sore thumb to me.  The other thing I'm curious about is why the "club setting" shows hybrid.  I have a feeling this might be related to the efficiency rating issue. Let's put this part aside for now.

One thing to be careful of when looking at launch numbers is that the averages can be misleading.  A perfect example is the "yards offline" category.   The average is exactly the same, so on first glance it appears you hit both clubs just as straight, but if you start looking at the individual shots it becomes very obvious you hit the R15 much straighter.  Remember, the way these numbers are displayed, a shot 40 yards offline to the right and a shot 40 yards offline to the left for example will average out to 0!  So just looking at the average shows the driver as being straight, when actually those 2 shots were 80 yards apart!!!  This is an example...I'm not referring to specific shots that you hit for that.  Getting back to your actual data, you had 7 shots with the R15 that were 11 yards or less offline, with the highest being 39.  Every shot with the M2 was at least 11 yards offline with 6 shots 39 or more and a high of 52.  The bottom line is you really averaged 14 yards offline with the R15 and 29.5 with the M2.

I liked your spin rates with the R15 better too.  The M2 produced more shots with spin over 3000 rpms than the R15 which is higher than I like to see.

There is no question that the R15 produced better results, and I think if you can focus on hitting the ball just a little above center the performance would be even better.  

Hope this helps!

 

[klineka]

7 hours ago, 1badbadger said:

 

If you were hitting the R15 and M2 in the middle of the face, the ball will launch lower than optimum.  Hitting it slightly higher on the face will improve your launch angle and ball speed.

I understand your line of thinking about keeping all the shots because on the course we don't always hit it perfect, but in a test like this mishits will just skew the averages, so I would not factor those in (like shot #10 with the R15 for example).

A couple of things that are a little strange....you hit quite a few shots with both drivers, and your swing speed varied between 97-106 mph.  Yet your efficiency ratings (smash factor) was exactly 1.40 on every shot.  This doesn't seem right.  Obviously shot #10 with the R15 that was launched at 2.1* was a mishit, so I would expect the efficiency rating to be lower on that shot, but it was the same as shots that you launched at 11*. Or 6*.  It sticks out like a sore thumb to me.  The other thing I'm curious about is why the "club setting" shows hybrid.  I have a feeling this might be related to the efficiency rating issue. Let's put this part aside for now.

I think the club selection was hybrid just from what the previous person using the monitor before me had. Interesting enough, on shot #10 with the R15, if you take the ball speed 139.5 divided by the 99.6 clubhead speed, the smash factor is 1.4006. Any of the other shots I did the math on were all around 1.399 or 1.400. Weird. I do know the machine is capable of reading different numbers though because a month or so ago when I was testing out for a 3 wood, the smash factor was slightly lower, 1.36.

Quote

Getting back to your actual data, you had 7 shots with the R15 that were 11 yards or less offline, with the highest being 39.  Every shot with the M2 was at least 11 yards offline with 6 shots 39 or more and a high of 52.  The bottom line is you really averaged 14 yards offline with the R15 and 29.5 with the M2.

I liked your spin rates with the R15 better too.  The M2 produced more shots with spin over 3000 rpms than the R15 which is higher than I like to see.

There is no question that the R15 produced better results, and I think if you can focus on hitting the ball just a little above center the performance would be even better.  

Hope this helps!

 

Great points regarding the R15  and the dispersion shot patterns.

Yesterday I found a used R1 driver with the oban kiyoshi white shaft that was an upgraded shaft option for the R1 on craigslist and it is about half the price compared to the R15, so I think for right now I am leaning towards the R1, even though I havent hit it before, the ability to have the loft be anywhere from 8-12 is nice and the shaft is supposed to be excellent as well. Any thoughts on the R1/oban kiyoshi shaft?

Edited March 2, 2017 by klineka