I was a Tiger hater.

[iacas]

  rudygu said:

He has been elevated by the media to the point that he is above any sort of criticism. It's as if people refuse to admit he is human.

Have you not been around the few times Tiger hasn't won an event in three months? Or that time he went something like 10 majors without winning? The "slump" and "is he done?" talk was running rampant.

When Tiger is at his best, he's not human. But without criticism? C'mon. For all the positives heaped on him, he gets some pretty big negatives too.

[rudygu]

  iacas said:

Have you not been around the few times Tiger hasn't won an event in three months? Or that time he went something like 10 majors without winning? The "slump" and "is he done?" talk was running rampant.

True enough. Though that isn't the sort of criticism I meant. I don't really feel like they sensationalize his golfing achievements. His game speaks for itself...It would be stupid to criticize much about it.

  iacas said:

When Tiger is at his best, he's not human.

I agree that his game can be inhuman. I simply meant he gets by with things other golfers couldn't.

  iacas said:

But without criticism? C'mon. For all the positives heaped on him, he gets some pretty big negatives too.

Sure, he gets some, but also gets a pass more often than most other players. The most recent example I can think of is that incident with the photographer a couple of months back. Was he justified in being pissed off when it happened? Of course. But, IIRC he told the group of photographers he would "break their f'ing necks" if they did it again a good bit later, after he had finished the hole and was heading to the next tee. No other golfer gets by with that with as little criticism as he got (with the possible exception of Phil), nor should they.

You are right though...I should not have said "above any sort of criticism. I should have just said "I too get annoyed by the constant coverage of him" because my real point was that I used to let it effect my opinion of him, but finally got past it a couple years ago.

[golf_junkie27]

  iacas said:

I'm aware of what it takes to get out of the rough. That's not what I was saying. You don't have to bench press 400 yards to execute that shot which is what Miller was implying. Secondly, considering he had 200 yards to the green and was about 20 yards short, I don't see how it could have gone 190+ yards.

[BASHERBAKER69]

I have never been a great Tiger lover, but when he is top of his game he does have a certain extra terrestrial quality not often seen since the halcyon days of the Golden Bear, Jack Nicklaus.

[iacas]

  rudygu said:

But, IIRC he told the group of photographers he would "break their f'ing necks" if they did it again a good bit later, after he had finished the hole and was heading to the next tee. No other golfer gets by with that with as little criticism as he got (with the possible exception of Phil), nor should they.

I guess you might not see as much as I do. Announcers gloss over it because nobody cares about things in the past. We didn't have to hear about Sergio spitting in the cup this week or being a brat after losing to Padraig, right? No - we just heard about good past things.

Tiger was criticized heavily in certain circles for the photographer thing. Just look at how much he's been criticized about a pretty innocuous comment about hockey. And remember his "putted like a spaz" comment? Whooey did that piss a lot of people off (mostly in the UK).

  golf_junkie27 said:

I'm aware of what it takes to get out of the rough. That's not what I was saying. You don't have to bench press 400 yards to execute that shot which is what Miller was implying. Secondly, considering he had 200 yards to the green and was about 20 yards short, I don't see how it could have gone 190+ yards.

Bench pressing helps, and that's just Johnny being Johnny.

I said 190+ because he had, IIRC, 208 to the front of the green, and so "about 20 yards short" is about 190. If it was 208 pin, then he only flew it 170 or so, which is still about 20 yards farther than virtually anyone else could do. Maybe Vijay. Phil might have hit it five feet.

[Nowsounder]

Is "hate" the emotion you are (or was) experiencing with Tiger? How can you hate Tiger? I reserve that emotion for coming home and finding your best friend in bed with your wife, or political leaders who through deception put their countries into needless wars. Through the years I witnessed racist who hate Tiger because he ended the myth that only white guys can play golf. (all due respect to Charlie Sifford, Pete Brown, and even Lee Trevino). Racism aside, isn't Tiger the quintessential human being to not only represent professional golf but to be argubly the best that ever teed it up? Tiger has taken the sport to another level not unlike what Arnie did in the '60s. While there were many "Jack-fans" who hoped Jack would kick Arnie's butt and vice-versa, few hated either. I believe every emotion is tied to a thought. If you truly hate Tiger, you may want to inquire why by finding the thought. Every sport has examples of steroid-this, drug/drinking problems that. Tiger hasn't gotten a traffic ticket. What is there to hate?

I predicted Tiger would win the PGA on this blog last week. I continue to believe he stays in the Now more than anyone on the tour. In the last few holes yesterday when Tiger knew when he cranked a drive the pain would hit his knee, he stayed in the present through the set-up, back swing and follow through. Obviously, there are great golfers in the hunt today and anyone within 6 shots or so can win. I will stay with my prediction. Tiger wins another major.

[rudygu]

  iacas said:

I guess you might not see as much as I do. Announcers gloss over it because nobody cares about things in the past. We didn't have to hear about Sergio spitting in the cup this week or being a brat after losing to Padraig, right? No - we just heard about good past things.

