Why Is a Full Shoulder Turn So Important?

[jfrain2004]

Just getting to grips with what my instructor was trying to teach me last day, ie a full shoulder turn. I didn't get round to asking him WHY this was so important.
Prior to this I had a tendency to hit weak slices and did not have great distance but last evening when practising I got the hang of it and had to stop and pinch myself when I found my 8 iron carrying over 140 yrds.
When I get the left shoulder all the way round till it's level with the ball and a gentle downswing the ball just simple explodes off the face with almost no effort.
Problem is I don't feel comforatble with doing something which I can't understand the reason for. I've only added a small bit extra to my shoulder turn but it seems to have made a huge difference. Why does an 80 degree turn not achieve similar results? And if I try to go much past a 90deg turn it seems to give very little extra in terms of distance. What si so critical about this full turn?

[JimmyDoesGolf]

It is likely that during the full turn, you are producing more torsion in your lower body between your hips and your shoulders, creating more power in the downswing, with seemingly less effort.

[jfrain2004]

I appreciate that a 10% increase in turn should yield about a 10% increase in power imparted to the ball but it seems to be way more. Also the ball flies a lot higher and straighter, almost to the point where it draws a little. This is all a welcome improvement from that damm fade/weak slice

[tm22721]

I think that a full shoulder turn may help you but I got rid of my slice only after starting the down swing with my hips instead of the hands.

[beisenhauer]

I appreciate that a 10% increase in turn should yield about a 10% increase in power imparted to the ball but it seems to be way more. Also the ball flies a lot higher and straighter, almost to the point where it draws a little. This is all a welcome improvement from that damm fade/weak slice

Actually, a 10% increase in shoulder turn should yield greater than a 10% increase in power. Warning: engineer-speak ahead. The amount of energy stored in a spring, which is essentially what your torso is during the golf swing, is proportional to the

square of its displacement. Translation: If you stretch a spring twice as far, you get four times the energy. If you turn 10% farther, you get about 20% more power. Personally, I find that if I don't make a full turn, then I tend to swing out-to-in, whereas a full turn allows me to come more from the inside.

[JaY_B]

Tbh, Shoulder turn is not as important as people make out, coil is, shoulder turn isnt.

You can hit the ball with little shoulder turn.

[iacas]

Tbh, Shoulder turn is not as important as people make out, coil is, shoulder turn isnt.

Huh? Define "little"? I can hit the ball with no shoulder turn, but it ain't goin' very far.

I also think that for a lot of people, coil is shoulder turn (against a lower body with less turn). "Shoulder turn" is almost their definition of "coil." Shoulder turn is important. I've yet to see a good golfer with less than 60 degrees of shoulder turn, and the ones in the 60s and 70s are pretty rare indeed. Even a guy like Kenny Perry gets it to more than 90°.

[CG031]

Yeah shoulder turn is one of your main sources of power. I don't have enough shoulder turn, that's why I hit the ball so short. I'm in the midst of changing that , that's part of what I'm doing when I go to my lesson next week.

[DiverDown]

Actually, a 10% increase in shoulder turn should yield greater than a 10% increase in power. Warning: engineer-speak ahead. The amount of energy stored in a spring, which is essentially what your torso is during the golf swing, is proportional to the

I agree that it has more to do with swing plane than power. If you don't get a full shoulder turn in the club will have are time coming from the inside and you'll find yourself trying to manipulate the plane coming back down. Lord knows what could happen after that. Typically weak fade/slice as you noted in your swing, and also what happens to me if I get sloppy on backswing.

[cbe_golfer]

Tbh, Shoulder turn is not as important as people make out, coil is, shoulder turn isnt.

A good shoulder turn is the basis for any consistent repeating swing. Will you please let us know how you go about creating coil without shoulder turn?

[ks8829]

If you are talking about a full shot the reason the full shoulder turn is important is that you are matching your full shoulder turn with your full hip turn and returning the club face square to the ball.

If you do not take a full shoulder turn your club face is left open and thats why you hit the slices or push shots to the right.

If you try this in slow motion you will see what I mean but watching the club face at impact when the shoulders are not turned fully.

if you take you backswing too fast it will be harder to synchronize your hips and shoulder. Try taking your club away slowly so that you can complete the full shoulder turn. also have some one watch you or video tape yourself.

good luck and have fun!

