"Left Side" swing thoughts

[bunkerputt]

Has anyone here experimented with material regarding things like taking the club back with your left side ala Bobby Jones, thinking of the left shoulder when you start the downswing, etc? I keep coming across material about golf's "Master Key" and how it has something to do with letting the left shoulder lead the downswing. I think the basic premise of it all is that if you think about your left side, you magically have an awesome swing that works automatically. It seems like it is a somewhat recycled idea from H.A. Murray's book "Golf Secret". Not having read that book, I can't really comment intelligently on it. There is an e-book from some guy that seems pretty crackpot to me. It almost seems eerily like a religion...

[jambalaya]

I've got the E-book. I don't think he is a crackpot but I haven't really comitted myself to it. But I might go back to it since I recently have done some things with my swing that make it more natural for me to use the left side. The book contains a lot of basic fundamentals of the swing as well as the left side control aspect. There is another guy on this site, I think Jack Lee, who swears by it.

[iacas]

Has anyone here experimented with material regarding things like taking the club back with your left side ala Bobby Jones, thinking of the left shoulder when you start the downswing, etc?

The Stack and Tilt golf swing - like any other good golf swing - stresses pushing the left shoulder down in the takeaway.

I'm not sure what entirely you mean by the "left side." I think the left knee doesn't do much, for example. Nor really the left hip - it's more the right hip there, but obviously the left hip is attached to the right hip.

[mc0388]

The Stack and Tilt golf swing - like any other good golf swing - stresses pushing the left shoulder down in the takeaway.

Iacas, Im not sure if focusing on the left side automatically puts it in the category of the 'Stack and Tilt',, When I take the club back, my focus is on my left rib cage turning under my body/spine as I shift my weight over my right heel. When my left shoulder is between my chin and the ball, I know my shoulder turn (shoulder blades facing the target) is complete ---to initiate the downswing I might have a stack-and-tilt-'esk' swing, but my weight shifting back (prob 35/65) makes it a bit more realistic as a long term golf swing. So I would definitely agree that the left side is important!!! Iacas, I also think this helps with the slide of hips you talk about ...

[iacas]

Im not sure if focusing on the left side automatically puts it in the category of the 'Stack and Tilt',

I didn't say that.

I focused on the left shoulder. It exhibits the same or a very similar move in every good golf swing, but the Stack and Tilt pattern emphasizes that the left shoulder rotates downward on the takeaway. Other swing methods still achieve a similar method without quite as much focus on it - Stack and Tilt elevates its importance a little.

I might have a stack-and-tilt-'esk' swing, but my weight shifting back (prob 35/65) makes it a bit more realistic as a long term golf swing.

I think you should start a new thread, because I think you have serious mis-conceptions about Stack and Tilt. Specifically, what do you mean by "realistic as a long term golf swing"? Again, please start a new thread - I don't want to get this one off-topic.

[mc0388]

I didn't say that.

When you word it like that then I agree with you. Your first post seemed you were discounting the swing. I just agree that the left side is very important in a good golf swing...

[JackLee]

Has anyone here experimented with material regarding things like taking the club back with your left side ala Bobby Jones, thinking of the left shoulder when you start the downswing, etc? I keep coming across material about golf's "Master Key" and how it has something to do with letting the left shoulder lead the downswing. I think the basic premise of it all is that if you think about your left side, you magically have an awesome swing that works automatically. It seems like it is a somewhat recycled idea from H.A. Murray's book "Golf Secret". Not having read that book, I can't really comment intelligently on it. There is an e-book from some guy that seems pretty crackpot to me. It almost seems eerily like a religion...

I think you are talking about "The Golf Swing and Its Master Key Explained" by Noel Thomas. I started using this instruction last year in late Spring. I was a 25 hcp then. By November, I was a 3 hcp which I have maintained.

I heard about H. A. Murray's book later. I bought it, but I found it difficult to read and understand, and I have never finished it, but maybe I will.

[kennay92]

I think you are talking about "The Golf Swing and Its Master Key Explained" by Noel Thomas. I started using this instruction last year in late Spring. I was a 25 hcp then. By November, I was a 3 hcp which I have maintained.

i just bought the master key explained book like literally 2 days ago. i read it once and it seemed to help a some.. did you read it multiple times or read it real diligently or what?

