Jump to content
IGNORED

Ball Totally Covered with Huge Clumps of Dirt


Note: This thread is 4767 days old. We appreciate that you found this thread instead of starting a new one, but if you plan to post here please make sure it's still relevant. If not, please start a new topic. Thank you!

Recommended Posts

Playing partner this weekend was getting a bit frustrated, started just gripping and ripping, hoping to hit a few satisfying bombs and forgetting about scoring.  On one of these shots with a 3w off the deck, he rips at it and smashs the top of the ball.  Ball is driven into the ground, pops up and forward maybe 2 feet, and comes to rest almost 100% covered in dirt.  The volume of dirt was literally at least as much volume as the ball.  Totally unplayable.  It would have taken probably 2 or 3 strokes just to get enough dirt off the ball that it would go even vaguely where it's supposed to.

We were on 15 or so and he's an infrequent player not keeping an index or anything and he'd already cleared 100 and pretty much stopped keeping score, so he just counted it as a stroke, picked it up, cleaned it off, and tried to hit a good 3w shot.  My question is, what's the real ruling here?  I know mud on the ball doesn't make it unfit and provide a free drop after cleaning.  If you declare an unplayable lie and take a +1 penalty and a drop, are you allowed to replace or clean the ball?  Is there any option but just continuing to strike the ball until enough dirt is smacked off that it will go anywhere?

Matt

Mid-Weight Heavy Putter
Cleveland Tour Action 60˚
Cleveland CG15 54˚
Nike Vapor Pro Combo, 4i-GW
Titleist 585h 19˚
Tour Edge Exotics XCG 15˚ 3 Wood
Taylormade R7 Quad 9.5˚

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

When taking an unplayable, you may clean the ball before dropping.  That'd probably be the most sensible option here.

In the bag:
FT-iQ 10° driver, FT 21° neutral 3H
T-Zoid Forged 15° 3W, MX-23 4-PW
Harmonized 52° GW, Tom Watson 56° SW, X-Forged Vintage 60° LW
White Hot XG #1 Putter, 33"


If you declare your ball unplayable, then you are allowed to lift the ball, clean it or substitute it, and drop within two club lengths no closer to the hole. Rule 28: [quote=Rule 28][b]The player may deem his ball unplayable at any place on the course, except when the ball is in a water hazard.[/b] The player is the sole judge as to whether his ball is unplayable. If the player deems his ball to be unplayable, he must, [b]under penalty of one stroke[/b]: a. Play a ball as nearly as possible at the spot from which the original ball was last played (see Rule 20-5); or b. Drop a ball behind the point where the ball lay, keeping that point directly between the hole and the spot on which the ball is dropped, with no limit to how far behind that point the ball may be dropped; or c. Drop a ball within two club-lengths of the spot where the ball lay, but not nearer the hole. If the unplayable ball is in a bunker, the player may proceed under Clause a, b or c. If he elects to proceed under Clause b or c, a ball must be dropped in the bunker. [b]When proceeding under this Rule, the player may lift and clean his ball or substitute a ball.[/b][/quote] Bolded parts are mine, to show the relevant sections. This is confirmed by Rule 21: [quote=Rule 21]A ball on the putting green may be cleaned when lifted under Rule 16-1b. [b]Elsewhere[/b], a ball may be cleaned when lifted, except when it has been lifted: a. To determine if it is unfit for play (Rule 5-3); b. For identification (Rule 12-2), in which case it may be cleaned only to the extent necessary for identification; or c. Because it is assisting or interfering with play (Rule 22). [/quote] Basically, the spirit of Rule 28 (drop with penalty) is to give golfers an "out" should they encounter a crappy situation they have to hit from. Ball half stuck somewhere? Hate the tree root? Hate the mud on the ball? Etc. Just take a stroke penalty, move the ball, clean it, and keep playing.

