Long end of the bag questions

[onthehunt526]

Uh oh! Shane has another thread about set make up. Well sort of. It's more to get suggestions from you guys about the subject. 

Let me set this up. I recently had my EXi irons bent to the following lofts.

3- 19 4-22 5- 25 6-28 7-32 8-36 9-40 PW- 44 AW- 48 SW- 54... The 3 and SW usually don't see play (I have speciality wedges for the SW) so I got the stupid thought to get 52, 56, 60 CB Pro S wedges with the matching Recoil Graphite shafts in my irons.... So basically that I have 5 wedges in the bag. I'm thinking that my 5-iron is going to be my longest iron. I carry a Driver and a 4-wood...

Simple question, can I get away with just a 4-hybrid for my 14th club or am I nuts?

[Denny Bang Bang]

23 minutes ago, onthehunt526 said:

Uh oh! Shane has another thread about set make up. Well sort of. It's more to get suggestions from you guys about the subject. 

Let me set this up. I recently had my EXi irons bent to the following lofts.

3- 19 4-22 5- 25 6-28 7-32 8-36 9-40 PW- 44 AW- 48 SW- 54... The 3 and SW usually don't see play (I have speciality wedges for the SW) so I got the stupid thought to get 52, 56, 60 CB Pro S wedges with the matching Recoil Graphite shafts in my irons.... So basically that I have 5 wedges in the bag. I'm thinking that my 5-iron is going to be my longest iron. I carry a Driver and a 4-wood...

Simple question, can I get away with just a 4-hybrid for my 14th club or am I nuts?

I don't know anything about your game, but I don't see why not.  In my opinion, the gaps are less important in the longer clubs, because not many of us are very accurate from over 200 yards (or over 150 for that matter)

Edited February 28, 2017 by Denny Bang Bang

[WUTiger]

Sean, I wish you had called me first. I would have recommended that you load up the CB Pro Tungsten irons. Here's the specs:

EXOTICS CB PRO TUNGSTEN IRON SPECIFICATIONS
CLUB	LOFT	LIE	GRAPHITE LENGTH
2 IRON	17°	60°	39.75"
3 IRON	19°	60.5°	39.25"
4 IRON	22°	61°	38.75"
5 IRON	26°	61.5°	38.25"
6 IRON	30°	62°	37.75"
7 IRON	34°	62.5°	37.25"
8 IRON	38°	63°	36.75"
9 IRON	42°	63.5°	36.25"
PW	46°	64°	35.75"
AW	51°	64°	35.75"

You could have the 4-AW, and add in the CB Pro 56* and 60*. Swinging X-Stiff shafts, you have the power to get the CB Pro T irons airborne.With the putter, D, 4W, you also have have the 4i and the 4H. That way, your bag would be anchored in fours (a good omen on St. Patrick's Day).

Five wedges would drive all but Dave Pelz crazy. I want to preserve your mental health.

Call up David Glod, and see if he'll comp you a set of CB Pro T irons.

And, did you discuss this with your caddie?

Later!

[onthehunt526]

@WUTiger I actually went with Stiff in the Recoils. My fitter said there is no harm in going with a slightly softer flex. I still have my KBS Tour 105 set sans AW. 

As for the Pro Tungsten irons, it was a thought. I wanted to get the new CBx irons but they won't be out for a bit (I would have went 1° weak, 52°, 56°, 60° and been done with it)

[onthehunt526]

This is where it gets dicey.

@WUTiger and others... My home course is short. (Well if 6,385 yards is considered short). Of the ten par-fours only one is over 400 yards (#18, 450 yards)... #11 and #16 are relatively long par-threes (190 and 200, unless Mike stretches #16 to 210 to the middle). On my course the longest iron (omitting the 18th) I usually have to the par-4s is with a consistent drive is typically 7-iron sometimes 6. (If 13 or 14 are into the wind). 18 is a different story. Depending on the wind, I can have as little as 5-iron to a really good 4-wood not reaching the green. 