[JackLee]

i just bought the master key explained book like literally 2 days ago. i read it once and it seemed to help a some.. did you read it multiple times or read it real diligently or what?

I read all of it once. Then I read Chapters 2 through 5 two more times outside with a club and practiced each thing after reading it. Then I hit whiffle balls in my yard, trying to get everything right. Then I read Chapters 2 through 5 again. Hit whiffle balls again.

Then I took a Reminder List to a practice range. I started hitting balls and found that I had been transformed into a fairly good ball striker. I just got better in the days and weeks to come. I practiced my new full swing some on most days, but it does not require a lot of practice. I started spending a lot of time on my short game then and got my hcp down. I would recommend reading all of the full swing instructions very carefully several times, starting with Chapter 2. Also, read the first note on page 46. It is all important. I have helped 2 guys with this and they both had the same problem. They had a bad habit of not completing their backswing. As with any swing method, you must maintain good extension, and allow the momentum of the clubhead to complete your backswing. Then, just before the clubhead stops, start a smooth acceleration into the downswing. I hope you do well with it.

[bunkerputt]

I read all of it once. Then I read Chapters 2 through 5 two more times outside with a club and practiced each thing after reading it. Then I hit whiffle balls in my yard, trying to get everything right. Then I read Chapters 2 through 5 again. Hit whiffle balls again.

So you would be part of the crew who thinks it's worth $6? If your story is legit, I'd say it was the best $6 ever spent on golf. Was there anything shady with it? I did a google search on it and the only things that turn up are the same glowing recommendations. I know the book has something to do with thinking about the left shoulder. Could you expound on more detail on what is in it? None of the recommendations really talk about the concepts in it. They just talk about how it "magically" transformed their games. I'd definitely find it worth $6 if you could explain some of the concepts, but I have not heard anything like that yet.

[GamerJG]

Has anyone here experimented with material regarding things like taking the club back with your left side ala Bobby Jones, thinking of the left shoulder when you start the downswing, etc? I keep coming across material about golf's "Master Key" and how it has something to do with letting the left shoulder lead the downswing. I think the basic premise of it all is that if you think about your left side, you magically have an awesome swing that works automatically. It seems like it is a somewhat recycled idea from H.A. Murray's book "Golf Secret". Not having read that book, I can't really comment intelligently on it. There is an e-book from some guy that seems pretty crackpot to me. It almost seems eerily like a religion...

yes, you are referring to noel thomas' "golf swing master key". i started using this system a month ago. it did seem crackpot when i first read about it but everything he said made sense so i bought it for $6 thinking what could it hurt to try. let's just say i dropped 10 strokes immediately and i'm a huge advocate for it. it's premise is to control the whole swing with your left shoulder and everything else will fall into place automatically. everything else in it is basically having correct fundamentals. the thing that helped me most is using a swing that promotes a slight draw with a inside out swing plane. it worked miracles for me so i'd recommend it to anyone.

[jambalaya]

Basically the key is to control your backswing and downswing with your left shoulder with your left arm controlling extension, wrist cock etc. It is his contention that using the left side control will automatically so to speak sync up your body movements with your arm movements. This is a very simplified version of course and he stressed and explains good fundamentals like setup, grip, etc. as part of the instruction.

[GamerJG]

So you would be part of the crew who thinks it's worth $6? If your story is legit, I'd say it was the best $6 ever spent on golf. Was there anything shady with it? I did a google search on it and the only things that turn up are the same glowing recommendations. I know the book has something to do with thinking about the left shoulder. Could you expound on more detail on what is in it? None of the recommendations really talk about the concepts in it. They just talk about how it "magically" transformed their games. I'd definitely find it worth $6 if you could explain some of the concepts, but I have not heard anything like that yet.

i'd recommend spending the $6 on it and read it a few times. there's no illustrations and it's very technical so reading it once won't give you immediate benefits. i'd give you a more detailed explaination but i'd prefer that Mr. Thomas makes his money for the years of study and effort he put into the book. i emailed him my testimonial and he notified me that he is currently working a DVD of his methods which will probably be out early next year. he will be giving discounts to ppl who purchase the ebook. i have recommended it to everyone i know who plays because i'm a big believer. i went from shooting in the mid-90's after not playing for 5yrs. to shooting in the low 80's consistently while breaking 80 a couple times. i've only had the ebook for about 1 month. i list my handicap as a 12 but i'm probably single digits now. i only get to play a handful of times a month if i'm lucky and only practice maybe once a week. with this system, you don't need as much practice time. the ebook doesn't go into detail about the short game except for a small section, it focuses more on the golf swing. i do use some of the same techniques for pitching and chipping. it has even improved that immediately and i recently bought phil mickelson's "secrets of the short game" and that has helped also but i'm in the beginning stages. buy the ebook and read it, you have nothing to lose.