"Golf is an entire game built around making something that is naturally easy - putting a ball into a hole - as difficult as possible." - Scott Adams

Mid-priced ball reviews: Top Flight Gamer v2 | Bridgestone e5 ('10) | Titleist NXT Tour ('10) | Taylormade Burner TP LDP | Taylormade TP Black | Taylormade Burner Tour | Srixon Q-Star ('12)


Its been such a wet summer here in the N/E - I expect to hit a muddy ball from the fairway - really doens't affect the ball flight as much as I initially thought it would.

Just to clarify ... a plugged ball is a different scenario - I believe I read that a plugged ball can be dropped at no penalty, correct ?

John

Fav LT Quote ... "you can talk to a fade, but a hook won't listen"

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades



Originally Posted by inthehole

Its been such a wet summer here in the N/E - I expect to hit a muddy ball from the fairway - really doens't affect the ball flight as much as I initially thought it would.

Just to clarify ... a plugged ball is a different scenario - I believe I read that a plugged ball can be dropped at no penalty, correct ?


Yes, see R25-2 Embedded ball.

As far as the original issue is concerned, propably a better option than taking the unplayable in this particular situation would be just picking the ball up, cleaning it and replacing it. This would be 1 penalty (R18-2a) but replacing might be a better option than dropping, depending on the course conditions.


Thanks for the extra reference Ignorant.  In this particular situation, it wasn't actually a course condition problem. There'd been some rain recently and the fairways definitely weren't the dry to bordering on hard pan I'm used to in southern California, but the course was actually in quite nice condition.  The player in question is just huge with very strong forearms and super high swing speed.  The previous frustrated 3w he hit two holes before carried ~255, dead on target, and the 3w in question is very crappy and very old.  With a brand new 3w and an even decent ball I wouldn't be surprised if he was capable of carrying a 3w up in the 265-270 range.  Of course, that kind of carry would also come with this kind of shot!  With that kind of swing speed he managed to get his hands way in front and smash very steeply down on top of the ball into softish fairway.

Matt

Mid-Weight Heavy Putter
Cleveland Tour Action 60˚
Cleveland CG15 54˚
Nike Vapor Pro Combo, 4i-GW
Titleist 585h 19˚
Tour Edge Exotics XCG 15˚ 3 Wood
Taylormade R7 Quad 9.5˚

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

Interesting find, Ignorant.  Seems kind of sleazy to me, though.  (However I wouldn't fault anyone for taking advantage of this, particularly since it's clearly permitted under Decision 18-2a/13.)

In the bag:
FT-iQ 10° driver, FT 21° neutral 3H
T-Zoid Forged 15° 3W, MX-23 4-PW
Harmonized 52° GW, Tom Watson 56° SW, X-Forged Vintage 60° LW
White Hot XG #1 Putter, 33"




Originally Posted by zeg

Interesting find, Ignorant.  Seems kind of sleazy to me, though.  (However I wouldn't fault anyone for taking advantage of this, particularly since it's clearly permitted under Decision 18-2a/13.)



This is the way we use Rules to our own benefit...


Originally Posted by Ignorant

This is the way we use Rules to our own benefit...


Of course.  It just seems like it ought to be improper to intentionally break a rule (meaning both through a deliberate action and with knowledge of the rule) to gain a benefit.  Obviously, writing a rule to enforce my feeling on this issue would be impractical, though.

It'd make me a bit more comfortable if there were an additional explicitly mentioned option to lift, clean, and replace under a 1-stroke penalty.  I really don't like the idea of procedures that one arrives at by studying the rules while thinking, "What else can I get away with?"

But, like I said, the rules do permit this, so in the rare event that it is the best option, one would be foolish not to exercise it.

