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Course Rating Question


hendog
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Yesterday I played a course that was a par 72 with a rating and slope of 68.5/122. However one of the par 5's was under repair and they had it playing as a par 3 with temporary tees about 120 yds out so it was a par 70 instead. How do I handle this for a handicap entry? Is it possible? Is it as simple as subtracting 2 from the rating? I wouldn't think so but I don't know what else to do other than simply call it a practice round.

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Originally Posted by Jason M Henley

Yesterday I played a course that was a par 72 with a rating and slope of 68.5/122. However one of the par 5's was under repair and they had it playing as a par 3 with temporary tees about 120 yds out so it was a par 70 instead. How do I handle this for a handicap entry? Is it possible? Is it as simple as subtracting 2 from the rating? I wouldn't think so but I don't know what else to do other than simply call it a practice round.

I think what you could do is regard it as an unplayed hole for handicap purposes.

From the U.S.G.A. Manual

If 13 or more holes are played, the player must post an 18-hole score. If 7 to 12 holes are played, the player must post a nine-hole score. In either case, scores for unplayed holes must be recorded as par plus any handicap strokes that the player is entitled to receive on the unplayed holes. (See Section 4-2 and 5-1a .)

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This does seem like the only option. Now however I am looking at the score card and see that they handicap the holes PER 9. They have 27 holes and CR/Slope for all 3 combinations but for each 9 the handicaps are 1-9. How would I know the number of strokes I get on this hole?

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Originally Posted by Jason M Henley

This does seem like the only option. Now however I am looking at the score card and see that they handicap the holes PER 9. They have 27 holes and CR/Slope for all 3 combinations but for each 9 the handicaps are 1-9. How would I know the number of strokes I get on this hole?


Just go by the holes you played and give yourself the strokes you would receive on each of the holes as if they had all been played.

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Originally Posted by camper6

Just go by the holes you played and give yourself the strokes you would receive on each of the holes as if they had all been played.



So since I played 17 of the 18 holes, I just need to figure out what my NET par is on this one altered hole. Normally I would take my course handicap (8 for this particular day) and check the handicap for this hole. If listed as handicap 1-8 I would get a stroke, otherwise I would not.

The problem is the handicaps are listed as 1-9 for the front 9 holes and then 1-9 for the back 9 holes. How do I know what the handicaps are when they are combined? This particular hole is the #1 handicap on its particular 9 so I would ASSUME it would be 1-8 when combined but that seems wishy-washy. Also my playing partners are all much higher in handicap than me and figuring it out for them is less obvious (do they get 1 or 2 strokes for example.)

Sadly it was not a good round and will not have a direct impact on my handicap although it will count as a score and thus could knock off an old score and indirectly affect my handicap that way. This is by far the most difficultly I have ever had in trying to post a score :(

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Originally Posted by Jason M Henley

...If listed as handicap 1-8 I would get a stroke, otherwise I would not.

The problem is the handicaps are listed as 1-9 for the front 9 holes and then 1-9 for the back 9 holes. How do I know what the handicaps are when they are combined? This particular hole is the #1 handicap on its particular 9 so I would ASSUME it would be 1-8 when combined but that seems wishy-washy...

If you look at a normal 18-hole scorecard you'll see that all the even-numbered handicap holes are on one 9 and the odds are on the other.  I.e., if the highest handicap hole on one 9 is #1, then the highest handicap hole on the other side would be #2. I.e., you'd never see something like handicap holes 1 through 5, for example, on one nine and then the highest handicap hole on the other 9 be #6. From this I think we can deduce that if a hole is #1 for one nine, it would be either #1 or #2 if the nines were combined. (Similarly, if a hole was #2 on one nine it would either be #3 or #4 when combined, if a hole was #3 on one nine it would either be #5 or #6 when combined, etc.)

I'm not sure what you would do if it actually mattered whether it was #1 or #2 (i.e., in cases where you'd get a extra stroke if it was #1 but not if it was #2), but luckily in your particular case it's treated the same either way.

Bill

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Originally Posted by sacm3bill

If you look at a normal 18-hole scorecard you'll see that all the even-numbered handicap holes are on one 9 and the odds are on the other.  I.e., if the highest handicap hole on one 9 is #1, then the highest handicap hole on the other side would be #2. I.e., you'd never see something like handicap holes 1 through 5, for example, on one nine and then the highest handicap hole on the other 9 be #6. From this I think we can deduce that if a hole is #1 for one nine, it would be either #1 or #2 if the nines were combined. (Similarly, if a hole was #2 on one nine it would either be #3 or #4 when combined, if a hole was #3 on one nine it would either be #5 or #6 when combined, etc.)

