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The One- and Two-Plane Golf Swings, by Jim Hardy

post #1 of 84
Thread Starter 
Discuss the one- and two-plane golf swing, as popularized by Jim Hardy.
post #2 of 84

Re: The One- and Two-Plane Golf Swings, by Jim Hardy

I like the 1-plane swing. Simple and repeatable under pressure. Definitely helps with consistency of golf shots and results.

If it;s good enough for Anthony Kim to win 2 tournaments with, then it;s certainly good enough for me.
post #3 of 84

Re: The One- and Two-Plane Golf Swings, by Jim Hardy

are you sure that a.k. is using a one plane swing??? Most 1-plane swing guys have shorter swings (not so much width) and you can plainly tell with anthony's swing is he has lots of width. He has a swing that looks alot like tiger's and paul casey's.
post #4 of 84

Re: The One- and Two-Plane Golf Swings, by Jim Hardy

I'm 100% positive. CBS broadcast had a video yesterday showing how his plane was the same at address, on the backswing, and the followthrough.

Shorter swings do not mean less width as you stated. You can have a 1-plane swing with maximum width. It's all about how you position your hands and how straight you keep your left arm during the swing.

AK gets great width on his swing and a moderately long swing (great rotation of his shoulders during the backswing while keeping his hips still).

Go to youtube and look at his swing videos. You'll see what I'm talking about.

By the way, I agree with Mark O'Meara: AK has a much better swing than Tiger Woods. Better mechanics.
post #5 of 84

Re: The One- and Two-Plane Golf Swings, by Jim Hardy

Originally Posted by rogerhuang View Post
I'm 100% positive. CBS broadcast had a video yesterday showing how his plane was the same at address, on the backswing, and the followthrough.

Shorter swings do not mean less width as you stated. You can have a 1-plane swing with maximum width. It's all about how you position your hands and how straight you keep your left arm during the swing.

AK gets great width on his swing and a moderately long swing (great rotation of his shoulders during the backswing while keeping his hips still).

Go to youtube and look at his swing videos. You'll see what I'm talking about.

By the way, I agree with Mark O'Meara: AK has a much better swing than Tiger Woods. Better mechanics.
From what I remember from Hardy's book and DVDs, doesn't the left arm (for right handed golfers) fold out a foot or so after the impact position, chicken wing style?
post #6 of 84

Re: The One- and Two-Plane Golf Swings, by Jim Hardy

I happened upon Jim Hardy totally by accident really.When I took up golf about a year ago,I was interested in making it simple as I play a lot of tennis,I was aware of the pitfalls of tinkering all the time with strokes.

It first started with watching vids of Mike LaBauve,and I got on really well with the style of swing.Anyway got caught up in adding elements I didn't need.Lost my ballstriking for a few months.I decided to buy the book as a constant reference,and all I can say is it's awesome.

First round out,and practice at the range firing 6 irons out of the middle.If particulary you're looking for that one plane action then this book is for you.Don't know about those with the more conventional upright plane,but I bought specifically for the flatter swing action.

I'm shaving strokes every round,in part because of the simplicity of the action,but also because of the confidence that I can hit straight.

The instruction is easy to follow even if your knowledge isn't that great.Could do with more pictures,but the instruction is so simple it really does not matter.Nothing on the short game which is a shame,but I only need Mike's videos for that.
post #7 of 84

Re: The One- and Two-Plane Golf Swings, by Jim Hardy

What I meant to say is that anthony kim doesn't have a conventional "jim hardy" oneplane swing. He teaches that you bend the right arm right at the takeaway and fold the left on the follow through. That's obviously not what anthony does in his swing.
post #8 of 84

Re: The One- and Two-Plane Golf Swings, by Jim Hardy

Originally Posted by sc golfer View Post
What I meant to say is that anthony kim doesn't have a conventional "jim hardy" oneplane swing. He teaches that you bend the right arm right at the takeaway and fold the left on the follow through. That's obviously not what anthony does in his swing.
I agree sc golfer. After reviewing the Swing Vision clips, it appears to me that AK is on a second plane at the top. His right elbow is tucked down and close to his right side. Whereas in a OPS, the right elbow folds outwards during the back swing, chicken wing style. I think Hardy calls this the sawing motion, where he wants to golfer to move the right arm as though he/she were pulling a hand saw out of the cut.

AK also initiates his downswing by unwinding the lower body. This pulls down and lowers his club to the first plane. OP swingers initiate the DS with their shoulders, and keep turning them down and around, staying on a single plane throughout.

On the follow through side, the OP swinger folds his/her left elbow out much the same way they did with the right elbow during the backs wing. Their arms don't roll/flip over like AK's.
post #9 of 84

Re: The One- and Two-Plane Golf Swings, by Jim Hardy

According to Travis Foulton (PGA) A.K. is 100% one plane !

regards,
post #10 of 84

Re: The One- and Two-Plane Golf Swings, by Jim Hardy

Originally Posted by mm6840 View Post
According to Travis Foulton (PGA) A.K. is 100% one plane !

regards,
If you don't mind, could you provide a reference to this claim? From what I've found in regards to Foulton's analysis of AK's swing is that it is perfectly on plane when he is releasing the club's lag through the impact area. But no mention of AK swinging on a single plane through out the entire swing.

Thanks,

Mark
post #11 of 84

Re: The One- and Two-Plane Golf Swings, by Jim Hardy

Originally Posted by eatmybologna View Post
If you don't mind, could you provide a reference to this claim? From what I've found in regards to Foulton's analysis of AK's swing is that it is perfectly on plane when he is releasing the club's lag through the impact area. But no mention of AK swinging on a single plane through out the entire swing.