[JaY_B]

A good shoulder turn is the basis for any consistent repeating swing. Will you please let us know how you go about creating coil without shoulder turn?

Shoulder turn is important, my point was shoulder turn is not the be all and end all of the golf swing.

[immts007]

When playing lately I've been pretty successful at banishing all mechanical thoughts from my mind save one: brush my chin with my shoulder on the back swing. All other thoughts are are before the swing and are about locking in on a target, balance, full breaths, wide shoulders, etc...

When I do that, I hit much better shots than when I don't. Especially with driver.

So... I don't need to understand the physics behind it - It just works. That's proof enough for me

Although the mechanics/physics are interesting, the proof is in the puddin!

[iacas]

Shoulder turn is important, my point was shoulder turn is not the be all and end all of the golf swing.

I don't think I'm being unfair in suggesting that you SAY THAT the first time around. Instead, you said "shoulder turn doesn't matter, but coil does."

That's not at all the same thing as what you've just said... particularly since shoulder turn is a component of coil.

[cbe_golfer]

Shoulder turn is important, my point was shoulder turn is not the be all and end all of the golf swing.

I'll let u go this time but if your handicap is true, I think you play better than you can teach. The golf swing indeed is complex and can be done a few different ways like Furyk or Rocco but without shoulder turn..you are better off selling real estate on Pluto.

[Avid Golfer]

Tbh, Shoulder turn is not as important as people make out, coil is, shoulder turn isnt.

I agree that a large shoulder turn isn't as important as some people try to make it. Among the pros Trevor Immelman is a good example of this point. Immleman was 4th in driving distance at the Masters, is longer than the average PGA Tour player, and he doesn't make nearly as big a shoulder turn as some of the other pros (nor as big a shoulder turn as he is capable of making).

Just getting to grips with what my instructor was trying to teach me last day, ie a full shoulder turn. I didn't get round to asking him WHY this was so important.

There are deminishing returns when you reach a certain point. As shown in the picture of Immelman above once you are turned behind the ball you've got your power loaded behind the ball. There is not much (if any) of a benefit to turning any further. The only thing continuing to turn past that point is going to

possibly do is build more coil. If your hips make a big turn too then you aren't going to build any more coil. Like Jim Mclean's X-Factor and X-Factor Stretch studies say its the difference between your shoulder turn and hip turn which produces coil, and potentially gives you more distance. As you can see in the images below some pros (Immelman, Baddeley, and Faldo) make relatively small shoulder turns while others (ex: Garcia) make very large turns.

That doesn't mean the large shoulder turn is necessarily going to lead to more distance. A good downswing is still necessary to generate power. Sergio Garcia for example gets his power from the club shallowing out and dropping behind him (which retains the wrist hinge). As you can see in the pictures of Garcia in the image below his shoulders and back is still facing the target while his arms have dropped and his hips have unwound. (The same can be seen with Immelman in the image below). That keeps power stored to be delivered to the ball at impact.

[JaY_B]

I'll let u go this time but if your handicap is true, I think you play better than you can teach. The golf swing indeed is complex and can be done a few different ways like Furyk or Rocco but without shoulder turn..you are better off selling real estate on Pluto.

No offence, but all your saying is a copy of what you have read in instructional articles, understanding and teaching the golf swing has more depth than being able to say "turn your shoulders 90 degrees and your hips 45 degrees" etc etc. For example I believe that more hip turn on the back swing is more effective than a restricted hip turn, but this isn't what traditional instructional articles will tell you. I do like to study the swing and have spoken too some very good teachers, one of whom who I am trying to get too know has worked with Rory Mcilroy and spends a lot of time on the Bio Mechanics of the swing. No I do not know everything about the swing (no where near everything in fact) and no I am not the best teacher in the world (although I am a lot better one to one than I am over the internet) but tbh I have my own theories which I have come up with after watching lots of people hit golf balls, if what I say does not agree with you it does not make me wrong. JaY_B

[cbe_golfer]

First you say shoulder turn is not so important. Then you say more hip turn and not restricted hip turn. Wonder where your coil comes from. And this is not just from reading instructional books. Its plain old common sense and hitting a lot of golfballs too. Your theories dont add up buddy.