Driving range professionals....

[TN94z]

I guess I won't ever understand why people would go to a golf course and instead of actually playing, go stand on a mat and hit 100+ balls at fictional targets "pretending" to play holes at their GC which is right behind them.

Because it is so much better to do that when you are making a serious change than it is to do it on the course. How many rounds would you have to play to be able to get in 300-500 balls in a couple hours?

[pxc]

I guess I won't ever understand why people would go to a golf course and instead of actually playing, go stand on a mat and hit 100+ balls at fictional targets "pretending" to play holes at their GC which is right behind them.

Imagine all those dumb PGA pros past and present wasting their time at the driving range. They should've talked to you, since you've got this whole golf thing figured out.

[kfowler]

I guess I won't ever understand why people would go to a golf course and instead of actually playing, go stand on a mat and hit 100+ balls at fictional targets "pretending" to play holes at their GC which is right behind them.

This post may actually even make Vijay Singh's blood pressure rise.

[roflslice]

Enduro spotted the hungry troll first!

On topic: I have only had a few approaches on the range. Most of the time it was a positive experience. I don't mind being mildly social at the range; but if I don't want to be bothered I'll just bring the ipod.

[Clambake]

When in my early teens, a guy walks up to me on the range, and starts giving advice -- and it was really good advice. He had a true knack for helping my swing. Later someone told me how fortunate I was that this particular fellow took an interest.......

I had to laugh when I read this because it reminded me of what happened with a friend of mine. Years ago he was just starting to take up golf and was spending some time at a range in Long Beach (CA). My friend used to play pro basketball and was still pretty athletic, but was kind of clueless about the golf swing. An older guy started watching him hit for awhile, then came over and made a couple suggestions. Then some more. They ended up working together for a few hours, and made an appointment to meet again the next day. The next day the teacher gave my friend an envelope with a copy of a manuscript inside and said "Here's a copy of a book I've got coming out". Turns out it was David Leadbetter who was in town with Faldo for the LA Open.

As you said, sometimes you get lucky!

[TN94z]

Enduro spotted the hungry troll first!

I don't mind being social one bit. I usually get out and there and end up in conversations about something before my practice is over. With that being said, I don't necessarily want someone to come up and start giving me advice. If someone walks up and says "Hey man, can I make a suggestion, " I will usually just humor them and let them tell me. Then I'll just respond with "I'll keep that in mind." I don't want to be a douche out there, but don't expect me to drop what I am doing and change my swing to fit your eye..

I had to laugh when I read this because it reminded me of what happened with a friend of mine. Years ago he was just starting to take up golf and was spending some time at a range in Long Beach (CA). My friend used to play pro basketball and was still pretty athletic, but was kind of clueless about the golf swing. An older guy started watching him hit for awhile, then came over and made a couple suggestions. Then some more. They ended up working together for a few hours, and made an appointment to meet again the next day. The next day the teacher gave my friend an envelope with a copy of a manuscript inside and said "Here's a copy of a book I've got coming out". Turns out it was David Leadbetter who was in town with Faldo for the LA Open.

That is incredible!! I wish I could get that lucky!

[bunkerputt]

Not saying this was the case with the two teens but someone can be a knowledgeable teacher and really struggle with their golf game. So high handicap does not always mean they don't know what they're talking about. Self application can be difficult. Vice versa, low handicap does not always mean a good teacher either. My dad is a 6 HCP and a terrible instructor.

Thank you. You've identified me in a nutshell. I've studied the golf swing quite extensively for the past few years and have yet to be considered a good ball striker.

[deronsizemore]

I can agree with that. For me though, if you can't take me out to the course and beat me, I don't really care to take lessons from you. My teacher could wear me out!!

Do you think any of the PGA Tour Pro's teachers can wear them out on the course? Doubtful. I don't think you've got to be a +4 handicap to be able to understand the golf swing and teach it well, but there's also a cut off point I believe. I mean someone is around scratch he/she likely knows the golf swing. Could even be a 5-8 handicap and know the swing and be able to teach it. But at some point the line has to be drawn. I don't think you have to be a plus handicap but if you're a 15+ handicap, please don't try to give advice. I personally don't believe it's possible for someone to know the swing well enough to teach it yet regularly shoot mid 80 scores. If you know the swing THAT well, you'll at least have a little game. Unless of course you're Harvey Pennick and wheel chair bound; you get a pass.

[TN94z]

Do you think any of the PGA Tour Pro's teachers can wear them out on the course? Doubtful.

