How do you handle a cheater?

[Jeepthrills]

If this is an old topic, I appologize, but I have a problem in my league. We have a guy that does not count all of his strokes. Last night I counted four holes where he shaved a shot off.

Here's the dilema: It is a friendly league with no money or prizes at years end. We keep scores and handicaps and standings. The league is all friends and family. This guy is the partner of a lady that we have golfed with for abou 4-5 years and bowled with even longer. She is good friends with my mother-in-law and my wifes aunt, who are both in the league as well.

If this were a money league or somthing more compettetive I would have called him on it. The biggest problem I am having is does he even know he is doing it. On three of the holes, I gave him putts. On the fourth he had a full blown whiff. I was giving him 9 shots and then he gave himself 4 more. I essentially had to beat him by 13 last night.

Any advice for how to handle this?

[A.J.]

Start with "what'd you get there" as your walking to the next whole. If he's off by a stroke and you know it, gently remind him. Suggest something like "oh, I count X...did you miss that whiff?" Whatever you do, make sure its not harsh right off because you jeopardize the relationship and he might actually not realize he's doing it.

[BigAl5150]

AJ has a tactful solution. Mine not so much. Give him a copy of the USGA rulebook (or slip one in his bag when he is not looking). You stated that it is not a competitive league yet you keep standings and handicaps (sounds pretty offical to me). If he is not counting all his strokes, he is screwing the league. Ask around to the other players to see if he had an addition problem when they played against him (other people could ask him as well to count all the wiffs, etc.). If he being constantly reminded by his opponents about counting, he (hopefully) will start adding correctly.

[thehillgolfer]

or you could just smile and bear it...personally i dont like confrontation so i usually dont call anyone out on cheating or what not, even in a high school match, cuz i weigh both sides and i dont care enough to risk getting yelled at or defending my position or what not.

[sioutdoors]

yep give him a rules book 9 maybe even high light some parts) and then if it continues then tell him he is screwing up the whole leagues calculation maybe that will help

[muskegman]

It's a pity people have to play that way. A league stands or falls on the honesty of its members so he should be held accountable for that reason alone. I might be able to overlook someone lying about their score if it were only for bragging rights but not for a league.

Hopefully there is a way to do it without losing the friendship. A.J. is on to something there. When used right humor can be a way to suggest he plays by the rules. There is always the direct approach which really is the best way to deal with it. When you are direct and yet compassionate a lot of times people respond well too.

I hope you can get this resolved.

[kiwidave]

An 8 iron to the shin's normally work's .........................

[sole wolf]

Pull his shirt over his head and swing away oops wrong sport

Seriously, I would ask him what he got and then say "huh, I had you for a X, must have been wrong". Then he knows you are counting and paying attention and he will as well. Nobody wants to be "that guy" and as soon as they know they are then my bet is they stop.

[Froaderick]

Sounds like someone who just has to win no matter what it is. I played volleyball with someone like that. He tried getting away with every little thing and he finally got called on it. No one wants to be on his team now...

It's annoying but like others have said, if there's no money on the line, etc, then it may not be worth it. I guess it all depends. Does he rub it in everyone's face that he's got a better score? THEN it might be time to 'take em down'

[Maverick]

If this is an old topic, I appologize, but I have a problem in my league. We have a guy that does not count all of his strokes. Last night I counted four holes where he shaved a shot off.

As long as you don't play for money/prizes/drinks..don't worry about it..sounds like he's not a true gentleman of the game.

[Jeepthrills]

It's annoying but like others have said, if there's no money on the line, etc, then it may not be worth it. I guess it all depends. Does he rub it in everyone's face that he's got a better score? THEN it might be time to 'take em down'

He doesn't ever rub it in, because he isn't good enough to. We play on a short course with a par of 31. His average is 51. I did the math last night not including each team having two byes left at 6 points per week, unless my wife and I only take 10 points to their 26 then we already have it won with half a season to go. We currently have a 15 point lead. It's just very frustrating to pull off a great par save and know that the guy just made double and he gives himself a bogey.

[Froaderick]

Yea, I can see it being very frustrating because even though there's no prize involved, there still is the integrity of the game and playing fair. I can totally understand that...

[golfchief]

go with AJ's advise

[cdriver]

I had a good friend (and even better customer) I used to play with and he had a bad habit of forgetting strokes. I am not sure if it was intentional or not, but I started doing what Sole Wolf suggests, calling him on it. He looked accusingly at me and said, "Are you counting my strokes?" While smiling, I replied, "Well, yes. You seem to be having trouble with it." We both laughed, but it ended the stroke shaving.

[allin]

It sounds like he really doesn't consider it cheating, he may just be embarrassed by his poor scores, maybe an offer of a llittle help off the course. While helping with his game you could reinforce the importance of accurate scorekeeping if you want to improve. Perhaps he needs a little help becoming a real golfer? I know this may be to much to ask, but 25 years in social work has shown me that we rarely know what others motivation is. He is likely not trying to gain advantage, only avoid loss of status.

[ben619]

An 8 iron to the shin's normally work's .........................

Lmao, I think I might use that....

No seriously .A.J. has a real good suggestion, I'll use that sometime.

[Wood]

Easy. Don't ask his score for 3-4 holes. Just write down what you count. He'll realize you are counting, and not lie. Or, just say," that was a six, right?" Anything other than what you thought, and just start replaying his strokes out loud. This is a problem that will go away once he knows you are counting.

[wachesawgolfer]

In this case he only cheats himself by falsely lowering his handicap, doesn't he. The lower it goes without the skill, the less he wins. But, let him know you thought he had whatever on a hoile and he will know your counting also.