Is it free drop or...

[Bman]

I was playing at a course that's has been receiving a face lift with new sand traps and added lots of trees along several fairways.

I hit a slice on 1 hole and the ball landed under a new planted tree, there is a 2 feet radius circle around the tree where the soil and tree barks are raised up with 2 metal supporting stakes on opposite side.

I checked the local rule on the scorecard and there was no mention of these newly planted trees.  I think it should be a free drop because these are new planted tree requiring supporting stakes, however a friend of mine said that free drop is only for trees under 6 feet high.  So I had to declare ball unplayable, took a penalty stroke and drop the ball.

So, is it a free drop?  or ball unplayable?

One more question: there's also no local rule on fences (course is nested in a community where fairways run between houses), is it a free drop of 1 club length if a ball is within a club-length from a fence?

[Shorty]

There is no rule about trees being under 6 feet high, local or otherwise. How would you what 6 feet was?  5.11? 6.1?

That's a perfect example of something that has been made up by someone that otehrs believe to be true.

Usually, there is a local rule for relief from staked trees.

If it's not mentioned on the card or on a board, there is no relief.

[rustyredcab]

Fences that define out of bounds (or are themselves out of bounds) do NOT get free relief. Neither do OB stakes. So, imagine an OB defined by a fence. The fence is OB and not free relief. Imagine an OB stake defining the out of bounds and a fence a few feet more out of bounds. The fence does not allow free relief and neither does the stake. And, the stake can not be removed.

The good news is you get two club lengths instead of one in exchange for that one shot penalty.

A water hazard stake can be removed. Those little split rail fences that keep carts on the path also get free relief.

[Dormie1360]

Originally Posted by Bman

I was playing at a course that's has been receiving a face lift with new sand traps and added lots of trees along several fairways.

I hit a slice on 1 hole and the ball landed under a new planted tree, there is a 2 feet radius circle around the tree where the soil and tree barks are raised up with 2 metal supporting stakes on opposite side.

I checked the local rule on the scorecard and there was no mention of these newly planted trees.  I think it should be a free drop because these are new planted tree requiring supporting stakes, however a friend of mine said that free drop is only for trees under 6 feet high.  So I had to declare ball unplayable, took a penalty stroke and drop the ball.

So, is it a free drop?  or ball unplayable?

One more question: there's also no local rule on fences (course is nested in a community where fairways run between houses), is it a free drop of 1 club length if a ball is within a club-length from a fence?

The stakes and wires are obstructions, so you do get relief if the wire or stakes affected your stance or swing.  I don't believe this has to be a local rule.  (Similar to guide wires that hold up a boundary fence.)   A local rule would be needed to get relief from the tree itself.

[rustyredcab]

Originally Posted by Dormie1360

... A local rule would be needed to get relief from the tree itself.

And any tree that could be damaged by your swing (not the other way around) should get relief with or without a local rule unless you are in true US Open.

Golf is great but one swing is not worth hurting a little tree.

[meenman]

Originally Posted by rustyredcab

Golf is great but one swing is not worth hurting a little tree.

Hurting a little tree is well worth it - hopefully it wont be there in the years to come and you wont be stuck on one of it's roots

[Dormie1360]

Originally Posted by rustyredcab

And any tree that could be damaged by your swing (not the other way around) should get relief with or without a local rule unless you are in true US Open.

Golf is great but one swing is not worth hurting a little tree.

Well, you could always take an unplayable and save the tree.

Unless you are playing in a tournament, I agree, save the tree.  I'm a tree hugger from way back.

And while we're on the subject of trees, the question of relief from a tree stump comes up a lot.  Think of a tree stump as a very short tree, no relief unless it's been marked.

[rustyredcab]

Originally Posted by Dormie1360

....

And while we're on the subject of trees, the question of relief from a tree stump comes up a lot.  Think of a tree stump as a very short tree, no relief unless it's been marked.

I'm have a flashback to some odd discussion about stumps being worked on vs stumps just being there. If they are grinding the stumps... Maybe that was some convoluted local rule.

I know that I played a course with several stumps in a stand of trees that caught a lot of balls. We played them as mean-ass-bad luck. If you're over 20, take a stroke and move the ball. If you still think you are immortal and there are no grownups around to talk you out of it, have a swing.

[Eleven]

On my local course, one hole has a wasteland area running along the right of the fairway, it used to have a drainage pond and lots of trees, if you hit there, you were dead. They started cleaning it up, moving out dead trees, clearing out the area. It looks nice now but it's still just as bad to hit there.

One day we had just teed off, I hit right there, and then I noticed the stakes and cord marking the area off, they had replanted some grass in the area where the trees and deadfall were removed. At that moment, the course owners son (The course PGA pro) came up on us and asked if we would check in when we made the turn, I assumed they just wanted to know because there was no one behind us.

He asked how I was hitting, I was having a good start, bogey, par, bogey...then this crappy tee shot into the crap. He said "That's ground under repair, you get relief. Anyone asks, you just tell them a PGA pro told you!"

We laughed, he drove off and I proceeded to take my relief!

So what that tells me, at least at my course, if there is anything planted new, and it's staked off, then it's ground under repair!

[Dormie1360]

Originally Posted by rustyredcab

I'm have a flashback to some odd discussion about stumps being worked on vs stumps just being there. If they are grinding the stumps... Maybe that was some convoluted local rule.

I know that I played a course with several stumps in a stand of trees that caught a lot of balls. We played them as mean-ass-bad luck. If you're over 20, take a stroke and move the ball. If you still think you are immortal and there are no grownups around to talk you out of it, have a swing.

Here you go.

25/8

Tree Stump

Q. Do the Rules provide relief without penalty from a tree stump?

A. No, not unless it has been marked as ground under repair or it is in the process of being unearthed or cut up for removal, in which case it is "material piled for removal" and thus automatically ground under repair - see Definition of "Ground Under Repair."

A tree stump which the Committee intends to remove, but which is not in the process of being removed, is not automatically ground under repair.

[zeg]

Originally Posted by Bman

One more question: there's also no local rule on fences (course is nested in a community where fairways run between houses), is it a free drop of 1 club length if a ball is within a club-length from a fence?

The rule on OB fences has already been covered---you do not get relief from fences or stakes defining OB, and both are deemed fixed. However, IIRC you do get relief from a stake or sign that is merely indicating OB. This is kind of rare, but if there's a fence or painted stripe that defines the margin of OB and near it is also a stake to indicate to a distant player that OB is nearby, I believe that sort of stake is an obstruction (movable or otherwise, based on actual fact).

Also, and more importantly, club lengths are never used to determine whether or not you are entitled to relief. If there is a condition, such as an obstruction, that may entitle you to relief, you only get relief if it actually interferes. There's no fixed distance for that determination. Club lengths are used to measure drop locations.