Of course not, but you jumped to a totally different level there man

A PGA Tour Pro I am not! There is a cutoff to being a teaching professional. That is what I was saying earlier. Isn't that what the PAT program is about? You are basically saying what I was trying to say in my posts. I understand that there is a certain point where the teacher is a top teacher in the world, but can't beat Tiger, etc...But I am like you in thinking (aside from lacking the physical ability to do it) if you know the swing that well, you should have some game. I personally have never been to a teacher that doesn't have a great game. It's not that I look for that in a teacher. It just so happens that every teacher around my area have game. Are the a + handicapper? Probably not, but could be if they wanted to go that route. They just enjoy teaching rather than practicing continually. It is a lifestyle choice. As far as the examples about the Tour Pros not being beaten by their teachers...to me that is totally different. I go to a teacher to "learn" the proper way to swing. The tour Pros already know the proper way to swing. For instance, I don't look at Hank Haney as Tiger's "teacher." I look at him as more of a coach. He didn't "teach" Tiger the swing. He just coaches him through drills and camera work and spotting mistakes. These are two totally different things in my eyes.

[HytrewQasdfg]

So "old dude" gently walks over to me at a safe distance and watches me swing... "Oh, well then, you mind if I see a regular swing?". I agree...

That's when you went wrong. You're just validating his notion that somehow he has the divine right to critique your swing.

A better answer: "I do mind." Then go back to what you were woring on. IMHO, there are not many things ruder than walking up to someone and offering unsolicited advice. My take is if they are going to be rude, I should be rude right back.

[TN94z]

That's when you went wrong. You're just validating his notion that somehow he has the divine right to critique your swing.

That is a valid point!

[HytrewQasdfg]

I guess I won't ever understand why people would go to a golf course and instead of actually playing, go stand on a mat and hit 100+ balls at fictional targets "pretending" to play holes at their GC which is right behind them.

I also play the drums. One time I was practicing a particular technique on a drum pad. One hand. Just a little partial movement. Tap, tap, tap, tap tap... Finally my wife comes in and says "What's the point of doing that same tap over and over again. Why don't you just play something?"

The reason of course, is that by continually repeating that simple motion I eventually got to the point that I could do it without even thinking about it. It was ingrained into my memory (and ingrained as a CORRECT motion.) I can then incorporate it into my playing at will, with barely a thought (or worry that I will be doing it incorrectly.) Why practice on the range (or anyplace else?) Because you can focus on one little motion. Repeating it till you can do it perfectly every time.

[deronsizemore]

As far as the examples about the Tour Pros not being beaten by their teachers...to me that is totally different. I go to a teacher to "learn" the proper way to swing. The tour Pros already know the proper way to swing. For instance, I don't look at Hank Haney as Tiger's "teacher." I look at him as more of a coach. He didn't "teach" Tiger the swing. He just coaches him through drills and camera work and spotting mistakes. These are two totally different things in my eyes.

Fair enough, that's a good analogy.

Have to keep in mind too that majority of PGA teaching professionals do not have the luxury of playing 36 holes a day and practicing when they're not playing. If anything, they play even less than the weekend golfer because they've got duties at the course, give lessons, etc. I know some pros that I chat with regularly and I'll ask how they've been playing and their response is usually that they haven't touched a club in a few months. But, like we've said, there's still a line there. Even if you've not played in a few months you still know the swing and could teach someone and at worst would go out and shoot something mid-high 70's. There's way too many people who cannot break 90 giving bad advice. I hear it all the time on the range.

[Gerardv]

There's way too many people who cannot break 90 giving bad advice. I hear it all the time on the range.

That's not true, they break 90 all the time, just not today.

See, today they are playing worse than "I've ever played before." They also "have no idea what's wrong today." Some of us are hackers and play bad all the time. Then there are the driving range professionals who are always having a bad day.

[deronsizemore]

That's not true, they break 90 all the time, just not today.

Well that's true too. I know a couple people that "always shoot 75 or below" until I play with them.

[bunkerputt]

That's when you went wrong. You're just validating his notion that somehow he has the divine right to critique your swing.

Maybe even better would be to tell someone, "Look, for one, I don't know who you are and so your comments are not credible to me at this point. Maybe if you gave me your qualifications... But even so, I'm not really at a place where I can swallow my pride and take unsolicited advice from a stranger, regardless of how qualified." That's not rude, honest, straight to the point, will most likely end the conversation with most hacker-teachers, but may still leave the door open for truly qualified teachers in the future.

[MSchumacher]

I don't mind being social one bit. I usually get out and there and end up in conversations about something before my practice is over. With that being said, I don't necessarily want someone to come up and start giving me advice. If someone walks up and says "Hey man, can I make a suggestion, " I will usually just humor them and let them tell me. Then I'll just respond with "I'll keep that in mind." I don't want to be a douche out there, but don't expect me to drop what I am doing and change my swing to fit your eye..

I got the impression that Leadbetter was kind of a 'D**K'. What a nice guy!

[is2linda]

IMHO, there are not many things ruder than walking up to someone and offering unsolicited advice. My take is if they are going to be rude, I should be rude right back.

An eye for an eye will make the whole world blind.