FEDEX Cup - Go For It or Lay Up

[Saig55]

It seems to me a lot of the golfers today are content with playing it safe. Laying up or hitting to the center of the green. Not that that's a bad thing. But it seems to me in the past most pro's went for the flag more often than not. Has the FedEx Cup made everyone more cautious. A bad shot, which we've seen a few the last couple of stops on the tour, can make you fall several spots in the field.

So are they more cautious today? It's still a lot of money in the top ten.

[iacas]

It seems to me a lot of the golfers today are content with playing it safe. Laying up or hitting to the center of the green. Not that that's a bad thing. But it seems to me in the past most pro's went for the flag more often than not. Has the FedEx Cup made everyone more cautious. A bad shot, which we've seen a few the last couple of stops on the tour, can make you fall several spots in the field.

It's not the FedExCup, it's the money that's available for second, third, fourth, etc. in general. In the old days you wanted to win - or needed to win - to have a good career. Now you can get a few top tens a year and earn a few million bucks.

The modern pro is a wimp.

[Shindig]

The modern pro is a wimp.

A very wealthy wimp.

The thinking used to be that laying up was smart if you couldn't make it to chipping range. I was reading Hale Irwin's Smart Golf a few nights ago, and he describes the "optimal" (it isn't, but he says it is) play at Riviera #10 being a lay-up off the tee to a full wedge in. The reality is that going for it - drivable par-4, reachable par-5, whatever - is, when you miss, laying up to the most accurate shot you've practiced. When I miss a short par-5 by 40 yards, this isn't a bad pitch: I know exactly what to do for that distance.

[BallStriker]

Now you can get a few top tens a year and earn a few million bucks.

Right now, this is the PGA players' dirtly little secret -- we hear quite a bit of "winning is the only thing that matters to me" crap, but it simply isn't true for 75% of the golfers out there -- it is all about risk/reward and maximizing dollars earned when playing well.

[Shanks A Million]

It's not the FedExCup, it's the money that's available for second, third, fourth, etc. in general. In the old days you wanted to win - or needed to win - to have a good career. Now you can get a few top tens a year and earn a few million bucks.

That's exactly the problem. These days, the pros make a fortune for just playing. It's insane. These guys aren't curing cancer, they're playing golf. Money is out of hand in professional sports. Even psychologists believe that extrinsic rewards are leading to the downfall of true sportsmen.

[Alex B]

Absolutely. There is really no excuse for a pro to wimp out and play for the check, whether he's 1) an established player or 2) a no-name journeyman.

1) Established players are set monetarily, so their primary objective should be to win. This one is obvious.

2) Journeymen need the money, so it may seem best that they play for a large check. The rewards that come with winning, however, include new sponsorships, increased publicity, etc. -- far more than a first-place check. So even on a strictly monetary risk-benefit analysis (with no consideration of the glory in winning), it's likely best always to play for the win.

[BonoVox]

How about the new groves rule? Miss and end up in deep rough. Harder to get up and down these days? Verse firing from the fairway with a wedge? Especailly early in the season when you are still figuring out the groves?

[Rexx]

Wow, any empirical evidence of this? I mean, we have the Rickie Fowler layup, but he seems quite convinced that was the right thing for him to win given the circumstances. I think it's safe to say that almost every one of the golfers on tour used to cleanup their local tournaments (probably as juniors) and probably had at least moderate success in college. They know how to win and they want to win. I don't believe for a second that anyone in contention on the back 9 on Sunday isn't doing their best to win. Once out of contention, things may be different, especially if your status on tour is tenuous. Then, it only makes sense to maximize your "profits" to retain your tour card. For people like Woods, Els, etc, I don't know what their thought process is once out of contention... they may be uber-aggressive for the heck of it, play some shots they might not normally play, or think about what to have for dinner... who knows.

But really, this all sounds like jealousy to me. These guys are paid exactly what the market will bear. If you want a piece of the action, then get out there and work your butt off just like they have done for most of their life. It's a game to us (just like a lot of sports), but it's a job for them -- one that they enjoy at times (just like I enjoy mine). And complaining about them making too much money... that's funny. You think it has anything to do with buying $500 drivers, $1500 irons, $200 putters, or $3 golf balls?

