Swinging Correctly

[cockergod]

I had a quick question on how people swing. I wanted to know if you should use more of your arms to strike the ball or more with your body. I know that when I keep my arms and body moving at the same speed together, I get good ball contact. On the other hand when I use more of my arms I seems to hit the ball thin to much. Thanks any kind of tips will help. I am brand new to golf.

[klaymon]

I'm finding I am more of a body swinger. I hit thin quite a bit if I forget to get my shoulders involved in the swing. I also generate a lot more power when I use my shoulders. I can add 15 yards or so to any given iron by putting my body into it. The sensation I go for is that I start with my shoulders and let my arms trail along behind.

[cockergod]

Any other comments? Thanks.

[Dent]

I rely alot on body, for me its all in the hips. I really uncoil and unleash power from the midsection of my body.

[thedub]

i agree...i'd say body is the key

[tm22721]

I am less consistent when I use my arms/hands to initiate the downswing.

My swing must initiate with an aggressive weight shift to my left leg as the club reaches the top. The correct sensation is that my left side is being stretched taut as the weight settles onto my left foot (left shoulder rises, right shoulder drops).

My weight transfer must be completed by the time of impact .

[elchene]

I begin the backswing by initiating with my chest and shoulders. I begin my downswing by turning my hips. The arms pretty much take a free ride.

[allin]

I don't have a strong opinion on this but it is an often repeated truism. I have heard many times that the arms and shoulders turn the body on the backswing and the body turns the arms and shoulders on the down swing. I do believe that concentrating on maintaining a feeling of freedom in your shoulders as you swing is crucial for maximum distance. Extra effort causes tension in the shoulders and can cause things to get out of sequence, for me the arms take over and hello hook.

[Avid Golfer]

I had a quick question on how people swing. I wanted to know if you should use more of your arms to strike the ball or more with your body. I know that when I keep my arms and body moving at the same speed together, I get good ball contact. On the other hand when I use more of my arms I seems to hit the ball thin to much. Thanks any kind of tips will help. I am brand new to golf.

Like you I preform best (hitting both long and accurate) when I feel like my arms and body move in sync, and I think if you look at pros you'll see that their arms and upper body move in synch both in the back and down swings. Like many tour pros have said in the past I feel as my body moves, and the arms go along for the ride.

That being said there is no wrong or right when it comes to feel. What a player feels and what is actually happening can be two different things. Trevor Immelman and Mark Omera have said they feel like the arms start down first, but as Immelman says in an article he wrote (linked below) that isn't what is showing in the picture: http://www.golftoday.co.uk/proshop/f...reaction_7.jpg Pros with arms and body in sync: Back swing (look at the upper arm position relative to the chest): http://img165.imageshack.us/img165/2...odysynczh7.jpg Then here is the same golfers coming down and going through (the upper arms and elbows aren't being left behind, but are instead right with the chest moving in sync): http://img266.imageshack.us/img266/9...yncdownct5.jpg

[LastPrankster]

I used to block my shots off when I would start with my hips, resulting in a slice. Now I rely more on my arms and hands, it keeps my arms from getting too far behind.

[cockergod]

Thanks everyone for all the help. If anyone else would like to chime in that would be great too.

[MPS67]

That being said there is no wrong or right when it comes to feel. What a player feels and what is actually happening can be two different things. Trevor Immelman and Mark Omera have said they feel like the arms start down first, but as Immelman says in an article he wrote (linked below) that isn't what is showing in the picture:

I used to block my shots off when I would start with my hips, resulting in a slice. Now I rely more on my arms and hands, it keeps my arms from getting too far behind.

I'm having the problem of leaving my arms behind during the downswing because of the hip bump at the start. I'm told that my shoulders don't synchronize with my hips at impact where my hips are about 45 degrees open, but my shoulders are only 15 degrees. I read that Trevor Immelman likes to swing down with his arms first. Do I need to complement my hip bump and rotation by swinging with my arms? But then I thought that I'm to keep my arms and hands passive and let them go for a ride. What am I missing here?

Thanks, Mark

[LastPrankster]

I'm having the problem of leaving my arms behind during the downswing because of the hip bump at the start. I'm told that my shoulders don't synchronize with my hips at impact where my hips are about 45 degrees open, but my shoulders are only 15 degrees. I read that Trevor Immelman likes to swing down with his arms first. Do I need to complement my hip bump and rotation by swinging with my arms? But then I thought that I'm to keep my arms and hands passive and let them go for a ride. What am I missing here?

I have learned that you need to start with your arms on the downswing, to synchronize your swing. However, most pros start with their hips, to one fight a hook and two add a lot of power.

[MPS67]

I have learned that you need to start with your arms on the downswing, to synchronize your swing.