I'm not sure what you would do if it actually mattered whether it was #1 or #2 (i.e., in cases where you'd get a extra stroke if it was #1 but not if it was #2), but luckily in your particular case it's treated the same either way.


Holy Crap. I never realized this. Looking at 3 regular 18 hole scorecards certainly confirms this.

Would be nice to know how to handle the last part (which side are the "odds" and which are the "evens") but this certainly solves my problem for this round.

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First nine are the odds. Second nine are the evens. So if you play a course with three nines, the first nine you play is the front nine. The second nine you play is the back nine.

So, if you play to an 11, take six on the first nine and five on the second nine.

You're over-thinking this. Unless the "skipped" hole happens to be the number six handicap on the second nine you played, it does not matter almost all the time. Sure, it could matter if you are playing a game and getting or giving strokes. But again, it matters for one hole and then only if you are dealing with an odd number of strokes.

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First nine are the odds. Second nine are the evens.

Usually, but not always. There are courses where it's reversed.

In David's bag....

Driver: Titleist 910 D-3;  9.5* Diamana Kai'li
3-Wood: Titleist 910F;  15* Diamana Kai'li
Hybrids: Titleist 910H 19* and 21* Diamana Kai'li
Irons: Titleist 695cb 5-Pw

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Originally Posted by David in FL

Usually, but not always. There are courses where it's reversed.

The only time I've seen it reversed is on a course near here. It turned out that they swapped the nines recently, but maintained that numbering.

Although the raters are not bound by the rule, IIRC the handicapping guide fairly strongly recommends that the first handicap hole be put fairly early in the round in order to avoid a match being wrapped up before handicap strokes come into play.

In the bag:
FT-iQ 10° driver, FT 21° neutral 3H
T-Zoid Forged 15° 3W, MX-23 4-PW
Harmonized 52° GW, Tom Watson 56° SW, X-Forged Vintage 60° LW
White Hot XG #1 Putter, 33"

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Originally Posted by zeg

Although the raters are not bound by the rule, IIRC the handicapping guide fairly strongly recommends that the first handicap hole be put fairly early in the round in order to avoid a match being wrapped up before handicap strokes come into play.

I've seen that written too, and I never really understood that. If you're giving a guy one stroke shouldn't most of your matches reach the 16th hole? If you're four up coming to 16 what's that stroke matter? So you might have been three up instead, but he's not stroking on 16?

But hey, whatever. :)

P.S. I did want to clarify - as a course rater for West Penn Golf Association - that "raters" don't hand out handicap ratings. That's supposed to be done by submitting a few hundred (or thousand) cards to the USGA so they can see where players most need strokes. They just put all the scores into a computer and it spits out a list. They massage the data to get the holes to go odds on the front and evens on the back, typically, and there you go.

Frankly I wish they just did the handicap assignments exactly how the computer spit them out. If you're 4 up and owe a guy 4 strokes, who cares if they're the last four holes - you've got your work cut out for you (as does he). If you're six up with four to play and they're #1-#4, then you've obviously played better than he has to that point and he has no chance anyway.

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Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

Originally Posted by iacas

I've seen that written too, and I never really understood that. If you're giving a guy one stroke shouldn't most of your matches reach the 16th hole? If you're four up coming to 16 what's that stroke matter? So you might have been three up instead, but he's not stroking on 16?

Well, I think the mathematical idea is that if you play, say, 3/4 of the holes, you should have allocated about 3/4 of the strokes. It doesn't do you any good to get a stroke on a hole you never get to play.

I don't think it's all that critical, but I can see a fair bit of psychological value in getting those taken care of before the match is all-but-settled. I almost think it's better for the guy getting strokes to save them to the end, because in a close match the guy giving strokes then gets the pressure of knowing he's got to win the next few holes by a full stroke each.

In the bag:
FT-iQ 10° driver, FT 21° neutral 3H
T-Zoid Forged 15° 3W, MX-23 4-PW
Harmonized 52° GW, Tom Watson 56° SW, X-Forged Vintage 60° LW
White Hot XG #1 Putter, 33"

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Note: This thread is 4280 days old. We appreciate that you found this thread instead of starting a new one, but if you plan to post here please make sure it's still relevant. If not, please start a new topic. Thank you!

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