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Posted
I can say i don't think i have ever seen that. However, i very often see them play 2-2 or 3-3, half court, winner gets ball, no free throws, one pass minimum before shooting. I'm pretty sure those are not in the rule book for basketball but nobody cares. Why? Because they aren't hurting anybody and they are just having fun.

Seems to me that what you're referring to are different formats of the game. Golf has them too. Match play vs stroke play.....even differing games within the formats, 4 ball, scramble, alternate shot, etc.... and while one format may have slightly different rules from another, they still have rules. This picking and choosing which rules to follow and which to ignore just perplexes me. Don't misunderstand, I'm not trying to be judgemental.......live and let live. If people are supporting the sport and the local courses, that's great. I'm just curious why so many people feel that they couldn't have the same fun playing by the rules. Is it because their scores would likely be higher and they would somehow translate that into a less pleasurable experience?

In David's bag....

Driver: Titleist 910 D-3;  9.5* Diamana Kai'li
3-Wood: Titleist 910F;  15* Diamana Kai'li
Hybrids: Titleist 910H 19* and 21* Diamana Kai'li
Irons: Titleist 695cb 5-Pw

Wedges: Scratch 51-11 TNC grind, Vokey SM-5's;  56-14 F grind and 60-11 K grind
Putter: Scotty Cameron Kombi S
Ball: ProV1

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Posted
Seems to me that what you're referring to are different

A scramble isn't "golf." Match and stroke play are covered under the Rules of Golf - a "scramble" isn't.

Alternate shot - it still follows the rules of golf. And four ball is just a means of keeping score - you also still follow the rules. A scramble does not follow the rules. So I disagree with the idea. Golf has different formats, you're fine there. But some formats are still "golf" and others are just made up for giggles and don't follow the Rules of Golf.

Erik J. Barzeski —  I knock a ball. It goes in a gopher hole. 🏌🏼‍♂️
Director of Instruction Golf Evolution • Owner, The Sand Trap .com • AuthorLowest Score Wins
Golf Digest "Best Young Teachers in America" 2016-17 & "Best in State" 2017-20 • WNY Section PGA Teacher of the Year 2019 :edel: :true_linkswear:

Check Out: New Topics | TST Blog | Golf Terms | Instructional Content | Analyzr | LSW | Instructional Droplets

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Posted
Seems to me that what you're referring to are different

I doubt its so much as people picking and choosing rules, but unknowingly breaking a rule they didn't fully understand or know. But sometimes if you're out just to have fun with your buddies and whatnot, stay loose and enjoy it. Albeit, if it's in a tourney or a match I'm going to make sure I follow the rules... why? Because there are consequences. Not really any consequences if I'm out on a weekday afternoon with my co-workers and I fluff up a lie or unless we all agree on what we can't do. But it's to each his own, really.

edit: i don't keep an accurate handicap, mainly b/c i fluff a lie once in a while and actually.. when i hit into a hazard, i rehit from that same location. that number i have posted is to tell you i'm a hack and aren't that good lol

In my stand Bag:

R7 Superquad 10.5* Fujikura REAX 65-S
Hi-Bore XLS 19* Hybrid Dynamic Gold S300
MP-60 4 thru PW Dynamic Gold S300 .588 REG 54* SW Vokey 58* LWSTX Greeny IV putter


Posted
I have never really cared what anyone else does. If you are playing against me, we set the standard of play before we start... ie: play the ball down or bump it. I really hope you take mulligans and give putts, because your handicap will be lower than it should be.. which means I don't have to give as many shots. I play in a casual group that gives putts. We usually have 30 guys, and most are honest about what is good and not good. I could care less if someone is given a putt just outside the leather. It's not like we are playing for much money. There is nothing worse than watching the ladies play and count every single shot and have to finish every single putt, and mark a 6" putt because it might be in someone's line. We are not on the pro tour. I play because I enjoy the game. Every once in a while, we test someone on a 2 footer just to make them sweat just a little. But that is just fun.

My swing thoughts:

- Negative thinking hurts more than negative swinging.
- I let my swing balance me.
- Full extension back and through to the target. - I swing under not around my body. - My club must not twist in my swing. - Keep a soft left knee


Posted
What's the relevance of the dictionary definition? Is breaking a pane of glass like on the Big Break "golf"? No. How about "mini golf"? If you want to call a scramble "golf" but not the Big Break or Putt Putt, then your idea of where that "line" exists just varies from mine.

The relevance is that the dicitonary definition is socially acceptable by most, if not all of the people I know.

Would I consider putt putt golf? It wouldn't be any different than how I reference T-ball, which I don't consider baseball, so no. I don't know enough about the Big Break to have an opinion. I suppose that I am still learning where that line is for me, and right now it's probably between a scramble and putt putt.

In the bag:
Driver: Rapture V2, 9 degree, stiff shaft
Fairway Woods: X-Hot 3 wood
Hybrid: 3H
Irons: J36 PC 4-PW Project X 6.0 Shafts, FlightedWedges: CG14, 50 54 and 58 degree Putter: Guerin Rife 2 Bar with Winn grip B330S Pro V1x


Posted
I play in a casual group that gives putts. We usually have 30 guys, and most are honest about what is good and not good. I could care less if someone is given a putt just outside the leather. It's not like we are playing for much money. There is nothing worse than watching the ladies play and count every single shot and have to finish every single putt, and mark a 6" putt because it might be in someone's line. We are not on the pro tour. I play because I enjoy the game. Every once in a while, we test someone on a 2 footer just to make them sweat just a little. But that is just fun.