The 16th, when the prevailing wind blows I was hitting either 3-hybrid or 4-wood last year. (I have hit Driver to 16 though). 

The reason I ask about only 1 club filling the gap is, with playing 5 wedges I'm losing a slot for an extra hybrid or fairway wood. 

It might be a short lived experiment though. I might end up with 4 wedges in the bag for the most part after I see how much I would really use the fifth wedge. 

Any suggestions would be appreciated. Even if you think me playing 5 wedges is nuts... And 54° and 60° would be enough.

[WUTiger]

Now that you explain your home course, things are clearer to me.

So, you appear to have these wedges available: 48, 52, 54, 56, 60. And, you carry 4W.....5i with a gap in between.

What is  your yardage range on decent hits for the following:

4W
5i
3H
4H

For home course, go with a 3H or 4H for club #14. To pick you would consider...

* which one splits the gap better on distance?
* can you choke down on a 3H to shave a little yardage?
* Can you hit the 3H out of light to medium rough?

If you can be a little creative with #14, it could work. You would just have to get used to it.

Once you got used to it, a calm shot with #14 - even if distance was not perfect - would probably end up around the fringe. From there,  you could make up the difference with a wedged up-and-down.

[onthehunt526]

18 hours ago, WUTiger said:

Now that you explain your home course, things are clearer to me.

So, you appear to have these wedges available: 48, 52, 54, 56, 60. And, you carry 4W.....5i with a gap in between.

What is  your yardage range on decent hits for the following:

4W
5i
3H
4H

For home course, go with a 3H or 4H for club #14. To pick you would consider...

* which one splits the gap better on distance?
* can you choke down on a 3H to shave a little yardage?
* Can you hit the 3H out of light to medium rough?

If you can be a little creative with #14, it could work. You would just have to get used to it.

To answer your question: based on last season

Driver: 250

4-wood: 220

7-wood: 200

3-hybrid: 205

4-hybrid: 195

5-iron: 180

6-iron: 170

7-iron: 160

8-iron: 148

9-iron: 135

Wedge: 123

50 wedge: 105

54 wedge:  85

58 wedge: didn't hit full

This was before a few winter lessons on posture and standing a little taller. I haven't even rented an hour on the LM to see the results, we've been focusing on staying tall keeping my sternum up more so I don't "dive" to the ball.

 

 

 

[WUTiger]

It looks like the 3H might be the magic club, if you can choke down to shave distance. (Do you have reasonable confidence in the 3H?)

[onthehunt526]

18 minutes ago, WUTiger said:

It looks like the 3H might be the magic club, if you can choke down to shave distance. (Do you have reasonable confidence in the 3H?)

Yes and no. I could probably hit it further if it didn't have a 105 gram shaft in it. It is great out of medium rough and trouble. I do tend to miss it left sometimes when I swing too easy. (I miss right when I swing too hard). 

Like I said though, the five wedge experiment might last a couple of practice rounds and be snuffed out.

My wedges did come today, but it's snowing out so hitting them probably won't happen until Monday.

[1badbadger]

@WUTiger I'm impressed...you broke the situation down and analyzed it really really well.  Nicely done and very good advice.  

If I were to add another viewpoint just for something to consider, I think that is too many wedges.  If you go with 5 wedges WUTiger has provided some solid suggestions for the top of your bag.  The other option is drop the 54* and add another club up top.  Maybe go Driver, 4 wood, 3 hybrid, 4 hybrid.  Wedges would be 48, 52, 56, 60.  More options around the green sounds good on paper, but in real life I have seen guys get confused because there are too many choices and they can't decide which leads to a mess!

[onthehunt526]

16 minutes ago, 1badbadger said:

@WUTiger I'm impressed...you broke the situation down and analyzed it really really well.  Nicely done and very good advice.  

