McIlroy and Tiger question...

[TN94z]

So with McIlroy obviously making his run, do you think this motivates Tiger even more?  In my opinion, this may be firing Tiger up to get back to his old ways.  Now I don't think he will be as dominant as he was because of the competition level now, but Rory coming into his game may be the best thing that could have happened to Tiger at a low point in his career.

What do you guys think?

[MSchott]

I'm not sure what you mean by "low point in his career" but I guess you don't mean currently but about a year ago.

I don't think Tiger needs any outside motivation. He is self motivated to play a perfect shot every time. That's what drives him. He doesn't need to work any harder on his game than he already does.

[atb5079]

I read Haney's "The Big Miss" and in it he talks about Tiger's relationship with his rival players on tour. It basically says that Tiger was always a little more open to the player whom he felt were quiet and nice guys, who might be a little more "vanilla" and not to flashy, but most importantly were players he knew he could open himself up to enough because those said players while great talents were never real threats to him; see Furyk, Stricker, O'Hair, Mahan, Scott, Zach Johnson and many others.

With that said, the players who Tiger felt could possibly challenge him on a consistent basis and essentially steal majors from him, Tiger didnt like to warm up to very often. See Phil and Vijay primarily in his career. I really think that after the way Kiawah finished and specifically that odd almost pleading interview at the end with Tiger saying thats not how he normally plays on the weekends specifically at a major and almost trying to find an excuse. I think Rory has finally caught Tiger's eye enough to be a potential threat. Also the fact that Rory isn't camera shy and not afraid to open his mouth. I think this should fire Tiger up maybe not to a rivalry of Phil's level, because he just outright hates him. But certainly fire him up because he finally knows Rory is a legit threat to him breaking Jack's record.

[k-troop]

Maybe, in this sense.  Tiger's number one motivator is overcoming a challenge.  That's why he kept changing his swing and trying to do different things with his ball flight.  He saw some weakness in his game, however slight, and wanted to fix it.  It mattered not that he was still winning 1/3 of every event that he entered--he wanted perfection, presumably so that he could win 75% of the events he entered.

Tiger has a challenge now:  he played a good tournament this week, but didn't win.  That never happened to the old Tiger.  He's been talking about grooving his swing, working on the changes, getting reps, etc.  Well, he played great golf this week:  72% fairways, 79% GIR, 314 yds driving average, and 28 putts/round.  It's hard to find much fault in the way he played, but guess what?  Someone else won the tournament.

The young guys are good, and they're not afraid to play like they're good.  Tiger can play his best, and there are still a handful of guys who can play better--and they're actually doing it when it matters.  Tiger is now going to realize that it's not enough to get back to where he was with his ballstriking--he's going to have to get much, much better than he was if he wants to get back to averaging 6 wins plus 1.x majors per year.

That said, there's no question (in my mind) that Tiger wins one of the next two events.  The only question is can he come into the playoffs leading the FEC points, post a W and 2 top-10s in the playoffs, and still lose the cup?  And lose it to Rory?  That would be a blow--playing good golf during the playoffs and having someone else go home with the trophy anyway.

[atb5079]

Differences between Tiger and Rory right now seem to be 2 things. Tiger appears to be slightly less accurate 150 in and he also isnt draining the 10 footers like he use to. Rory is doing both of those better.

[TourSpoon]

I think that Tiger is motivated by winning...period. If someone else is winning then he is not. Rory happens to be the guy putting up a couple of Ws, but it really doesn't matter. Tiger played a great tournament and consistency when it counts will pay off. I hope that we do get to see a final pairing battle with those two, it would make for some epic golf.

[Wansteadimp]

Originally Posted by k-troop

That said, there's no question (in my mind) that Tiger wins one of the next two events.  The only question is can he come into the playoffs leading the FEC points, post a W and 2 top-10s in the playoffs, and still lose the cup?  And lose it to Rory?  That would be a blow--playing good golf during the playoffs and having someone else go home with the trophy anyway.

They reset points after the next week. Any of the top 5 in the reset Cup points are guaranteed the Cup with a win at the Tour Championship. So yes he could. Likewise Rory could win next week and finish 2nd in the Tour Champs and not win the Cup if the Tour Champs is won by one of the Top 5 going into it.

Its play off golf - only the Tour Champs matters - kind of.

[TN94z]

Originally Posted by MSchott

I'm not sure what you mean by "low point in his career" but I guess you don't mean currently but about a year ago.

I don't think Tiger needs any outside motivation. He is self motivated to play a perfect shot every time. That's what drives him. He doesn't need to work any harder on his game than he already does.

I was referring to the the divorce and Tiger working to make swing changes that led to all of the talk about him being done.  I guess I could have worded that better because I in no way think he is in a low point in his career at the moment.   Coming out of that low point and not being consistently number 1 in the world.

I agree, he is self motivated but wouldn't you think that some of that self motivation is to beat the top guy out there at any given point in time?  There used to be no doubt that Tiger would take out anyone if he was playing with his A game.  With the rise of the new talent, I don't believe that is the case anymore. This would seem like extra self motivation in my opinion.

