Bridgestone Thread

[zeg]

I agree 100% with the players being put on the clock. The most important rule of golf is that of equity, after all. Sure, "the clock" isn't part of the rules of golf, but rules of competition must be compatible with this founding principle of the game or they don't belong. Woods and Harrington were still playing against the entire field. Granting extra time to the leaders would give them an unfair advantage for the last few holes. As Harrington demonstrated, blow-ups can occur anywhere, and your tournament score is the same whether it's on the first hole of the first round or on the third-to-last of the last. Really, it surprises me to see so much outrage over applying the clock from people who generally seem to value the rules.

The fine? Well, I think it's silly to try to gag your players. But whatever, Tiger can pay it from the loose change in his solid gold couch. I don't think he'll mind.

[TN94z]

Another thing too is the fact that "BOTH" Tiger and Paddy were put on the clock. Tiger proceeded to hit his shots just fine. Paddy did not. So, while it may have been a contributing factor to Paddy's mishits....Tiger stayed strong. I guess that is the mental toughness factor that Tiger has over other players.

[Cesar]

I agree 100% with the players being put on the clock. The most important rule of golf is that of equity, after all. Sure, "the clock" isn't part of the rules of golf, but rules of competition must be compatible with this founding principle of the game or they don't belong. Woods and Harrington were still playing against the entire field. Granting extra time to the leaders would give them an unfair advantage for the last few holes. As Harrington demonstrated, blow-ups can occur anywhere, and your tournament score is the same whether it's on the first hole of the first round or on the third-to-last of the last. Really, it surprises me to see so much outrage over applying the clock from people who generally seem to value the rules.

I'd be interested to hear how you create "equity" in the size of galleries and number of cameras? Do you assign holes to galleries so each player has to play with the same amount of people watching? Same with the network cameras/reporters? Where is the equity in some scrub player barely making cuts playing in front of 25 people and zero cameras vs the zoo that Paddy and Tiger had to play in?

As much as some of you would lke to do, this is not a cookie cutter black and white issue. There is one hell of a lot of gray involved.

[RemyM]

For those of you using the gallery excuse, if that was the case then wouldn't Tiger's group be out of position every round of every tournament? That clearly isn't true. As far as the actual timing is concerned it does not start until you can play without distraction. If Harrington didn't take so long to hit the straight forward shots then they would have never been on the clock and he wouldn't have needed to be timed on the 16th hole.

[Leftygolfer]

I am fine with it all. I am not fine with the way Padraig played.

He should have looked at the guy, nodded, and played at no different pace than he all week. I am sure he was aware that he or tiger were the only two with a chance to win. If they doc him a stroke they would have to doc Tiger a stroke. I can't confirm that but if one player gets the penalty then the whole group does.

Can anyone confirm this?

[iacas]

The rule official should have consider the fact it was the last group and a very close match and consulted with higher up before making the decision to put them on the clock.

He is the higher up.

[SubPar]

So what is everyone's thoughts on Tiger being fined for his words about the official that put them on the clock. Tiger said that this caused Padraig to rush his shots and triple the 16th.

He was fined for disrespecting an official making a reasonable and proper ruling. If anyone wanted to blame the warning for the 8 on #16, that would be Padraig's call.

Woods should not have said what he did. I think he was bugged because it took the drama out of his win and made it look less glorious. SubPar

[Cesar]

For those of you using the gallery excuse, if that was the case then wouldn't Tiger's group be out of position every round of every tournament? That clearly isn't true. As far as the actual timing is concerned it does not start until you can play without distraction. If Harrington didn't take so long to hit the straight forward shots then they would have never been on the clock and he wouldn't have needed to be timed on the 16th hole.

I don't care about when the clock starts since my point is that they should never have been put on the clock to begin with.

As for the gallery, I don't know how the Sunday final pairings Tiger is in stack up in terms of being in or out of position. What I do know is that Paddy and Tiger finished the round in 4 hours and 2 minutes. May have been 4 hrs and 10 minutes (tops) if the officials weren't riding their asses. Big friggin deal!!! Maybe a hair over where you want them, but certainly not slow enough to taint what was shaping up to be the battle of the season. Talk about cutting off your nose to spite your face.

[ArrrrJay]

Tiger said in his PGA Championship press conference today that he was NOT fined, and that the report is erroneous.

