Is there such thing as a 'max' for each hole?

[kekoa]

I was playing a buddy a few week ago and he hit two OB off the tee and from my count, took a 13. When i asked him for a score on the next tee, he said he is taking the max (10=double par). I proceeded to tell him there is no such thing as a 'max.' If he hits the ball 30 times on one hole, then he takes a 30. Am i correct?

[907golfer12]

I was playing a buddy a few week ago and he hit two OB off the tee and from my count, took a 13. When i asked him for a score on the next tee, he said he is taking the max (10=double par). I proceeded to tell him there is no such thing as a 'max.' If he hits the ball 30 times on one hole, then he takes a 30. Am i correct?

For handicapping there is Equitable Stroke Control (ESC), which says if you handicap is X, the highest score you can shoot on any hole is X. But in tournament play there is no max to a hole, but for handicapping ESC come into play, and there is a max, which for your handicap the max score for any hole is Double Bogie.

[Zeph]

You are both correct, but as 907golfer12 said, it depends what kind of game you are playing.

Here's the table of the maximum number of shots on any hole, depending on your handicap:

Equitable Stroke Control Chart

Course Handicap------Maximum Score

0-9----------------------Double Bogey
10-19-------------------7
20-29-------------------8
30-39-------------------9
40 or more-------------10

This goes for any hole. For a hcp 10-19, if it's a par 3 you can use 7 shots, if it's a par 5 you can use 7 shots. On the par 3 it'll be a 4 over par, while on a par 5 it's only a double bogie. It's only when you reach single digits that the max score for any hole is double bogie. Meaning you'll max at 5 shots on a par 3, 6 shots on a par 4 and 7 shots on a par 5.

In stroke play you must finish every hole, there is no max. If you play a handicap tournament you should always pick up when you've used your maximum number of shots, playing on does not give you higher or lower score, but you won't waste time finishing. If you are on the green and have to wait for the group ahead you can always finish if you like, but with 2 balls OB from the tee you should think about resigning that hole and take your max no. of shots. With shot no. 4 from the tee you'll have to play pretty good to score some points.

[Shindig]

I was playing a buddy a few week ago and he hit two OB off the tee and from my count, took a 13. When i asked him for a score on the next tee, he said he is taking the max (10=double par). I proceeded to tell him there is no such thing as a 'max.' If he hits the ball 30 times on one hole, then he takes a 30. Am i correct?

There is no max, except some high scores necessitate lowering your score *after the round* before posting your handicap - and for this purpose only!

Strokes he takes = strokes for his score. However, when posting for his handicap, he must reduce some holes to a given maximum based on his course handicap. But if he makes a 15, even if he's otherwise a scratch player, he can't just pick up at double bogey and write it down. This causes arguments in nassaus all the time, I imagine. "Oh, I cannot take more than a bogey for this hole. Write me down for bogey." That having been said, he could have claimed a 9 with two mulligans

[AlCzervik]

If im with people who want to do that, then i just say double par. They usually only do this so they dont get extremely frustrated and have a single hole ruin their whole afternoon.

[Smallville]

That works for handicap purposes (although I don't agree . . . you should write down what you get and it should affect your handicap. You should get a score, not an ESC) and if you aren't playing for money. How would you like to be playing with someone even up and lose by one when they took an ESC but you didn't and you lost the bet?

If you happen to put 6 balls into the lake on one hole it will mess up your score for the day but unless you did that all the time, you'd see a minimal change in your handicap because of that one bad hole.

[zeg]

That works for handicap purposes (although I don't agree . . . you should write down what you get and it should affect your handicap. You should get a score, not an ESC) and if you aren't playing for money. How would you like to be playing with someone even up and lose by one when they took an ESC but you didn't and you lost the bet?

I think the ESC makes sense to keep changes to HCP slow -- as you pointed out, a single bad hole on a round isn't likely to wind up in your best N scores that are used for handicap index calculation.

But for any other purpose, you should always use your actual score. I'd never heard of anyone using the ESC for actual score comparison in competition. Is that a real format? Why would you do that instead of just give the strokes indicated by your handicap? Seems goofy and contrary to the rules of golf.

[wachesawgolfer]

No, there is no such thing under the Rules of Golf. Double the par is just an agreement between golfers (to break the Rules) to limit the score on blowup holes and speed up play. It has nothing to with ESC. Its the same as every putt "within the grip" is good. Some golfers may even think double par max is in the Rules, it is so common.

[zeg]

There's a par 3 near me that asks you to pick up after 6 strokes. Bugs me, but I guess they get a lot of n00bs who would take 15 strokes per hole. Still, I'd rather see a time limit per hole since that's at least consistent with the RoG.

[Smallville]

Aside from the fact that I don't think you should pick up at all, the big question I have is what score do you give yourself for that hole? If you pick up when you get to double par (say, an "8" on a Par 4). Do you give yourself an 8? What if you are still off the green? Then would it be an 8 STILL? Or would you add at least one more to get on and probably 2 putts (or more) and give yourself an 11 for picking up? Because it doesn't seem fair to the person who drops a putt for an 8 to tie a hole with someone who wasn't even on the green after 8. I asked this in another thread but couldn't get an answer.

Also for the people who pick up after a certain amount of shots, do you do this all the time? What if you are playing for money? Or do you just use the ESC for handicap purposes only but still finish out the hole to the bitter end and write down that 13? Even though for handicap purposes, it's only a 7? Do you tell someone you beat them by 3 when you really lost by 8 because you picked up at double par a couple of times but they never did the whole round?

[og512]

There's a par 3 near me that asks you to pick up after 6 strokes. Bugs me, but I guess they get a lot of n00bs who would take 15 strokes per hole. Still, I'd rather see a time limit per hole since that's at least consistent with the RoG.

I've seen that also. They do it keep people from holding everyone else up.

I have a couple friends who don't keep handicaps so they max out at 10 on a hole for betting purposes (they gamble on round scores). i don't do it but to each his own.

[Zeph]

In competitions playing with Stableford I always pick up when I don't have shots left to get any points. In stroke play competitions I play the ball into the cup since we don't have a limit there. I haven't read the rules, but I would guess the penalty would be disqualification if you pick up the ball in stroke play, as long as there are no rules that say you are allowed to.

It's not a problem as long as people know how this works and when to use it. In competitions and when playing for money, the only thing important is that everyone play by the same rules, if that is picking up according to ESC or playing every hole out, both are fine as long as everyone play by the rule.

[Smallville]

Obviously my examples do not include Stableford rules. Nor match play, best ball or any other games that aren't stroke play. When we talk about handicaps, we're talking about stroke play. It seems like in every thread like this someone brings up examples that aren't stroke play. It's obvious that there are some games where you don't need to hole out. I think the people on this board are intelligent enough to realize that. I also figured it was obvious if there is a question of max score, or when do you pick up and not finish a hole, you are talking about stroke play.