understanding course and slope-help

[mrfld]

I have been basically playing golf since this past summer. Since I am so new I have trying to play a variety of courses to get a handicap. Here's my confusion:

I have been playing a local executive course that is less than 3000 yards, at a par 58.

course 86 slope 90

I thought that the course rating is what a scratch golfer should shoot and slope is the measure of how quickly the difficulty becomes for a high handicapper. 113 being average.

By looking at my local course's rating it would appear by the slope that it is below average in difficulty and that a scratch golfer should shoot 28 above par?!?

What am I not understanding? I can shoot better than 86 but i am far from scratch. I feel using scores from this course is giving my handicap a false low.

[Shorty]

You are probably underestimating your handicap by about 20.

A scratch player should be able to shoot 58 comfortably on this course.

A 3000 yard, par 58 golf course is not really a golf course where there is any comparison at all between it and a course twice as long.

A 6000 yard course is extremely short, so you will need to play some proper courses before you can get any meaningful numbers regarding your handicap.

A course with 14 short par 3s is not really comparable to a true golf course, because you don't even really have to drive the ball - a cause for may high scores with amateur golfers who might be OK iron players, but.....

if this is the only course you are playing, it is probably an ideal place to learn, but I'd be forgetting about a handicap for the moment.

[sacm3bill]

The rating is indeed what a scratch golfer would shoot on average, so the actual explanation is much simpler than Shorty's: That course rating is wrong, and you are right to question it. Either you read it wrong or the course has published it in error. You should not use it for your handicap calculations, and you should bring it to the attention of the course.

[luu5]

Perhaps this short course is correct and is using Short Course slope as explained in USGA Handicap Manual Appendix A:

Quote:

Appendix A USGA Short Course Handicap Computation Procedure

A Short Course Handicap is the USGA's service mark used to indicate a measurement of a player's potential ability on a Short Course (e.g., a golf course, as defined below, that is under 3,000 yards in length for 18 holes or 1,500 yards for nine holes). Potential ability is measured by a player's best scores and is expressed as a whole number. These scores are identified by calculating the Short Course Handicap differential for each score.

A-1. Golf Clubs Permitted to Use Short Course Handicap Procedure

Golf clubs following procedures of the USGA Handicap System are allowed to issue a Short Course Handicap under the following conditions:

(i) Members of the golf club must play at a golf course that is less than 3,000 yards in length for 18 holes or 1,500 yards for nine holes;

(ii) The golf club must be rated by an authorized golf association using the guidelines set forth in Section 18 of the "The USGA Course Rating System"

(USGA Short Course Rating Procedure);

(iii) A Short Course Handicap is not portable to any golf course other than the one where the Short Course Handicap was produced;

(iv) Short Course Handicaps may be issued by clubs with courses under 3,000 yards in length for 18 holes. However, such courses may not be issued a USGA Course Rating and Slope Rating. Such handicaps may not be termed a "Handicap Index" and must be identified by an "SL" to indicate that they are Short Course Handicaps.

[sacm3bill]

Originally Posted by luu5

Perhaps this short course is correct and is using Short Course slope as explained in USGA Handicap Manual Appendix A:

No, something still doesn't add up. Short course handicaps don't have slopes, and the ratings are still pretty close to par.

[rustyredcab]

Originally Posted by mrfld

...

course 86 slope 90

...

Course rating of 86 is either a typo or misread (maybe 56?). Slope of 90 may be right.

[mrfld]

http://www.thegolfcourses.net/golfcourses/KY/Florence.htm

The above link shows the course information for World of Golf. The information posted there is the same that is posted on the score card.

[iacas]

Originally Posted by mrfld

http://www.thegolfcourses.net/golfcourses/KY/Florence.htm

The above link shows the course information for World of Golf. The information posted there is the same that is posted on the score card.

Okay. So it's wrong in two places.

For one, course ratings have a decimal point. Even if it's .0 you're supposed to display it.

Second, the scratch golfer does not shoot 86 there. Period.

Somebody got something horribly wrong.

[rustyredcab]

mrfld,

To give you some perspective, the hardest course you can imagine anyone ever playing (except a pro) might have a rating of 75.5. A PGA set up course might have a rating of 77.0.

Medinah #3 from the tips plays 7657 yards and has a 78.3 rating (should make for a fun Ryder Cup). It is the golf course equivalent of those guys who strap on a snowboard and jump from a helicopter.

If the scorecard duplicated the error on the website, the management of the course must never have looked at their own scorecard.

[mrfld]

Thanks for the info. I have been shooting about 90 on just about every course I play regardless of how difficult it is. When I shoot an 82 at this place I am getting a negative raw score when figuring my handicap since the "rating" is 86.

I will contact the course and post what I find out.

[DoGolf Jonathan]

Also, I think if you log in to oobgolf or myscorecard.com those two sites are great at calculating your correct handicap.  Also, most of the time they have the course slope and par in there already so you don't have to stress over that stuff.  Just a helpful thought.

[sacm3bill]

Originally Posted by DoGolf Jonathan

Also, I think if you log in to oobgolf or myscorecard.com those two sites are great at calculating your correct handicap.  Also, most of the time they have the course slope and par in there already so you don't have to stress over that stuff.  Just a helpful thought.

Those are valid sites, but the OP's question isn't about how to calculate a handicap, it's about an issue with a particular course's rating and slope. If the course's own scorecard is wrong, then I doubt any other source has it right, including oobgolf or myscorecard.com.

I suspect what happened is they couldn't get officially rated since they were less than 3000 yards, so someone at the course made a wild ass guess for the rating and slope.

[mrfld]

Wild indeed-at least a good guess would have been 56. I called the course and talked to a lady that did not know what a course rating and slope rating was. She got back on the phone and said she could only find a USGA slope of 90.

[mrfld]

I just checked oobgolf and they have the numbers of 56.9 and 90!

[sacm3bill]

Originally Posted by mrfld

I just checked oobgolf and they have the numbers of 56.9 and 90!

Well I stand corrected!  That sounds reasonable.