[Shanks A Million]

But really, this all sounds like jealousy to me. These guys are paid exactly what the market will bear. If you want a piece of the action, then get out there and work your butt off just like they have done for most of their life. It's a game to us (just like a lot of sports), but it's a job for them -- one that they enjoy at times (just like I enjoy mine). And complaining about them making too much money... that's funny. You think it has anything to do with buying $500 drivers, $1500 irons, $200 putters, or $3 golf balls?

Golf is entertainment. They play to amuse us, and nothing more. Without fans, they would be playing for nothing. That's their job. We have the right to complain if they don't give us what we paid for.

Does the best golfer in the world really need to have a billion dollars while tens of thousands of people starve to death every single day? The guy can hit a ball into a hole, and yet billions of people don't even have access to clean drinking water or medical care. That sounds pretty silly to me. We have Wall Street executives making hundreds of millions of dollars for selling derivatives on bad loans, and getting even more when their companies go under and people lose their homes. We have actors demanding 15 million dollars to do a single movie, and then going out and preaching justice for the poor. And to cap it all off, the ultimate joke, those who call for justice are labeled socialists and outcast. If anyone can think of a thing more asinine, I'd like to know.

[Three Putt]

Golf is entertainment. They play to amuse us, and nothing more. Without fans, they would be playing for nothing. That's their job. We have the right to complain if they don't give us what we paid for.

Excellent Points, but at least in golf they have to earn a paycheck...miss the cut = no $$$$, sorry about your expenses for the week. Basketball and Baseball disgust me with the $$$ that is thrown around, that's why I don't watch either. Ricky Fowler is one of the hottest young stars right now and has made 1.25 million in a half a year or so (plus the Puma money), playing some good golf, imagine if he was a 19 year old basketball or baseball prospect....what kind of contract do you think he would have coming out of college?

[mcfc_nick]

the fact is that most golfers will be happier not going for the win and settling for a top 5 finish than going for it and trying to win, making a big number and dropping down the leaderboard costing them a lot of $

[14ledo81]

Golf is entertainment. They play to amuse us, and nothing more. Without fans, they would be playing for nothing. That's their job. We have the right to complain if they don't give us what we paid for.

Well I would think there are some people that think it is pretty asinine to be spending money on golf clubs, balls , rounds of golf while others go without drinking water. What justice are you calling for? Take from those who have earned it?

[Cussin hacker]

I'm not in the layup crowd. Look at all the great players there have been, Question....how many of those guys were layup guys???? Jack, Tiger, Arnie, Hogan, Trevino, Watson etc. None of those players were layup kind of guys. If you want to be great ..go for it. If you want to be good enough to keep your card...play it safe! I'm not saying great players never lay up, but their aggressive play made them great. Ask Arnie how he feels on this and you would here the same.

[enis750]

Excellent Points, but at least in golf they have to earn a paycheck...miss the cut = no $$$$, sorry about your expenses for the week. Basketball and Baseball disgust me with the $$$ that is thrown around, that's why I don't watch either. Ricky Fowler is one of the hottest young stars right now and has made 1.25 million in a half a year or so (plus the Puma money), playing some good golf, imagine if he was a 19 year old basketball or baseball prospect....what kind of contract do you think he would have coming out of college?

Top 20 Top paid athletes in the world

1. Tiger Woods, golf - $110 million 2. Kobe Bryant, basketball - $45 million 2. Michael Jordan, basketball - $45 million 2. Kimi Raikkonen, NASCAR- $45 million 5. David Beckham, soccer/football - $42 million 6. Lebron James, basketball - $40 million 6. Phil Mickelson, golf - $40 million 6. Manny Pacquiao, boxing - $40 million 9. Valentino Rossi, motorcycling - $35 million 10. Dale Earnhardt Jr., NASCAR - $34 million 11. Roger Federer, tennis - $33 million 11. Shaquille O'Neal, basketball - $33 million 13. Oscar de la Hoya, boxing - $32 million 13. Lewis Hamilton, NASCAR - $32 million 13. Alex Rodriguez, baseball - $32 million 16. Vijay Singh, golf - $31 million 17. Kevin Garnett, basketball - $30 million 17. Jeff Gordon, NASCAR - $30 million 17. Derek Jeter, baseball - $30 million 17. Ronaldinho, soccer/football - $30 million 3 of the top 20 are golfers....thats pretty good