He was asked a few more questions about the event, and the official, and his answers didn't change, and he commented the same as on Sunday. He was asked if he thought he shouldn't have used the officials name, and he replied "No, cause it was John who put us on the clock." No apologies from TW.

[TN94z]

He was fined for disrespecting an official making a reasonable and proper ruling. If anyone wanted to blame the warning for the 8 on #16, that would be Padraig's call.

Well, Padraig basically said that it "bothered" him. He wouldn't say that it was the reason, but he eluded to that fact. That is the reason he was fined, but if that is what he believes then I don't see an issue with him saying it. I am sure that Tiger knew he would be fined....it's not like they will fine him enough for him to notice. The money will probably just go to the first tee or something anyway, and it will be like a donation.

[Cesar]

He was fined for disrespecting an official making a reasonable and proper ruling. If anyone wanted to blame the warning for the 8 on #16, that would be Padraig's call.

Wrong. Paddy should have taken the high road, which is what he did. Anything less makes him look like a crybaby.

Woods was also in the right for speaking up on Paddy's behalf for exactly the same reason I listed above, because Paddy couldn't do it himself.

[topspin4hand]

Tiger said in his PGA Championship press conference today that he was NOT fined, and that the report is erroneous.

I heard the same press conference. I agree with those that say the fact that this was the final group and the large crowds should make a difference however, could the fact this final round was being covered on TV and the telecast was already running long have played into the decision? I have no idea if thats a consideration but in PA, the news came on almost immediately after Tiger won.

[ArrrrJay]

Tiger says he wasn't fined

Tiger Woods cleared the air Tuesday, saying he was not fined for critical remarks about a rules official during the final round of the Bridgestone Invitational.

[Cesar]

I heard the same press conference. I agree with those that say the fact that this was the final group and the large crowds should make a difference however, could the fact this final round was being covered on TV and the telecast was already running long have played into the decision? I have no idea if thats a consideration but in PA, the news came on almost immediately after Tiger won.

They talked about it on the Golf Channel after the tournament and said yes, CBS was involved in pressuring the PGA to get the tournament in by the alloted time.

Of course, this makes no sense at all since a playoff looked like a real realistic possibility anyway, but that's what they said.

[whetstone]

Fine or no fine:
The official was acting in accordance with the rules, no reason to fault him
Tiger showed class by sticking up for his opponent
There's a good chance Paddy would have blown up anyway with Tiger breathing down his neck, but we'll never know.

[DavidFehertysBike]

In Soviet Russia, Tiger Woods fines you!

[RemyM]

I am fine with it all. I am not fine with the way Padraig played.

That is incorrect. This is how it works; if the group is behind their time and out of position then they are subject to be put on the clock. They were 17 minutes behind their time after 15 holes and the group ahead of them was completed with 16, a par five, while they were still on 15 which put them out of position under the pace of play rule. When a group is “out of position” a player in the group is expected to play any stroke within 40 seconds.

The timing of a player’s stroke will begin when he has had a reasonable opportunity to reach his ball, it is his turn to play and he can play without interference or distraction. Except on the putting green, if a player has reached his ball, it is his turn to play and there are no distractions, timing will begin after he has reasonable time to select his club. Time spent walking backward or forward for determining yardages will count as part of the time taken for the next stroke. On the putting green, timing will begin after a player has been allowed a reasonable amount of time to lift, clean and replace his ball, repair his ball mark and other ball marks on his line of putt and remove loose impediments on his line of putt. Time spent looking at the line from beyond the hole and/or behind the ball will count as part of the time taken for the next stroke. NOTE: A player is permitted 40 seconds to play a stroke. An extra 20 seconds (for a total of 60 seconds) will be allowed for: a) The first player to play a stroke on a par-3 hole. b) The first player to play a second stroke on a par-4 or par-5 hole. c) The first player to play a third stroke on a par-5 hole. d) The first player to play a stroke around the putting green. e) The first player to play a stroke on the putting green. PENALTIES Once a group has been put on the clock, the following policy will go into effect for each player: 1st Bad Time - Warning from the official 2nd Bad Time - 1 Stroke Penalty 3rd Bad Time - 2 Additional Strokes Penalty So only one player could be penalized and it would take 2 bad times to cause a penalty.

[mcfc_nick]

I think the official did the right thing. They were out of position and had been for a LONG time. Padraig didn't make up any time - in fact, they lost time through the back nine.

ye but do you not think they could have let it slide seeing as they were the only real two in contention coming to the end of a WGC and they had what, 3 holes left?