LPGA to require English proficiency

[NM Golf]

Those who can't speak English were unavailable for comment.

LMFAO

I agree with Erik completely, it seems like this has gotten into a political or racial argument. This is not racially motivated, I am sure the LPGA couldn't give a rats ass who wins all these tournaments, as long as the people doing it can somewhat connect with the fans while its being done. Its been said that the Koreans would rather be on the range instead of learning english, and that the Americans would rather catch the finale of American Idol than practice. Well that in itself may be the problem. Maybe the Koreans need to realize that if they do not help fix this problem they themselves will suffer. They may need to learn to assimilate a little into the culture where they have chosen to live. They come here for the golf and the opportunity to play for a lot of money, then help out your tour and learn a little english so you can be more entertaining. Is that so much to ask? As Erik said, as Americans we love to "adopt" people and bring them into our hearts. Look at some of the men on the PGA Tour. Sergio, Vijay, Camillo, Adam Scott they all are foreign but are adored for the most part by the American viewing public. I like watching those guys as much as anyone. So again realize that all this legal jargon an what-not is pointless. And even if legally the LPGA is forced to end this policy they have gotten their point across. If you are on this tour you need to do what you can to be a good member. Good members should try to be marketable and grow the LPGA Tour.

[N.V.M.]

look what's happening just a few miles from me:

http://www.canada.com/vancouversun/n...e63235&k;=13342

A prominent private Metro Vancouver golf club has an English-language policy for its prospective members similar to the one the LPGA Tour has said it plans to implement for its international players. Vancouver Golf Club in Coquitlam, B.C.'s second-oldest golf course, has recently begun rejecting membership applications from individuals who can't speak English. General manager Brent Gough, whose club has played host to two previous LPGA Tour events and hopes to land another one within the next five years, said the club changed its policies after it encountered problems with some of its new Korean members.

[GolfGirl]

Wonder who sent you this info..............HAHA

[iacas]

I heard Carolyn Bivens, the LPGA commissioner, speak on a sports review shows on ESPN the other day, and they asked her about the meeting with the Koreans. Her take, it wasn't where the announcement was made, it wasn't as if they were revealing the policy directed to them...but it was meant to be a discussion with the Koreans about the policy and what it meant BEFORE the announcement was made. From there, the information leaked.

That parallels the information I heard, too. Agree with the rest of what you said as well.

[iacas]

I'm getting tired of

these types of comments:

The world of sport is supposed to be a true meritocracy. You should be measured by your skill, not your personality or parents or linguistic prowess. If Seve Ballesteros was subject to a rule like this one, he never would have won the 1980 Masters.

Bullcrap. I heard it said about Angel Cabrera at Oakmont, too.

Not a single one of the "majors" on the PGA Tour requires PGA Tour membership. You simply have to qualify to enter, and players from many different Tours all qualify just fine. I don't care if you disagree, but don't make crap like that up to "support" your position.

[gbk56]

It certainly can be interpretted as being directed at the South Koreans, BUT if they do not take it that way, then it will not be a problem with them. They may feel bad that they have had the opportunity to learn enough English to communicate with pro-am partners, fans, and the media, and realize that they did not what they should have done. Apparently, their leader and mentor, Se Ri Pak is not objecting. That tells us a lot right there.

SeRi Park did OBJECT. She stated "SUSPENSION" is too harsh. Many of the PGA tour players have stated similar objections. KJ Choi, Padrig Harrington and Angel Cabrea to name a few.

Practically speaking I do not think any of the Korean players will be effected. I live in Korea and a large portion of the population knows enough of the langauge to get by. There are many foreigners living and working in Korea and I would say a large number of that population cannot speak the korean, myself included. There are also a good amount of US athletes playing for professional baseball and basketball teams in Korea. They can barely say hello in Korean.

[gbk56]

look what's happening just a few miles from me:

Are you applauding this kind of behavoir?

[Harry Longshanks]

Are you applauding this kind of behavoir?

gbk-

I'm not making any comment on the policy in the article, but I would like to know how you would deal with the problem that the club claims it had (and let's assume for the sake of discussion that the problems alleged are real and not some sort of smokescreen): That the large content of Korean members had so little comprehension of English that they were breaking club rules, not responding to club inquiries, and generally unable to communicate on a basic level with other members and club administration. I have a few ideas, but in practice they put an inordinate burden on the club to accommodate members who don't speak English. I'm interested in hearing your opinion(s).

[gbk56]

And so what if it's "learn a little English or be suspended if you fail a test?" They're not asking them to know a lot of English. Again, they have a frickin' year and some odd months, and new members have two years.

The point is they are making something mandatory to a class of players that does not have anything to do with playing golf. I would have a problem with a policy that stated all players with a southern accent must pass a test to speak proper english with no southern accent by 2009 or be suspended until you lose your accent.

[gbk56]

gbk-

I would give them three strikes and you're out. You join a club you follow the rules. If you can't understand the rules find some way to familiarize yourself with the rules because if you break the rules you will be kicked out just like anyone else. It really is not a language problem.

I live in Korea and cannot speak the language. I am expected to know all the laws and if I break the law, "I do not know the language" is not an excuse. I find ways to familiarize myself with the rules. You break the rules too many times you get kicked out just like anyone else. I know a lot of times people know the rules but use langauge as an excuse. Ignorance of a rule is not an excuse.