The problem with this is that none of the guys you play with will ever have the thrill of breaking 100 or 90 or 80 or whatever because you don't score properly. The possibility of breaking a scoring milestone is a great motivator, and everyone you play with is denied that opportunity. I would hate to play and not truthfully know how I scored.

Reminds me of a great Harvey Penick story - Proud parents come into the pro shop and eagerly proclaim to Harvey that Junior had his first ever birdie today. Harvey says "That's great! How long was the putt?" Parents say "Oh we gave it to him, it was only 3 feet." Harvey says "Sorry folks, Junior hasn't had his firt birdie yet."

In the race of life, always back self-interest. At least you know it's trying.

 

 


Posted
The problem with this is that none of the guys you play with will ever have the thrill of breaking 100 or 90 or 80 or whatever because you don't score properly. The possibility of breaking a scoring milestone is a great motivator, and everyone you play with is denied that opportunity. I would hate to play and not truthfully know how I scored.

Yup... that anecdote from "The Little Red Book" pretty much sums it up. If you don't play by the rules, none of your achievements mean squat.

I sometimes even wonder why such people even bother to chime in on a rules discussion. If the rules are that meaningless to you, then why do you waste your time and mine?

Rick

"He who has the fastest cart will never have a bad lie."

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Posted
The relevance is that the dicitonary definition is socially acceptable by most, if not all of the people I know.

For you. I "define" golf as a game played by certain specific rules.

Besides, I'd argue that "under the rules of the game" are implied in the literal definition. Just because it's not stated doesn't mean it's not there or else all SORTS of things would be called "golf" under some definitions. If we had a "beating a dead horse" smiley, I'd use it here. The end.

Erik J. Barzeski —  I knock a ball. It goes in a gopher hole. 🏌🏼‍♂️
Director of Instruction Golf Evolution • Owner, The Sand Trap .com • AuthorLowest Score Wins
Golf Digest "Best Young Teachers in America" 2016-17 & "Best in State" 2017-20 • WNY Section PGA Teacher of the Year 2019 :edel: :true_linkswear:

Check Out: New Topics | TST Blog | Golf Terms | Instructional Content | Analyzr | LSW | Instructional Droplets

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Note: This thread is 6135 days old. We appreciate that you found this thread instead of starting a new one, but if you plan to post here please make sure it's still relevant. If not, please start a new topic. Thank you!

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    • Day 1: 2025.12.26 Worked on LH position on grip, trying to keep fingers closer to perpendicular to the club. Feels awkward but change is meant to.
    • Please see this topic for updated information:
    • Please see this topic for updated information:
    • When you've been teaching golf as long as I have, you're going to find that you can teach some things better than you previously had, and you're probably going to find some things that you taught incorrectly. I don't see that as a bad thing — what would be worse is refusing to adapt and grow given new information. I've always said that my goal with my instruction isn't to be right, but it's to get things right. To that end, I'm about five years late in issuing a public proclamation on something… When I first got my GEARS system, I immediately looked at the golf swings of the dozens and dozens of Tour players for which I suddenly had full 3D data. I created a huge spreadsheet showing how their bodies moved, how the club moved, at various points in the swing. I mapped knee and elbow angles, hand speeds, shoulder turns and pelvis turns… etc. I re-considered what I thought I knew about the golf swing as performed by the best players. One of those things dated back to the earliest days: that you extend (I never taught "straighten" and would avoid using that word unless in the context of saying "don't fully straighten") the trail knee/leg in the backswing. I was mislead by 2D photos from less-than-ideal camera angles — the trail leg rotates a bit during the backswing, and so when observing trail knee flex should also use a camera that moves to stay perpendicular to the plane of the ankle/knee/hip joint. We have at least two topics here on this (here and here; both of which I'll be updating after publishing this) where @mvmac and I advise golfers to extend the trail knee. Learning that this was not right is one of the reasons I'm glad to have a 3D system, as most golfers generally preserve the trail knee flex throughout the backswing. Data Here's a video showing an iron and a driver of someone who has won the career slam: Here's what the graph of his right knee flex looks like. The solid lines I've positioned at the top of the backswing (GEARS aligns both swings at impact, the dashed line). Address is to the right, of course, and the graph shows knee flex from the two swings above. The data (17.56° and 23.20°) shows where this player is in both swings (orange being the yellow iron swing, pink the blue driver swing). You can see that this golfer extends his trail knee 2-3°… before bending it even more than that through the late backswing and early downswing. Months ago I created a quick Instagram video showing the trail knee flex in the backswing of several players (see the top for the larger number): Erik J. Barzeski (@iacas) • Instagram reel GEARS shares expert advice on golf swing technique, focusing on the critical backswing phase. Tour winners and major champions reveal the key to a precise and powerful swing, highlighting the importance of... Here are a few more graphs. 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