Broken Window

[JTMalley]

Hurley, I think what we are all saying is people know risks when they do things. If I make sweet love to a sweet crack ***** from the bronx and don't wear a condom, I should not be surprised when it burns a litte bit.

If I were to buy a house next to a golf course or in a flood zone or next to a baseball park or under a volcano, I would make sure to understand the risks before.

Your car example is flawed because you say your just going to drive around and hit people. As golfer's we dont try to hit the house or the window. But yes we all have the risk of getting damage or causing damage to cars when we drive... That is why we all need to have car insurance. In Fla it is required.

As far as hitting a kid, if you know your backyard is about 5 feet next to the fairway, would you let your kid run around outside?

[BigAl5150]

Several courses I have played at have a sign designating that the golfer is responsible for the actions caused by their shot but I think that is more to get the course from having to pay or be part of any suit derived from any broken windows, etc. Typically one's homeowner insurance would pay for the window minus any deductible but I'm sure those homeowners living next to golf courses pay a higher rate (or have a higher deductible) due to living next to a golf course.

Some reading from the legal and insurance side:

Here

Here

Not really about broken windows but amusing nonetheless.

[JTMalley]

The links provide some good reads... it is a very very grey area in the law. I can see all sides and points of view. I also read that living next to a golf course does not increase your insurance rates. I also read a quote from an All State Agent saying, "We (the insurance company) believes the golfer should pay. If he doesn't then we will pay." This tells me that the insurance companies will pay but like all companies just dont really want to!

[allin]

  NM Golf said:

I actually know the answer to this one, its the golfer who is liable for any and all damage he causes during a round. I know this from working at a golf course. Yes, the home was built on a golf course that doesn't mean they are taking on the expectation that someone will smash their window with a ball anymore than someone whose car gets hit should expect that to happen because they drove by a golf course.

This is correct, there have been exceptions, based on the argument that the developer failed to properly plan for this by placement of homes to close to the course or at a dogleg where the second shot would normally try to cut the corner, usually the homeowner is the one suing the developer not the golfer in this case. Many times the golfers homeowners policies does cover this. I nailed a car years ago and mine paid.

[sonicblue]

  hurley9192 said:

are some of you kidding? Bad golfer launches a ball through a house and you think the homeowner should pay because he lives there!?!?!? What if his kid is playing there and you launch a banana slice into their yard and hurt their child? Tough luck kid...it's your dad's fault for living here. I can't believe what I've seen here...unless it is stated otherwise, if you hit a shot that damages something, it is your responsibility to inform the owner or at a minimum the course, and pay for damages.

Be reasonable. No one has said that a golfer should go out, aiming to cut corners, closing their eyes and launching tee shots wherever they feel like it.

To use your analogy, though, yes, we all maintain insurance on ours cars because there is a risk that WE are taking by putting them on the road. For "true" accidents, our insurance pays. When someone ELSE is reckless, they pay. Same for a golfer. If you make a completely reasonable and modest mistake that ANY golfer may make, house windows can be casualties. Do something stupidly risky and negligent, you pay up.

[hurley9192]

so, if I'm driving along and I cause an accident because of some unforeseen circumstance, I shouldn't have to pay?

Also, what about someone walking by a golf course, or driving by one? If they get hit, is it their fault for taking the risk to bear near a golf course?

I'm sorry, if you hit a shot and it damages someone else's property, you should pay up. Don't ask to have an insurance company or someone else bail you out.

[JTMalley]

People insure property incase things happen. Business requires liability insurance, Cars have to have car insurance. McDonalds was lible for making coffee too hot. Foul balls are going to happen in baseball, and bad shots are going to be in golf. If you can avoid risk, one should. People want to live on a golf course, they have to accept the risk. I live in Florida in a hurricane zone. I will have to pay the higher home insurance because I choose to live in a Hurricane zone. The tradeoff, I enjoy year round golf.

[TourSpoon]

  JTMalley said:

Your car example is flawed because you say your just going to drive around and hit people. As golfer's we dont try to hit the house or the window. But yes we all have the risk of getting damage or causing damage to cars when we drive... That is why we all need to have car insurance. In Fla it is required.

Actually this example is flawed. Haven't you heard our new slogan, "Welcome to South Florida, home of the unisured motorist". Better bone up on that coverage while you are at it. While auto insurance is required, there is nothing to prevent you from driving without it unless you are law abiding good folks like us on the forums.

[JTMalley]

This is true... I should know because I use the same arguement about Gun Control with my parents and how if we ban guns, only the bad guys will have them.

Tu Che!!!

[TourSpoon]

  JTMalley said:

This is true... I should know because I use the same arguement about Gun Control with my parents and how if we ban guns, only the bad guys will have them.

Yep...

You are getting a lot of mileage out of this thread.

[Raidermatt]

  hurley9192 said:

so, if I'm driving along and I cause an accident because of some unforeseen circumstance, I shouldn't have to pay?

If you throw yourself in front of a moving car is it the motorists fault if he hits you?

"Cause" is the key word. Mr. Three Putt makes a good point that it sometimes is going to depend on the circumstances. Maybe it's because of the ridiculous home values in this area, but it seems many developers are putting the houses WAY to close to the course to reasonably expect them not to get hit quite a bit. I know if it's my property I expect people to take reasonable care not to damage it, but at the same time, I have a reasonable responsibility to keep it out of harm's way. That's the way I look at it anyway.

[Divot]

I can see both sides...live on the side of a fairway, you should expect to be hit. However, on the other hand, if you are playing a course where there are houses on the side of the fairway, you should take serious note and play accordingly. Sort of like skiing down the bunny slope versus the diamond run...you just know the course with houses will present additional risk and you are responsible.

[Three Putt]

  Three Putt said:

Been on both sides of the ball....or er...window.

I guess I will reply to my own rant......

Here goes... If it is on a par 4 or 5 with houses definetly in play on the second shot ...I say tough luck to the homeowners, even though I would leave a note and pay (that's why i don't like playing house lined courses) but... if it is a par 3 that takes a terrible shot from the blue or champ tees..pay up man (or woman)!!!!

[bwmgolfer]

I used to live on a golf course and someone hit the ball through our window and we had to pay for it!!!!!

[jwnolefan]

Years ago I was playing a course in FL and I hooked one into someone's backyard and through their screened patio. Not only were they home, they were on the patio... The guy comes storming out onto the course and confronts us up near the green and starts yelling "Every time one of you hit one through my screen, it costs me $200 to get it fixed. Do you think that's fair?" I told him " No, I think you are getting ripped off. Screen isn't nearly that expensive." and walked away.

[Chilidipper]

If you don't want your house to get hit by a golf ball don't build it on a golf course.

[Chilidipper]

  jwnolefan said:

Years ago I was playing a course in FL and I hooked one into someone's backyard and through their screened patio. Not only were they home, they were on the patio... The guy comes storming out onto the course and confronts us up near the green and starts yelling "Every time one of you hit one through my screen, it costs me $200 to get it fixed. Do you think that's fair?" I told him " No, I think you are getting ripped off. Screen isn't nearly that expensive." and walked away.

All they can do is bark. My bud snap hooked one into the siding of a home on a golf course. The guy just looked up and looked back down. Now thats how you handle that. If he decided to come out I would of said the samething. As far as those signs saying the golfer is responsible that's just the trying to freak you out. It's the same as if a landlord has you sign a contract saying if there is owner neglect you can't sue him. It's a joke and won't hold up in court. Infact by the time they sue you it would of cost them more money than to replace it themselves.

[tiger_who]

what would happen if you hit a ball into the club house or pro shop at my course the clubhouse is right on the 18th like 1m past the rough