In the bag:
FT-iQ 10° driver, FT 21° neutral 3H
T-Zoid Forged 15° 3W, MX-23 4-PW
Harmonized 52° GW, Tom Watson 56° SW, X-Forged Vintage 60° LW
White Hot XG #1 Putter, 33"




Originally Posted by zeg

Of course.  It just seems like it ought to be improper to intentionally break a rule (meaning both through a deliberate action and with knowledge of the rule) to gain a benefit.  Obviously, writing a rule to enforce my feeling on this issue would be impractical, though.

It'd make me a bit more comfortable if there were an additional explicitly mentioned option to lift, clean, and replace under a 1-stroke penalty.  I really don't like the idea of procedures that one arrives at by studying the rules while thinking, "What else can I get away with?"

But, like I said, the rules do permit this, so in the rare event that it is the best option, one would be foolish not to exercise it.


In this particular case do pay attention to the wording of R18-2a:

When a player’s ball is in play, if:
(i) the player, his partner or either of their caddies lifts or moves it,
touches it purposely (except with a club in the act of addressing it)
or causes it to move except as permitted by a Rule, or...

I would say that there you have your LCP-rule with one penalty and no problems with your conscience

I always encourage people to learn the Rules by claiming that good knowledge would save at least one shot per round on the average. One particularly good example is lateral water hazard rule. Most people do not know the option 26-1c(ii) where one is allowed to drop the ball on the other side of the hazard equidistant from the hole. Depending on the location of that hazard one could be dropping on light rough or even fairway instead of heavy rough or tall grass. Could mean saving a par instead of a frustrating double or triple...


Note: This thread is 4767 days old. We appreciate that you found this thread instead of starting a new one, but if you plan to post here please make sure it's still relevant. If not, please start a new topic. Thank you!

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now


  • Want to join this community?

    We'd love to have you!

    Sign Up
  • TST Partners

    PlayBetter
    TourStriker PlaneMate
    Golfer's Journal
    ShotScope
    The Stack System
    FitForGolf
    FlightScope Mevo
    Direct: Mevo, Mevo+, and Pro Package.

    Coupon Codes (save 10-20%): "IACAS" for Mevo/Stack/FitForGolf, "IACASPLUS" for Mevo+/Pro Package, and "THESANDTRAP" for ShotScope. 15% off TourStriker (no code).
  • Posts

    • Day 335 - More putting work, with the focus on setup and hitting the sweet spot. 
    • Day 153: putted for a while using the 2 cups drill inside. Working on bead primarily. Contact was really good. 
    • Day 8: 12/17/2024 Okay I took my new PPJ swing thought to the range today. I wasn't sure I was quite ready to do so, but I'm glad I did.  When I got it right it was good... really good. When I got it wrong it was a major fail. I hit lots of really ugly ones. But I didn't let that deter me. I stayed committed and focused on the PPJ and I avoided any temptation to go back to what I was doing before just so that I could "look" better at the range. I'm pretty excited about what I saw when I got it right.  I hit the 6 iron mostly (nearly all block work today). I also hit about 6 balls each with the PW, 8I, 5W and Driver. Those had varying degrees of success. I did crack one drive that let me feel and see what the changes will look like once I get fully trained.  Anyway, I'm going to go back to the mirror work for a couple of more days before bringing it back to the range. I do feel like if I can get this right my swing will improve a lot. So I think its worth the effort. I liked the way it looked on GEARs when I get it right, and I like the results I got at the range when I got it right. Now the goal is to work towards getting it right more often. 
    • So I think it's that they can't just bend the shaft or hosel to get it to a new lie angle. They adjust that and it changes the weighting, so they have to then adjust all the weights to get it balanced again. I get the impression that it's a bit of an iterative process and they do it all in the US, so they're paying US labor costs to build it and make it work how it's supposed to. Whether you believe in the tech or not, I think that's a true statement.
×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

Welcome to TST! Signing up is free, and you'll see fewer ads and can talk with fellow golf enthusiasts! By using TST, you agree to our Terms of Use, our Privacy Policy, and our Guidelines.

The popup will be closed in 10 seconds...