[GamerJG]

I read all of it once. Then I read Chapters 2 through 5 two more times outside with a club and practiced each thing after reading it. Then I hit whiffle balls in my yard, trying to get everything right. Then I read Chapters 2 through 5 again. Hit whiffle balls again.

i'm glad others have found out about this ebook. i've had just about the same experience as you with it. it really has worked miracles for me. i'm not down to a 3 handicap yet but i believe i will be pretty quickly when i get a chance to play more. like you, all i really need to practice after reading the ebook is my short game and it has improved pretty quickly already. i've been flirting with par for 9 holes recently due to this instruction. i first 2 rounds i played after reading it, i was scaring myself with the way i was hitting the ball. i was playing with a twosome of guys i didn't know and they were blown away with how i was hitting the ball and so was i. one of them was a 6 hand. and i basically smoked him. so i'm probably not a 12 hand. anymore and i'm on my way to a 5 or less. i noticed one of the areas that this instruction really helped with was my wedges inside 100yds and pitch shots. i've been surprisingly stiffing these shots when before i'd never get the distance right or skull them. this instruction is pretty amazing and if anyone asks, i'll swear by it. i wrote noel thomas and personally thanked him, that's how much this has helped me.

[JackLee]

i'm glad others have found out about this ebook. i've had just about the same experience as you with it. it really has worked miracles for me. i'm not down to a 3 handicap yet but i believe i will be pretty quickly when i get a chance to play more. like you, all i really need to practice after reading the ebook is my short game and it has improved pretty quickly already. i've been flirting with par for 9 holes recently due to this instruction. i first 2 rounds i played after reading it, i was scaring myself with the way i was hitting the ball. i was playing with a twosome of guys i didn't know and they were blown away with how i was hitting the ball and so was i. one of them was a 6 hand. and i basically smoked him. so i'm probably not a 12 hand. anymore and i'm on my way to a 5 or less. i noticed one of the areas that this instruction really helped with was my wedges inside 100yds and pitch shots. i've been surprisingly stiffing these shots when before i'd never get the distance right or skull them. this instruction is pretty amazing and if anyone asks, i'll swear by it. i wrote noel thomas and personally thanked him, that's how much this has helped me.

I'm glad to hear how well you are doing with it. I wrote Noel Thomas last year to thank him and tell him about my success with the instruction. He told me that he just sells this instruction to supplement his retirement income. I did not know about the upcoming DVD. I hope he makes some money on it. He certainly deserves it.

[bunkerputt]

I ordered the ebook out of sheer curiosity. I figure it can't hurt to read it. I'm curious, how does thinking about your left shoulder help your sequencing? I already have problems rotating my left shoulder too early in the downswing that seems to be helped when I think about my lower body rather than my upper. Doesn't thinking about turning your left shoulder cause you to hit with the upper body instead of driven by your pivot?

[GamerJG]

I ordered the ebook out of sheer curiosity. I figure it can't hurt to read it. I'm curious, how does thinking about your left shoulder help your sequencing? I already have problems rotating my left shoulder too early in the downswing that seems to be helped when I think about my lower body rather than my upper. Doesn't thinking about turning your left shoulder cause you to hit with the upper body instead of driven by your pivot?

did you read the book yet? after you read it a few times, you'll get a better understanding of how to use the shoulder. it's not really a swing thought, it's a conscious effort to physically control the swing with your left shoulder. i recommend giving it a few reads and visualize how you want to be swinging the club before you actually hit any balls. if you follow the instruction, you shouldn't be thinking about anything other than the shoulder when you swing the club. everything else, if done properly will fall into correct sequence.

[jdjanda]

Based on what I've read in this thread I spent the $6 on the eBook. I'm left handed but swing right so I hope using the left shoulder comes naturally.