Thanks,

Mark
Attachment from www.pgatour.com

Quote "When I watch Kim hit a ball, the first thing that comes to mind his how perfectly on-plane his swing is throughout the entire motion. The geometry of Kim's swing is about as simple as it gets. This simplicity allows him to get a lot out of his game in all areas." from http://www.pgatour.com/2008/tourlife...ton/index.html


regards,
post #12 of 84

Re: The One- and Two-Plane Golf Swings, by Jim Hardy

I guess there are different approaches or methods of employing a one plane swing. It doesn't look like he's using Hardy's approach, but I tend to agree with you now that I look at it a little more closely. AK does lift up his club off plane some when going to the top. But he gets back down on it very quickly during the transition, but does appear to use active arms/hands in doing so.

mm6840, thanks for pointing this out to me,

Mark :)
post #13 of 84

Re: The One- and Two-Plane Golf Swings, by Jim Hardy

Originally Posted by rogerhuang View Post
I like the 1-plane swing. Simple and repeatable under pressure. Definitely helps with consistency of golf shots and results.

If it;s good enough for Anthony Kim to win 2 tournaments with, then it;s certainly good enough for me.
I like the 1 plane swing. It is easier to repeat. However, a more significant swing approach is the LAWs of the Golf Swing, based upon body type.

The 1 plane swing is the same as the Leverage swing.
post #14 of 84

Re: The One- and Two-Plane Golf Swings, by Jim Hardy

I've found Hardy's book (and DVD's) very helpful in understanding the golf swing and variations. I also found it useful when evaluating 'tips' people give and the types of instruction available.

I don't completely agree that everyone is either a 1 or 2 planer - there are a lot of hybrids out there. The closer you are to a 1-planer, the more the 1 plane drills will help. There are also many variations of 1 plane swing out there (many consider the stack and tilt a variation, for example). The big thing to look for is whether the shoulders turn on nearly the same plane as the club. How do you tell if you're a 1 planer or two planer? The simplest way is to determine how upright you stand at address. Hold a club out from your chest, 90 deg from your spine angle. If it points within a few feet of the ball (48" according to Hardy), you would benefit from the 1 plane techniques and exercises.

Another tell is how high you take your club on the backswing - if you put your left arm much above your right shoulder (for a RH swing), you're in 2-plane territory. If you have an upright stance (standard for 2 plane swing), but don't raise your arm above shoulder level, you'll be swinging flat. If you are more bent over but raise your arm too far above your should line, you'll be coming over the top. This is where it's really useful to know the differences between the swings. Next time you're at the range or on the course, watch other people swing with this in mind and you'll start to see the difference. One thing to point out is that people can be successful at golf using either swing.

The book isn't very expensive and can really help understand the swing types. Definitely recommended!

As to AK - he's tough to categorize. If you watch his driver swing, he looks 1 plane all the way. Then watch him swing an iron, and he's looking more like a 2 planer. That's the luxury of playing golf for a living - the ability to use different swings for different clubs! He also may be keeping a more constant spine angle and adjusting his arms based on club length. In either case, I'm looking forward to watching his golf more in the future.
post #15 of 84

Re: The One- and Two-Plane Golf Swings, by Jim Hardy

The repeating swing is the one that wins tournaments. If you can repeat a 1 plane, fine. If you can repeat a 2 plane, great. The point is is that there is the option for which works better for you as the golfer. Anthony Kim uses the one, a much simpler and easy to duplicate motion. He has won his first and second tournaments this year. Practice is the only thing that can breed consistency and can start to make you play better. Heck, you can start swinging the wrong direction long enough to get good at the game (i.e. Phil Mickelson). I can honestly say that I have the video and have studied it thoroughly, but what has gotten me to 3.8 and dropping at only 16 is practice and repetition.
post #16 of 84

Re: The One- and Two-Plane Golf Swings, by Jim Hardy

I may be mistaken, but when I read Hardy's book and his description of the 1-plane swing it did not mean the swing stayed on the same plane. The difference was if you swing around your body on a similar plane to your shoulder turn, like Hogan and most other pros, you are a 1-planer. If you swing your arms on an entirely different plane, i.e. Nicklaus, Montgomery, you are a 2-planer. Also, many golfers mix the parts of each type and that reduces consistency. Am I wrong?
post #17 of 84

Re: The One- and Two-Plane Golf Swings, by Jim Hardy

You are correct - in the one plane swing, the swing plane of the club is nearly the same as the plane of the shoulders. In a two plane, the should turn flatter. Many golfers use a mix of both techniques. Hardy's point is that depending on which way you swing, different drills will help you become more consistent. Neither way is better or worse - though he says the one plane tends to be more repeatable. I don't personally know if this is true or not.

Also, as YGP said, the real key is that your swing is repeatable and consistent.
post #18 of 84

Re: The One- and Two-Plane Golf Swings, by Jim Hardy

I think it's interesting in the book itself,that Jacobsen and Hardy look different at address.Jacobsen isn't even in the same ball park regarding his posture.Hardy has way more bend in his spine and he worked with Jacobsen.

I think there are still individual facets to a persons swing that don't conform,like the tempo of a swing,angle of plane,the arc that describes the path of the club,these tend have an individual look to them depending on each golfer,but as long as you apply the fundementals of what Hardy is talking about,you can have a higher percentage of one plane moves in your swing.

Still peoples swings will still not look exactly alike put side by side.

I have found in my quest to swing flatter,that just stopping any weight shift into my back leg,I achieve incredible compression and much straighter ball flight.Even the smallest of weight shifts into the back leg cause fat contacts and thin with early releases due to being behind the ball on the way back.
Allow your body to find it's way,but follow the fundementals,and you can be a one planer or a two plane if you wish,but looking exactly like Hardy himself swinging a club isn't really required.Just be as pure as you can.
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