I still cant figure this out please help? How does hip move exactly in swing?

shooter5757 · November 27, 2009

Ok my back is killing me more and more over the years and i want to get to the bottom of how exactly the spine and hips move through the swing!! :help:

:hmmm: :hmmm: Ben Hogan says "imagine an elastic band tied to your left hip and that the other end is fastened to wall directly behind you, the elastic is stretched with increased tension. When you start turning your hips back to the left (for Rightys) the elastic will snap back to the left with tremendous speed!!" Ok thanks but I think he should have said "directly behind and up a 3-4 ft??" Right?? I really dont know im asking.....hear me out---if the band is "directly behind you" when you swing it will crank the bottom of spine when you try to rotate your body open and keep the same spine angle (avoiding reverse pivot)? like you took a push broom that looks like an upside down cross with the top sawed off and drove it into the ground diagnolly bending one side of the broom un-naturally up (the right side of hip would force naturally up)?? this has been my spine last 3 years as i have been forcefully trying to apply this.

I am thinking right hip should move more downward and right knee should move down as well correct?

**FlopScotty** · November 27, 2009

Hi,

Had a real breakthrough with my swing after reading this article:

http://perfectgolfswingreview.net/pivot.htm

Please take your time and read trough this, try it out, and tell me what you think. I think this article sums up and explaines all the major points with regards to hip movement in the swing.

**gspjeb** · November 27, 2009

I think this explains it quite nicely. Good luck to you:
http://www.youtube.com/user/clemshaw...17/NNwSfz0_KDM

***iacas*** · November 27, 2009

Had a real breakthrough with my swing after reading this article:

I just skimmed through that post, and even now I'd recommend avoiding it at all costs.

First off, it says this image is from Five Lessons. It's not, and the illustrations of the shoulders and hips in Five Lessons are QUITE different than this. I even know the page #s: 73 and 74 - I've referred to those pages often. The Faldo image is listed as being from Hogan's book "[4]" when it is not, though. Next, this is not a reverse pivot . It's amazing how bad this picture is! Line the two up over top of each other. You know what the difference between his "reverse pivot" and his "good swing" are? It's not the head - that's in the SAME SPOT in both. It's the hips - in his "good swing" they're FURTHER FORWARD. Yet he cites the one where the hips are further to the right as being the "reverse pivot"? Guy's on crack. Then we get to perhaps the worst thing a golfer can do, the "Crossing Guard" drill . If that's what a crossing guard does for you I'm going to take my chances on being hit by a bus. Holy cow that's bad. It's slow and the only thing that'll be consistent if you do that is your incredible inconsistency. And then consider the fact that the guy uses images that don't show anything like what he's talking about, the Faldo image . His head has remained steady, his right knee has straightened, his spine has extended and tilted, his right hip has gone higher than his left, and so on. And finally, and I don't have the link to this, the picture of Hogan at the "top of his backswing" isn't at the top of his backswing. It's well after his hips have already started moving forward. That's why Hogan occasionally got the "Reverse K" look - because his club changed direction well after his hips had already completed the backswing and were well into the downswing.

**JackLee** · November 27, 2009

Your hcp is lower than mine and you are asking about hip movements? My hip movements are subconscious, as yours should be. It is amazing that almost everyone sees that the hips lead the downswing, and then think that they must consciously control that hip movement. They never consider that those hip movements should be the result of subconscious anticipation, and as such, should be perfect.

Do you consciously control your hip movements when you swing a baseball bat? How about when you are using an axe to chop a log in half with the log laying on the ground? How about when you are swinging a manual weed cutter?

Maybe you think the hips don't respond to the golf swing. Well, they don't if you swing with your arms, so try a body powered swing. It is also called a pivot powered swing. The instruction I use is "The Golf Swing and Its Master Key Explained" By Noel Thomas. I'm sure there must be other instruction that teaches this, but I have not searched for it.

***iacas*** · November 27, 2009

Your hcp is lower than mine and you are asking about hip movements? My hip movements are subconscious, as yours should be. It is amazing that almost everyone sees that the hips lead the downswing, and then think that they must consciously control that hip movement. They never consider that those hip movements should be the result of subconscious anticipation, and as such, should be perfect.

Let's just go on to an illogical extreme and say "gee, the entire swing should be subconscious."

The point of the matter is that pros work on every teeny facet of their swing. I've specifically seen several working on just their hip movements. It's something I've worked on quite a bit all year (oh, and my index is lower than yours too). Everyone strives to get to a point where their entire golf swing is "subconscious," but that doesn't mean they don't have to work on and think about certain things from time to time.