[Harry Longshanks]

The point is they are making something mandatory to a class of players that does not have anything to do with playing golf. I would have a problem with a policy that stated all players with a southern accent must pass a test to speak proper english with no southern accent by 2009 or be suspended until you lose your accent.

(Playing Devil's Advocate here):

But speaking English, according to the LPGA, has a lot to do with growing the business of the LPGA. The LPGA, like every other sport, is not ONLY about the sport itself. Otherwise, why would the NFL have personal conduct policies (like the kind that got Pacman Jones and Tank Johnson suspended)? Why would the NBA have a dress code? Why would the New York Yankees have a grooming policy? All of these policies have nothing to do with the athletic abilities of the players. They have to do with improving the image of the respective sports leagues. Because better image = more money for everyone involved. And as someone originally from the South, I take (very mild) offense at the inference that speaking with an accent means one is not speaking "proper" English. Everyone has some sort of an accent. Everyone. Besides, having an accent does not mean you cannot give TV interviews, communicate with pro-am partners, etc. It is a faulty analogy.

[julie_m]

The point is they are making something mandatory to a class of players that does not have anything to do with playing golf.

There is precedent for this, here are three that pop into my mind:

http://www.nba.com/news/player_dress_code_051017.html http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/story/7...al-...-for-now http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=2269963 Thoughts?

[Harry Longshanks]

I would give them three strikes and you're out. You join a club you follow the rules. If you can't understand the rules find some way to familiarize yourself with the rules because if you break the rules you will be kicked out just like anyone else. It really is not a language problem.

And what about their inability to socialize or be friendly with the other members? The whole idea behind a private club is to create a friendly group of people who (for the most part) know each other, are comfortable around one another, and who socialize. Members of a private club want an inclusive, "family"-like feeling. Otherwise, just make it a public access course.

[gbk56]

You're right, and that's one of the problems I have with this policy. But how do you police whether someone properly treated their pro-am partners well? The LPGA already has a policy of fining players when they get complaints from their pro-am participants.

Why aren't they suspended? The foreign players will be suspended if they do not speak English well enough irregardless if they are entertaining their ProAm players.

Because only the Koreans treat it like a practice round. Paula Creamer, Lorena Ochoa, Annika... they all get that it's a business and they have to schmooze. They go out of their way to engage their pro-am partners. I've seen it.

Then suspend the Koreans that treat it as a practice round. I have played many rounds with people wh cannot speak English. We have a great time trying to learn each other langauge and figuring out how different golf terms are said in their langauge. We end up using a lot of body langauge and sign language but it is hilarious.

If that were the case, it might be wrong (but that's a discussion for another time). Fortunately, it's not the case, and you seem to have ignored all the stated reasons. Why do you have trouble accepting what the LPGA Tour is saying at face value instead of trying to read a bunch of racism or prejudice into it? The LPGA has a marketability problem, and a sponsor-generated problem, and they're trying to solve it.

Because the way it has been presented and the way they say they will implement it opens the whole system to abuse. Maybe they have the best intentions, but obviously many see that something does not seem right.

The casual sports fan will watch a golf tournament if it's compelling. We see it every time Tiger Woods plays.

Yep, not watching for the interview afterwards or Tigers command of the English language.

You and I may be exceptions, but the average golf fan doesn't watch the LPGA Tour. Part of the reason is the number of "nameless" Koreans that dominate. True, part of their "namelessness" might be that all of their names are somewhat similar, but another part of their "namelessness" is the complete and utter lack of personality. No doubt they HAVE personality, but the casual golf fan doesn't ever get to see any of it. They cannot connect with the players.

I do not think it is a langauge problem. I didn't know Paula from Natalie from Morgan a couple years ago. But after watching for a while I began to recognize them from the clothes they wore and their playing styles. Truthfully, I have never heard any of them speak much and really do not know much about them. I just like to watch good play.

Look, guys, Korean players (the ones who speak English) are behind this rule, and even a few of the ones who are in the process of learning English. Angela Park, Se Ri Pak, and others - they get it, so who are we to take up arms against something THEY SUPPORT

SeRi Park stated that she thinks "SUSPENSION" is too severe. She disagrees with the LPGA of this aspect.

[gbk56]

And what about their inability to socialize or be friendly with the other members? The whole idea behind a private club is to create a friendly group of people who (for the most part) know each other, are comfortable around one another, and who socialize. Members of a private club want an inclusive, "family"-like feeling. Otherwise, just make it a public access course.

It is a private club. Interview them and see if their personality fits in with the personality of the club. I can only speak English and I have people I socialize with who cannot speak English. I have a great time.

I know a lot of people who speak English who I would rather not socilaize with.

[gbk56]

There is precedent for this, here are three that pop into my mind:

This applies to all players and is not closely related to nationality as stated under title vii.

The LPGA is targeting foreign players.

[Harry Longshanks]

It is a private club. Interview them and see if their personality fits in with the personality of the club. I can only speak English and I have people I socialize with who cannot speak English. I have a great time.

They are interviewing the prospective members. The prospective members can't understand the questions or carry on a conversation.

I know a lot of people who speak English who I would rather not socilaize with.

Statements like that really don't help your argument. Everyone knows that personalities don't mesh sometimes, but that has nothing to do with whether the policy is (a) legal, or (b) beneficial. You're just hurting your position with comments like that.

[Harry Longshanks]

This applies to all players and is not closely related to nationality as stated under title vii.

No, they are targeting non-English speakers.

Whether that policy has a disparate impact on a certain nationality is a different issue.