My swing is truly awful; I'm lost

[sonicblue]

Like they say, you never know what you're doing until you see for yourself. I recorded my swing, and I'm disgusted, discouraged and absolutely lost. The things I thought I was making progress on, I am unequivocally no better at, maybe even getting worse.

1) I was trying to get my swing plane flatter. I've made maybe 1" of progress there.

2) I was trying to shorten my swing; I still completely overtorque, and it's all arms.

3) I was trying to get better at my initial transition, dropping down (slot) instead of coming over the top; my hands still get way too outside, which leads to:

4) My impact position is horrible. I'm probably in full compensation mode ath this point, anyway. I have no clue what my left wrist is doing, I can't get any feel for it. I've been pulling like crazy, or I'll occasionally completely block and push. About 1 in 100 swings, I manage to get it straight. My release is way too premature.

I'm only linking this clip as an example of what not to do. I'm embarrassed to even show it, consider it a PSA. I hope it helps someone. UGH.

Right-click, save-as, please

[mutadayen]

If that's your bad swing, i'd like to see what a good swing looks like. The mechanics seem ok and your shot is pretty fluid. Embarrassed? You shouldnt be. I've been doing something because I was having the same problem you were. I use to always slice and i've made some adjustments and started pull. I slowed up up my backswing and forward movements to figure out was wrong. After a little adjustment period, I figured out two things. One, I was going back way too fast on my back swing and two, I re-adjusted my right hand and positioned it more in line with my left (i tended to hold the club from underneath instead of behind). When I slowed up my swing and just naturally let my body pull, I was hitting the ball about 230-240 yards average. After I learned that swing, I kept on speeding it up little by little (like i was doing yesterday). Out of 30 drives I hit 17 down the middle at about 270-280 yards, 9 i pulled a bit left but still playable, and 4 i just sliced. Try slowing up your swing and see what happens.

Again, dont be embarrassed. If we all put our swings online, we'd all say the same thing...

[sonicblue]

I appreciate that, it's just that I still do so many things that I know are cause of my rampant inconsistency (I got down to an 8.2 last year, but my anti-handicap was a 14+). I've always been athletic, so my rhythm and balance are usually good, but the devil's in the details. I have some screen caps that show the points of concern:

My toe is off the ground, so either my setup or club fit is poor. I think it's my setup, that I'm too hunched over.

Probably also b/c I'm too hunched over, my club is a little closed at parallel.

This isn't a bad position, and I'd be OK if I continued on this plane with my shoulder turn.

But I don't, my arms keep going and now I'm wound completely too far and have come over the target line by a mile

I'm way over the top already, the "slot" is already out of the picture

My hands are definitely too far from my body, and it just looks like I've already lost any power (which plays out in my lack of distance)

My hands have just flipped way too inside

This one really bothers me; my left wrist is way cupped, I don't think it should be.


All in all, I feel OK on my backswing, but it's clearly way too "loose." My transition feels OK but gets me on a very poor line, and from there to impact, I feel completely unsure of myself, which plays out in my inconsistent contact. I think the bottom line is, I need to get my hands and arms out of the picture, swing more connected. I've told myself that before, I'm just having trouble actually doing it, and now I'm just a mess of overcorrections and compensations.

[Wisco-Kid]

My suggestion would be to clear your head of all your swing thoughts. Focus on some mental images of what it is your trying to do before you go to the range and hit balls (or where ever you practice). When you actually go to practice let your subconcious mind tell you what to do. I know it sounds hokey but sometimes you cloud your concious mind with too many swing thoughts and you just cant possibly do them all. Then you get frustrated becasue it is not working.

[DavidFehertysBike]

I strongly agree with the above post. It sounds like you are trying to do everything you need mechanically but you're getting stuck on it. The only thing in my head from the momment I ground the club (at the range or on the course) is target. Hit the target. Never ever swing a golf club without having a target.

Also you should check with a pro or a informed golfer and see if your body will allow you to do some of those things in the way you are attempting to do them. You could be forcing yourself into positions your body dosent want to accept.