If I were to add another viewpoint just for something to consider, I think that is too many wedges.  If you go with 5 wedges WUTiger has provided some solid suggestions for the top of your bag.  The other option is drop the 54* and add another club up top.  Maybe go Driver, 4 wood, 3 hybrid, 4 hybrid.  Wedges would be 48, 52, 56, 60.  More options around the green sounds good on paper, but in real life I have seen guys get confused because there are too many choices and they can't decide which leads to a mess!

The distances were last year's numbers.

I have the same set of irons except for 2 things. Different shafts (UST Mayima Recoil from KBS Tour 105) and my lofts are adjusted so I have 4° gaps from 6-iron down to the AW which is 48° (normally 50°), basically I weakened the 7 and 8 by 1°, left the 9 alone, strengthened the PW by 1° and the AW by 2°.  

@WUTiger what do you think about a Pro T 4-iron or a Pro H 3-iron (hell Id take a 21° DHY right about now)

[WUTiger]

On 2/27/2017 at 10:26 PM, WUTiger said:

Five wedges would drive all but Dave Pelz crazy. I want to preserve your mental health.

If you could get down to 4 wedges.. that's why I suggested the CB Pro Tungsten irons, which had the 46° and 51° in set, and then add the 56° and 60 °. You hit the ball far enough to use irons with a slightly higher loft plan, which prevents excess loft spread at the wedge end.

4 hours ago, 1badbadger said:

If you go with 5 wedges WUTiger has provided some solid suggestions for the top of your bag.  The other option is drop the 54* and add another club up top.  Maybe go Driver, 4 wood, 3 hybrid, 4 hybrid.  Wedges would be 48, 52, 56, 60.  More options around the green sounds good on paper, but in real life I have seen guys get confused because there are too many choices...

1bb has a solid club mix suggestion if you keep your current irons. This would give you an 8° degree gap from 9i to PW, but you could choke-down or a 3/4 9i swing if you needed to hit between 9i and 48° PW. 

I had trouble with 1bb's "too many choices" with only four wedges. I had X20Tour 46° plus Cle CG14 in 50°, 54° and 58°. I had lots of indecision on PW vs. AW, and had three yardage overlaps in my Pelz-style distance matrix.

Now, I have Calla MD3 48° and 54°, plus MD.PM 60°. Already it's easier to decide which shot to try. (And, I choke down a 41° 9i if the 48° is a distance stretch.)

Back to long clubs: For the bridge clubs, what do you feel most comfortable with? A 3H and 4H? or a 3H and 4i? Can you flight down the 4H if you need to keep trajectory a bit lower?

Since you're a better player than I am, you're in the situation you could probably go with either 3H and 4H, or 3H and 4i. Just pick one pair, and trust it.

[onthehunt526]

I can flight the 4-hybrid down if I need to. 

I still have my 54° and 58° (though they have steel shafts) from last year. I may go back to that set up after the experiment. Or just yank the 60 or 52 for a long club. Who knows.

@WUTiger one more question. What do you think of 7-wood as the bridge club?

[WUTiger]

19 hours ago, onthehunt526 said:

@WUTiger one more question. What do you think of 7-wood as the bridge club?

Since we were talking 4i and hybrids last week, I didn't mention it.

That said, I think the 7W can be an excellent #14 club for me, but probably not so much for you.

I like my XRail 7W during warmer weather. It gets me out of medium rough better than a hybrid, and can carry into elevated greens quite well. And, it works well alongside the 4W for yardage gap.

In seasons past, I swapped out the 7W for a 3H from Nov. - March, when the rough was lighter, and the winds stronger. (7W launches higher than hybrids). I dumped Adams hybrids, and now I only have the Cobra 4H.

Unless the 7W trajectory offers you magic help "on the road," I would say you are beyond it. You can flight your hybrids up and down. Also, your yardage comparisons from an earlier post show serious bunchup:

• 7W = 200
• 3H = 205
• 4H = 195

Advice from an old caddie: I would suggest you play 4W, 3H, 4H and four wedges until July, and stick with it unless you have scoring problems. You tend to pursue "all possible options" to the point I think it hurts your game. (Robs you of peace of mind over the ball.)