Do you consciously control your hip movements when you swing a baseball bat?

Professional baseball players do.

How about when you are using an axe to chop a log in half with the log laying on the ground? How about when you are swinging a manual weed cutter?

Are they scoring those events now? I wonder what my "manual weed cutter handicap index" is.

Point being golf is a game and the swing is complex and results in a score. We strive to improve. Never met a guy who - aside from wanting as much power as he can get in a weed cutter simply to satisfy his being male - was working on "improving his weed cutting."

**Ben** · November 28, 2009

Ok my back is killing me more and more over the years and i want to get to the bottom of how exactly the spine and hips move through the swing!! :help:

I like that you put Hogan's example because that's exactly what I was going to put. In regards to your question about distance of the band, 3 - 4ft or whatever length to imagine. Just think of a tight piece of elastic, no matter the length. As you rotate to the backswing the piece gets tighter.

A really awesome tip I read in the latest issue of Golf Digest (Steve Stricker on the front?). It was in the fold-out of Hunter Mahan's swing (I think it was him, already threw the mag out). Anyway, Mahan's coach said to press down on your left foot as hard as you can and that creates a tremendous amount of clubhead speed and hip turn on the downswing. I tried it on the range, and sure enough, I was killing 3, 4, 5, and 8 irons on the today! The coach also said this move improves the "smash factor". I can't tell you the last time I hit so many solid 4 irons. Really good session on the range today for me.

**spmurph** · November 28, 2009

I just skimmed through that post, and even now I'd recommend avoiding it at all costs.

I'm a bit confused. The image shown in that article is in my book, p.91 (paperback).

***iacas*** · November 28, 2009

I'm a bit confused. The image shown in that article is in my book, p.91 (paperback).

Yes, it is. Thanks. I corrected my post above. Hogan - as the article points out - didn't do as he said he did in the book in that section. Perhaps I didn't remember that section because I've never seriously studied it given the understanding that it was not something Hogan actually did.

A really awesome tip I read in the latest issue of Golf Digest (Steve Stricker on the front?). It was in the fold-out of Hunter Mahan's swing (I think it was him, already threw the mag out). Anyway, Mahan's coach said to press down on your left foot as hard as you can and that creates a tremendous amount of clubhead speed and hip turn on the downswing. I tried it on the range, and sure enough, I was killing 3, 4, 5, and 8 irons on the today!

You might even say he's "crushing a can" huh?

**spmurph** · November 28, 2009

Yes, it is. Thanks. I corrected my post above. Hogan - as the article points out - didn't do as he said he did in the book in that section. Perhaps I didn't remember that section because I've never seriously studied it given the understanding that it was not something Hogan actually did.

Thanks for clearing that up. Unfortunately, I used this as my first instruction and ended up spinning out way too early. Lateral hip movement to start the downswing has done wonders for my swing.

Iacas, does your lateral hip movement take you over your left foot, as opposed to what the article advocates (staying inside the left foot)?

***iacas*** · November 28, 2009

Iacas, does your lateral hip movement take you over your left foot, as opposed to what the article advocates (staying inside the left foot)?

http://thesandtrap.com/forum/showthread.php?t=29616

**spmurph** · November 28, 2009

http://thesandtrap.com/forum/showthread.php?t=29616

Yea, I just read that thread for the third time. It's really good stuff but The reason for my original question was that since I've been practicing this move I am hitting more push/weak slice shots. I thought that maybe I was pushing too far forward.

starbucks · November 29, 2009

Hips can move laterally or rotate and its hard to do both at the same time. if you can start with the hips moving laterally towards the target, then, they can stop - brace - and then they can rotate.

If you find that the the shots are going right (for a righty), continue to delay the rotation, keep moving forward, but ensure that your upper body is not moving forward at the same rate. If you are 'stacked' at impact, the angle of the club coming down is steep and there's a good chance you'll hit it right.

The amount of rotation vs. slide is somewhat dependant pattern or swing style. A guy like Adam Scott with a very high arm position who likes to keep his arms in front of his chest will have less slide and more rotation than a guy like Charlie Wi, who would continue to slide forward and delay the rotation for further in the downswing.

Keep in mind... when you slide forward, the hips ARE Squaring to the target line - its a product of the knee action. Your conscious effort is to delay the rotation.

there are videos on youtube talking about the hip action in the golf swing.

**spmurph** · November 29, 2009

there are videos on youtube talking about the hip action in the golf swing.

What do you think about this video?

**tm22721** · November 29, 2009

Here is an in depth visualization of hip movement in the golf swing

starbucks · November 29, 2009

Its good. There are others that detail the lateral versus rotary movement.

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