That's what's so confusing to me. I'm probably looking at this whole thing wrong, but how does one keeps the arms synchronized while swinging with the lower body? Doesn't arm action come into play to prevent them from lagging behind too much? I tend to think that you're correct LastPrankster, but my golf instructor over at Golftec says that I'm incorrectly using my arms when I try to synchronize the connection triangle on the downswing. Unfortunately, when I ask him to elaborate, he won't, and only gives me new drills to work on the issue. One drill he gave me is to keep knee flex and separation on the back swing. Thus helping maintain level hips to the top and a stable lower body base. But I continue to misunderstand this portion of the swing.

[MPS67]

I recently review one of Steve Bishop's videos over at The Gateway to Better Golf . I tried his "Walk through" technique during my lunch break and feel I have a much better understanding of what goes on. From what I understand, I'm not to exert my arms through the swing at all, but to just let the swing occur naturally with the correct hip rotation and weight shift. Maintaining a nice balance and with very little effort, I could feel the weight of the club head swing, and the few balls I hit into the field sailed away nicely. The Walk Through video of Steve's also allowed me to feel the momentum of the club head near the end of the back swing and how it continues on its own to the top before decelerating to a stop.

[LastPrankster]

Well, if you look at the impact zone of most pros on iron shots, you will see a very small amount of hip turn. They call this keeping their feet "quiet." If you are having problems with having your hips come too far ahead of your body, try keeping your right foot low, or "queit," while also keeping your weight on your left side.

[Avid Golfer]

I'm having the problem of leaving my arms behind during the downswing because of the hip bump at the start. I'm told that my shoulders don't synchronize with my hips at impact where my hips are about 45 degrees open, but my shoulders are only 15 degrees. I read that Trevor Immelman likes to swing down with his arms first. Do I need to complement my hip bump and rotation by swinging with my arms? But then I thought that I'm to keep my arms and hands passive and let them go for a ride. What am I missing here?

I don't recommend focusing on both a hip bump and dropping the arms at the same time to start the downswing. The hip bump move usually promotes moving the center of gravity (and bottoming out of the club) toward the target, and if done too quickly can promote a steep decent into the ball. The arms dropping on the other hand tends to promote a shallowing out of shaft starting down. Doing them both at the same time could have the two counter forces opposing each other. Your current swing (and where you arrive near the end of the backswing) will determine what downswing fits best for you. Some people hit their best shots thinking about the lower body starting the downswing (ex: Greg Norman and Jack Nicklaus), some people hit their best shots thinking about having the arms starting the downswing (ex: Trevor Immelman and Mark O'mera), and finally some people find they hit their best shots when they feel the shoulders starting the downswing (ex: Steve Elkington and Nick Price). I recommend trying each on the range and seeing which results in better (and more consistant shots) for you.

As for the degree of openness between your hips and shoulders: you don't want your shoulders and hips both open 45* or your shot is going to start 45* to the left of your target.

That's what's so confusing to me. I'm probably looking at this whole thing wrong, but how does one keeps the arms synchronized while swinging with the lower body? Doesn't arm action come into play to prevent them from lagging behind too much? I tend to think that you're correct LastPrankster, but my golf instructor over at Golftec says that I'm incorrectly using my arms when I try to synchronize the connection triangle on the downswing. Unfortunately, when I ask him to elaborate, he won't, and only gives me new drills to work on the issue.

A drill to separate what on the backswing?

It sounds like you're encountering a common problem that lots of people who try to start down with the lower body encounter (getting stuck). If your lower body starts the downswing (agressively and abruptly) and your arms have a significant distance to travel then they have a good chance of getting stuck behind the quick moving body. If you feel tension building in your shoulders and arms as you make the lower body move down then that may suggest that your hips are pulling your chest forward, and your upper arms are still going in the oposite direction which causes tension (possibly causing separation of the arms from the chest as well). One of the big things to notice in those pictures (in the above post) is that the upper arms are moving with the upper chest. If they stay together you'll be in sync, but if they separate you'll have a difficult time hitting the ball consistantly solid. The fact that your instructor will not elaborate and give reasons when you ask him questions (and instead gives you drills) gives me the impression that he may not be a good instructor, and that he may be lacking knowledge on how the golf swing works. As many of us know just because a person has the title instructor or teacher doesn't make that person a good instructor (or teacher). (Sometimes the GolfTec's are more interested in hiring people that will expand their client base and hook people onto $3,000 and $10,000 lesson packages over people who are good instructors).

[dkglf98]

For me, If my backswing starts with shoulder rotation and arms in "one piece" I can turn back thru with the shoulders and just let the arms com thru and hands release. If I start with my hands and arms back then they also start the downswing and I am in trouble, so yeah I like using the big muscles and if I tuck the right elbow and turn the shoulders the power is so much greater. I like to think of it this way, I can lift a ton more weight with my back, shoulders, legs and the arms are weak in comparison. Hence, hitting with my arms is weaker and for me less consistent.