-----------------

PS - I got steal deals on a couple of demo Calla 815 Alpha FWs, 14* and 18*. I'm lofting each up a degree, and they are competing with the XRails for bag space.

[onthehunt526]

2 hours ago, WUTiger said:

Since we were talking 4i and hybrids last week, I didn't mention it.

That said, I think the 7W can be an excellent #14 club for me, but probably not so much for you.

I like my XRail 7W during warmer weather. It gets me out of medium rough better than a hybrid, and can carry into elevated greens quite well. And, it works well alongside the 4W for yardage gap.

In seasons past, I swapped out the 7W for a 3H from Nov. - March, when the rough was lighter, and the winds stronger. (7W launches higher than hybrids). I dumped Adams hybrids, and now I only have the Cobra 4H.

Unless the 7W trajectory offers you magic help "on the road," I would say you are beyond it. You can flight your hybrids up and down. Also, your yardage comparisons from an earlier post show serious bunchup:

• 7W = 200
• 3H = 205
• 4H = 195

Advice from an old caddie: I would suggest you play 4W, 3H, 4H and four wedges until July, and stick with it unless you have scoring problems. You tend to pursue "all possible options" to the point I think it hurts your game. (Robs you of peace of mind over the ball.)

-----------------

PS - I got steal deals on a couple of demo Calla 815 Alpha FWs, 14* and 18*. I'm lofting each up a degree, and they are competing with the XRails for bag space.

Yeah it makes sense 5 wedges is a lot to have in the bag especially when the ground is still really soft in the beginning of the season. I will probably take out either just the 60° or the 52° and 56° and go back to a 54° there, though taking the 48° out is another thought as well. But I can always adjust what 4 wedges depending on conditions. With having a 44° PW, I'm not in desperate need of five wedges yet. If I played like Wilson di9 irons then 5 wedges would be a necessary evil.  So I'll probably go 44°,48°, 54°,60° Just like in the days when I carried a 2-iron, except the 44° Club was my 9-iron.

P.S. I finally figured out how to do the ° on my iPad.

[onthehunt526]

After careful consideration of my set-up, having five wedges in the bag is kind of overkill unless I'm playing some executive course somewhere then it would make sense.

So I'm going back to the sweet 16 set-up of 2016 with a slight difference. Last year my sweet 16 was driver, 4-wood, 3-hybrid, 4-hybrid or 4-iron, 5-PW, AW (50°), 54°, 58°, putter. The 16th in that set-up was a 5-hybrid for a 5-iron, but I hit my 5-iron pretty well though.

difference in my sweet 16 this year is trade the 60° for the 58°, and all 5 wedges will be in the sweet 16. At Newman I rarely need my 4-wood... But it'll still be in the mix. My mix this year will be driver, 4-wood, 3-hybrid, 4-hybrid or 4-iron, 5-PW (44°), AW (48°), 52°, 56°, 60°, putter... For now I'm going to probably take out the 60°, play play Driver, 4-wood, 3-hybrid, 4-pw, aw, 52°, 56° putter... I don't need two sand wedges with 14° of bounce anyway (I own 4).

[onthehunt526]

UPDATE: Five wedges is too much. I feel I do need a higher loft either a 58° or 60° but I can do most of what I can do around the greens with a 56° wedge.

The issue is still at the top of the bag. I am hitting my driver very well, however my 4-wood and 3-hybrid are getting too close in distance. Kind of like when I still carried a 2-iron a couple years ago. I'm hitting the hybrid(s) and irons further this year. Though I do, hit the 4-wood well off the turf, I find myself going to the 3-hybrid when I need to lay back a bit, or hit a driver out to 4-wood distance (I choke down a couple inches and take a three-quarter swing). 

That being said, it may be time to try a 3-wood again. (I miss my XRail 3-wood *sniff*)

Should I get a 3-wood to fix the gapping issue or stick with the 4-wood?