[sonicblue]

I agree with both of you, thanks. When I play, I try (as much as possilble) to use whatever swing I have that day and focus more on course management, scoring, etc..., not play swing coach mid-round. At the range I do try to focus more on positions or particular swing mechanics. However, I agree that everyone's body can't do the same things. As much as I point out specific things above, I try not to say, "make yourself look like this," more like, "this position implies this fundamental mistake," if that makes sense. As far as my positions at impact, the details only back up the fact that I'm uncomfortable. I may not look like Tiger when I'm "fixed," but I do have to find my own position that IS comfortable and that I can repeat.

As far as hokey subconscious, not hokey at all, I agree! I'm just finding myself unable to do it, especially now knowing what I'm swinging like. I'm not going to pull some "I'm changing it all!!!" craziness, and I'll continue to make due (do?) with what I have if I hit the course, but I need to put myself on a path to consistency, and this swing is not headed there.

[Avid Golfer]

Like they say, you never know what you're doing until you see for yourself. I recorded my swing, and I'm disgusted, discouraged and absolutely lost. The things I thought I was making progress on, I am unequivocally no better at, maybe even getting worse.

My question to you would be what are you working on to change your swing? Changing your setup can often lead to change better than trying to swing into positions will. When you say you are trying to flatten your swing plane which plane are you talking about (there are many planes in the swing)?

Your camera angle isn't the best, but here is my thoughts: For #2 shortening your swing: At setup: your lower body posture looks weak. Your legs look pretty straight. If you have slight knee flex (so that they are just over your shoe laces) they will provide better resistance so that your hips don't over rotate, and in turn will reduce your shoulder rotation. At setup your upper arms also look extended and seperated from your body. Having your upper arms closer to the sides of your chest will help reduce the independent arm movement during the swing. Swing drill: Tuck a towel between your armpits and your chest. Make 1/2 to 3/4 swings keeping the towel in place (you don't want it to fall out). Hit twenty balls with the towel tucked for everyone you hit without it. After you've hit twenty to fifty balls with the towel tucked under your arms and then take it away you'll still have the sensation of the in sync arm and body movement and you'll notice quite a difference in the way your swing feels. For #3: Your setup adjustments and the drill mentioned above should help to automatically correct your transition issue. If you still want a drill to do to work on getting your arms to drop down on a sallower angle you could try either: keeping your back to the target, lifting your left shoulder upward to start down, dropping your right elbow to your right hip, or holding your right shoulder in place while you start down (or any combination of the above). For #4: Your impact position will automatically improve as your other parts improve. If you're not convinced by changes in your ball contact and ball flight that your doing the correct thing video tape yourself for feedback. You may also want to video tape yourself doing the towel drill to see how it puts your swing in different positions then you are in on this video. When you video tape position the camera half way between your feet and the ball from the down the line view. Finally you need to stick to doing the drills more than pounding balls. Doing it for 5 minutes and then walking off to play a round it isn't going to stick, and your muscles will revert back to what they are used to doing. Take that for what you will.

[sonicblue]

Avid - you're dead on with my lower body. Problem: I've had five operations on my right knee and, to quote my doctor, it is "twenty years ahead of its time." I struggle to keep myself well-supported. I know that's a big hindrance; when I can concentrate on it, it's good; when I forget, it's awful. Yes, my legs are way too straight, which I think then leads to my increased lean forward.

After seeing the vid, I now realize how my arms are too far out. Clearly, my overall posture and setup need work. I'm hoping with that, and less activity in my hands/arms, I get to a better top position and a smoother transition. Like you said, I'm just going to go with that for now and see if/how my impact improves.

Great advice, thanks.

[Hustle]

First off you seem to have a great athletic setup, but if you notice in the video your head is looking at the third pole, your hips are pointed at the second pole and your shoulders are pointed at the first.... Just my observation.

[MPS67]

First off you seem to have a great athletic setup, but if you notice in the video your head is looking at the third pole, your hips are pointed at the second pole and your shoulders are pointed at the first.... Just my observation.

Good eye Hustle. Even though the camera perspective isn't directly behind you SonicBlue, I agree that your address alignment isn't as good as could be. If anything, your hips could be a degree or two open while the shoulders up to five degrees closed. It appears as though your feet & hips are O.K., but your shoulders are open. Closing the shoulders will help you turn back a little easier.