[Cussin hacker]

I happen to like more foreign players these days. They seem to me to be more of the go for it kind of guys. More personality also. AK would be an obvious exception and a few others. Would never happen, but I think the PGA should put more emphasis on winning. Lower the prize money given out for non winners. Still make it nice to live on, but at the same time give them more interest in winning. Big $$$$$$$ has hurt all sports overall.

[Rexx]

Where are the stats that back all these claims up that the great players "went for it" more (whatever that means)? Where is the poll among PGA Pros that says a majority of them would lay up to preserve 2nd place instead of going for it to win? You know who goes for it all the time... John Daly, Hank Kuehne, JB Holmes. Why aren't they as good as Jack, Arnie, or Tiger? Are you saying Corey Pavin just lacked that "go for it" attitude, else he would have won half a dozen majors? As for Tiger... geez... he's one of the most conservative players out there, especially in the majors -- using irons and 3-wood off every tee to keep it in the fairway. Pro golfers are who they are... they all worked hard to get where they are. There's probably plenty of guys on the Nationwide Tour that have put in just as much hours and practice as any PGA Tour player, but they just capped out at a different point. That's life.

And really Shanks, "Don't hate the player... hate the game". These guys played the game and won... they can do whatever they want with the money they earned. There's also a sea of failed golfers that never quite made it to the big time -- it's a risky choice, so with the risk, comes big rewards. You should know... musicians, artists, and actors have the same life... scraping by until a breakthrough (whether 'deserved' or not). And you can complain all you want if they "don't give you want you want"... and they can tell you to kiss off. They know they're fortunate to play golf for a living (and a very good one at that) -- you hear them say it all the time. And they don't play the game to amuse us (as if they are some sort of Roman Gladiators) -- I doubt you'll get that response from any of them. I think you have the roles reversed -- they have a skill that you find so fascinating that you're willing to give money to watch them. They create these tournaments, put them on TV, and get the sheeple to pay to watch them. It's an arrangement that is always "up for negotiations" and either side can walk away whenever they want.

[Par Fore]

Personally, I don't think it has anything to do with the cup....I think players want to win, and if they don't feel the shot, they lay up.....

Throughout history, there are many examples of players that hit a bad drive, laid up on a par 4 to a wedge distance, saved par, and won the tournament.....a few of them in majors.....I think Payne Stewart and David Toms are a couple of examples......

With that being said, I saw Bubba Watson lay up on a 220 yard shot earlier this year on a par 5 (l14th hole or something) and I almost lost my mind.....I think they said it was a 4 iron for him and he was laying up.....and personally, I think it cost him the tournament.....now, if he won, everybody would have said he played it smart, but the other guy came out on top......at some point, every PGA player today has laid up in a situation where we've previously seen them go for it and miss in the past......part of it is just learning from their mistakes - if they start thinking about the shot, and then remember the last time they squandered an opportunity in the same position, they are better off laying up because their mind isn't right and they are already beaten....

[goblue107501]

It's not the FedExCup, it's the money that's available for second, third, fourth, etc. in general. In the old days you wanted to win - or needed to win - to have a good career. Now you can get a few top tens a year and earn a few million bucks.

Those were pretty much my thoughts. I will add something a different way. They will lose more dropping a few spots, then the risk of trying to gain going up a few spots. I think most guys look at their position late in a tournament and don't want to risk losing money more than wanting to gain money. Might be why you always see a guy who goes out early on Sunday put up a great score. He has nothing to lose and only $$$ to gain. There isn't much money difference in a 61st and 69th. There can be a huge money difference from 4th to 10th.