I'm not saying the announcers need to mention anything like that a year later. I think Sergio caught a lot more flak for his childish actions last year in the mainstream golf news outlets at the time than Tiger did for the photographer thing. If another golfer, say Stuart Appleby, did it, he would be roasted alive.[/QUOTE]

  iacas said:

Tiger was criticized heavily in certain circles for the photographer thing. Just look at how much he's been criticized about a pretty innocuous comment about hockey. And remember his "putted like a spaz" comment? Whooey did that piss a lot of people off (mostly in the UK).

Yeah, you're right about hockey and "spaz" comments. It's kinda sad, actually. A totally innocent comment about his own poor putting and a remark about the popularity of hockey get him in more trouble than a curse-laden threat to a photographer.

I'm not saying that I want constant criticism of Tiger whether he deserves it or not, just on the rare occasions that he does warrant it. You're doing a pretty good job of convincing me I'm wrong by thinking he doesn't.

[dkinser86]

Everyone talks about how much Tiger is covered. He's everywhere. But when you have done what he has done for how long he has done it, he deserves it. He is so good. Every talks about how Phil prepares for Majors, charting the greens, going out with all of his gurus on the course, cross-reference pin locations and his charts but he still can't do what Tiger does. Tiger's grit, determination and desire to not only win, but to destroy the competition makes him that much better. Know one in history has had the precise shotmaking under pressure that Tiger has. It's his precision and strive to be perfect that sets him apart. The precision is what allows him to hit the shot 190+ yards from the deep rough. Tiger is the best player to ever pick up a golf club.

With all this being said, I would love to see someone step up and challenge Tiger. I was not alive during Watson's and Nicklaus's duel in the sun. Probably the most exciting golf I've ever watched was the 2000 PGA Championships with Tiger vs. Bob May and the 1999 PGA Championship, Tiger vs Sergio.

[bogeyhitter25]

Tiger Woods to golf is what:

Michael Jordan is to basketball
Wayne Gretzky is to hockey
Pele is to soccer
Ali is to boxing
and
Hank Aaron is to baseball

He is just absolutely stunning.

[T.J.K.]

  bogeyhitter25 said:

Tiger Woods to golf is what:

Only more dominant. Hank Aaron though? Come on. He's not anywhere near the best ever at baseball so I fixed it for you

[rjfan91]

  Soup Fan said:

His crazy chip in on 17...it was amazing, I admit, but I also did not need to see it replayed immediately from all 400 available camera angles. Also, make no doubt about the fact that

I had the same surgery on the same knee (mine, not his) for the same problem early last year. It took me about 9 months to be able to truly make a golf swing (again, mine not his) on it. It really is amazing that he's hitting this early. Although, it does look like he's paying the price for an early comeback.

[golf_junkie27]

  T.J.K. said:

Hank Aaron though? Come on. He's not anywhere near the best ever at baseball so I fixed it for you

Home run king, nearly 4000 base hits, 25 time All Star, career batting average over 300, most RBI, ever, 4th all time in runs scored, 4th all time in runs created, most extra base hits in baseball history, 2nd most intentional walks in baseball history.

Yeah, I can see how "he's not anywhere near the best ever at baseball."

[golf_junkie27]

  iacas said:

IIf it was 208 pin, then he only flew it 170 or so, which is still about 20 yards farther than virtually anyone else could do. Maybe Vijay. Phil might have hit it five feet.

I bet Phil would use his driver for those five feet.

[DJYoshi]

  bogeyhitter25 said:

Tiger Woods to golf is what:

Hank Aaron's great..but not the greatest in his sport. he was fundamentally sound. a power hitter, but also could finesse the bat... his defense was pretty damn awesome... but definitely not the best in baseball of all time. i'd be more compelled to compare tiger to a-rod..and I hate a-rod..but he's pretty damn special. has records to break..but i think he's 1 of the greatest to play of all time..and possibly will be when his career's over... I wish i could say it was griffey jr...but his injuries didn't let him reach his full potential.

[T.J.K.]

  golf_junkie27 said:

Home run king, nearly 4000 base hits, 25 time All Star, career batting average over 300, most RBI, ever, 4th all time in runs scored, 4th all time in runs created, most extra base hits in baseball history, 2nd most intentional walks in baseball history.

He had longevity, that is all. We might as well put Ricky Henderson up there too :)

[beung]

  golf_junkie27 said:

I was the exact opposite. When he first burst onto the scene, I was like, "Wow, someone I can identify with."

I agree that , it's not Tiger's fault so you really can't blame him for the press coverage, but I hate the "over exposure" that most would agree is happening as well. The only thing I can say about that is that as the media are you going to cover someone else? If there was some one who could take the spotlight away from him, he would gladly welcome it, he wants to leave no doubt and willing to take on anyone. The media would be more then happy if each weekend was a 3, 4, 5 heck even a 2 man race but until some other tour players start stepping it up there will be no end to the media coverage.

There are other tour players I "hate" more then Tiger by a long shot. But Tiger wouldn't be my first pick to play a round with, if I had the chance of course I would but there are other tour players I would rather play a round with then Tiger.