I also noticed that you lift up an inch or two during image3. Try to keep your posture level here. And speaking of posture, it doesn't appear that you maintain it in the downswing. It looks a little upright to me. I also agree that your upper arms are too separated and not connected. If you can hold your spine angle while keeping better connectivity during the downswing, you'll have an easier time in hitting and releasing later. In the last image, IMHO, the problem is not in your wrist hinge, but rather your left arm and elbow flailing out from a lack of connection. You'll want finish up with the left elbow in and up against your chest.

[sonicblue]

This is definitely something I'll look into, but I believe it's more likely the camera isn't providing a good view. Not only is it not directly behind me (my bad), but the ground at that range isn't very level at all. Who knows, that problem may actually be making me look MORE aligned! :lol

I went to the range at lunch and tried to just work on a couple basics:

1) Posture: more natural hang to my arms at address, more stability in my knees and adjusting my spine angle as necessary to achieve good club/ball position.

2) "Connecting" the shoulders/arms/hands triangle and swinging in one piece, especially concentrating on shortening my backswing and not rushing the transition, and then (with, hopefully, a proper inside approach) letting my arms swing/release.

It's definitely hitting the proper areas of need. I hit several balls where I actually felt like my "pop" was coming more easily and at, or even slightly after, impact, instead of two feet prior. I still pulled several balls, but I think that's just my hands still compensating. Overall, a decent amount of progress for an hour's time.

I'm going to try to get another clip at the proper viewing angle soon.

[Hustle]

Good eye Hustle. Even though the camera perspective isn't directly behind you SonicBlue, I agree that your address alignment isn't as good as could be. If anything, your hips could be a degree or two open while the shoulders up to five degrees closed. It appears as though your feet & hips are O.K., but your shoulders are open. Closing the shoulders will help you turn back a little easier.

hEY FRIEND, (I just can not bring myself to say "eat my ....)

Anywho, what do ya'll make of his right heel coming up off the ground?

[JaY_B]

Your down swing is too 'outside the line' if you will, basically you are coming over the top, the rest of your swing is pretty solid.

A quick fix for you will be to aim your shoulders right of the target, this will feel odd, but anything in golf that feels bad is good. Trust me.

[DavidFehertysBike]

This thread is kinda disturbing...the guy is worried about his game and he is getting pulled in 100 different directions..I hope he is picking out only what he feels in helpful to him.

[sonicblue]

Your down swing is too 'outside the line' if you will, basically you are coming over the top, the rest of your swing is pretty solid.

You're right, but I'm nervous about a "quick fix." It's pretty clear that I just need to work on shortening my backswing and taking my arms out of it. This should set me at a better top position, which hopefully will be the key to a proper downswing plane and impact path.

[JaY_B]

You're right, but I'm nervous about a "quick fix." It's pretty clear that I just need to work on shortening my backswing and taking my arms out of it. This should set me at a better top position, which hopefully will be the key to a proper downswing plane and impact path.

Sorry, 'quick fix' was probably the wrong phrase to use, do not be nervous about a 'quick fix' because all I suggested was an improvement in your fundamentals, the golf swing cannot be successfully performed without a solid set up. Your set up, mainly your shoulders pointing left of the target at address is causing a steep back swing, a lack of shoulder turn and as a result a steep and over the top down swing, the correct fix (not a quick fix) for this fault is so square up or even point your shoulders right of the target.

JaY_B

[sonicblue]

Thx, Jay. Others have mentioned my alignment, too, so I'm going to look at that more closely.

Feherty - you're right, asking for advice is always tenuous, but I think everyone here has hovered around the same concepts, which are also the ones that "feel" wrong to me, so I think this has been relatively unchaotic in terms of span of advice.

[JaY_B]

This thread is kinda disturbing...the guy is worried about his game and he is getting pulled in 100 different directions..I hope he is picking out only what he feels in helpful to him.

I hope he improves his fundamentals, other than that there is little point in asking our advise, there are many factors we cannot comment on simply because we only get a 10 second clip of his swing.