Originally Posted by k-troop

Maybe, in this sense.  Tiger's number one motivator is overcoming a challenge.  That's why he kept changing his swing and trying to do different things with his ball flight.  He saw some weakness in his game, however slight, and wanted to fix it.  It mattered not that he was still winning 1/3 of every event that he entered--he wanted perfection, presumably so that he could win 75% of the events he entered.

Tiger has a challenge now:  he played a good tournament this week, but didn't win.  That never happened to the old Tiger.  He's been talking about grooving his swing, working on the changes, getting reps, etc.  Well, he played great golf this week:  72% fairways, 79% GIR, 314 yds driving average, and 28 putts/round.  It's hard to find much fault in the way he played, but guess what?  Someone else won the tournament.

The young guys are good, and they're not afraid to play like they're good.  Tiger can play his best, and there are still a handful of guys who can play better--and they're actually doing it when it matters.  Tiger is now going to realize that it's not enough to get back to where he was with his ballstriking--he's going to have to get much, much better than he was if he wants to get back to averaging 6 wins plus 1.x majors per year.

That said, there's no question (in my mind) that Tiger wins one of the next two events.  The only question is can he come into the playoffs leading the FEC points, post a W and 2 top-10s in the playoffs, and still lose the cup?  And lose it to Rory?  That would be a blow--playing good golf during the playoffs and having someone else go home with the trophy anyway.

Yes. That is how I feel.  Tiger likes the challenge and Rory is that new challenge to conquer.  I say Rory just because of the year he is having, but it's not just Rory. There are a lot more talented players out there than there were.

Originally Posted by TourSpoon

I think that Tiger is motivated by winning...period. If someone else is winning then he is not. Rory happens to be the guy putting up a couple of Ws, but it really doesn't matter. Tiger played a great tournament and consistency when it counts will pay off. I hope that we do get to see a final pairing battle with those two, it would make for some epic golf.

Very true.  Maybe it's not Rory specifically but just "someone" else and Rory happens to be in that position now.  I'm sure that whether it's Rory, Luke, DJ, etc.....it's the same motivation.  I just use Rory because he is "it" right now.

[x129]

Rory could have come in #1, won the first 3 playoffs, finish second in the last event and still not be the champion. The system is set up so that if your in the top 5 and win the last event, you are the winner no matter what.   It all comes down to who in the top 5 can finish in the top 3 spots. The #1 + #2 guy have a bit more margin (i.e they can finish like 4th and have a shot of winning if all the other top guys falter). Last year was an oddity  that of the top 5 going in, only Luke Donald played well.  He missed winning 10 million bucks by 1 stroke (or having the 2 people that tied him play 1 stroke worse).

Quote:

Originally Posted by k-troop

That said, there's no question (in my mind) that Tiger wins one of the next two events.  The only question is can he come into the playoffs leading the FEC points, post a W and 2 top-10s in the playoffs, and still lose the cup?  And lose it to Rory?  That would be a blow--playing good golf during the playoffs and having someone else go home with the trophy anyway.

[turtleback]

Originally Posted by atb5079

Differences between Tiger and Rory right now seem to be 2 things. Tiger appears to be slightly less accurate 150 in and he also isnt draining the 10 footers like he use to. Rory is doing both of those better.

But Tiger is improving in both categories.  His distance control on short irons and pitches is a lot better than it was a month or more ago.  And at one point I saw a stat where this week he hadn't missed a put under 6 feet - and I think that was in the 4th round.

[robrey85]

My wife has such a huge issue with Tiger because of his personal life. I love the guy. He was a huge influence on me and my brother when we were younger. Unfortunately I stopped playing but my brother continued and was a great player, until he ran into some personal issues. Nothing would make me happier than to see Tiger winning like he used to and being the golfer that everyone knows he can be. Not to mention, although Rory is a really great golfer, I just can't help but to want to punch him in his face when I watch him, haha. Though a rivalry and a playoff between them would be really cool to watch.

[zipazoid]

Well, Tiger's history has shown he gets energized by competition, so from that standpoint you can certainly conclude that Rory's ascendance would motivate him.

The problem is, Tiger's 36 & Rory's 23.

So it's not going to be the 'light switch' he was able to just flick on like in the past. I am sure that mentally Tiger craves taking Rory down & supplanting him as #1. Whether the body can cash the checks his mind is writing is the question.

[sofingaw]

Originally Posted by zipazoid

Well, Tiger's history has shown he gets energized by competition, so from that standpoint you can certainly conclude that Rory's ascendance would motivate him.

The problem is, Tiger's 36 & Rory's 23.

So it's not going to be the 'light switch' he was able to just flick on like in the past. I am sure that mentally Tiger craves taking Rory down & supplanting him as #1. Whether the body can cash the checks his mind is writing is the question.

I think it can. For about 5 more years, give or take 3 years. Of course i'm making these numbers up, but I could see Tiger playing top-level golf until he's in his mid-40's, barring any real bad injuries. He could also fall to pieces within the next 5. But I'd wager he's got 5 years physically. To be TOP LEVEL, I mean.