Heart Break - 2 holes in one - lost!

[2bGood]

I think they are still trying to figure this out, but last night on a short par 3 I saw two holes in one lost. It was a bit surreal So I hope I explain it right.

I was on the my way to the next tee when we hear the group on the tee of a 145 yard par 3 cheering, I turn back to see ball roll into the cup. Thing is, it wedges between the flagstick and the hole. So we yell back "it's in the hole" I do know the rule that when it is wedged someone has to pull the flagstick and if the ball fall in it counts.

We wait for the guys to reach the green so we can congratulate them and I want to amke sure the guy knows he needs to gently move the flagstick so his ball drops in and not just grab his ball. Anyway the third guy to tee off hits it stiff and it roles to the hole, hits the ball wedged in the hole and BOTH balls deflect out!!!!

So we tell the guys what happend, I check out the flagstick and it was in the hole straight, but the lip of the hole was a bit damaged (I was glad to see it was a damaged hole and not the flagstick as I had replaced the stick).

At any rate the proshop tells neither ball is a hole in one. First ball is not a hoel in one under rule 17-4 and the second ball is not a hole in one under rule 18-5.

We did let the guys know they could still buy us drinks if that would make them feel better

I have to admit I feel bad that I didn't remove the flagstick before the next guy shot, but I figured he would want to fish out his own hole in one ball.

[SpringBokVol]

Wow. That is amazing. And in the most terrible way. What are the odds????

[senorchipotle]

wow! what a great, but terrible story that is. i bet those guys were pissed. at least i would have been, especially if it were to be my first hole in one. that sucks, man.

[2bGood]

Last I heard the pro was checking it with a higher power.

[Ash1974]

Last I heard the pro was checking it with a higher power.

I would be interested to hear what the outcome of this is?

[Where's the Cart Girl?]

That will be one of those stories that those guys, particularly the second guy, will tell forever and people will walk away thinkin - wow. that guy was full of shit.

[saevel25]

Well the pro shop guys is wrong in one regards...

17-4 does say if you lift the flat stick and the ball bounces out it must be placed on the lip and then putted out.

18-5, if a ball hits another ball then the ball that has been struck must be replaced.

So by rule, the flag stick did not knock the ball out of the cup when it was lifted, which applies to rule 17-4. So the one ball should have been replaced to its position between the flagstick and the cup. were the one golfer may then have the flagstick removed.

[iacas]

The first guy's ball is a hole in one.* He should replace his ball "wedged" between the cup and the flagstick as you said and then he's allowed to straighten the flagstick. The ball would fall in it would count as a 1. If he's dumb and moved the flagstick so it knocked the ball out, too bad. He makes a nice 2.

* But you'd have to be certain that the ball WAS wedged between the flagstick and the edge of the hole. For it to get knocked out implies to me that it was likely not actually wedged between the flagstick and the cup.

Source: Rule 18-5
18-5. By Another Ball
If a ball in play and at rest is moved by another ball in motion after a stroke, the moved ball must be replaced.

[double_j]

How badly was that lip damaged that the ball could have gotten wedged between the flag and the lip and still be knocked out by another ball going into the hole? I would've guessed that practically 100% of the time, any ball against the flagstick usually already inside the cup (at least up to its equator) and would therefore require an upwards (or at least horizontal) force to knock it out.

Either that, or the flagstick was leaning quite a bit (although the OP did say it was in the cup straight).

[2bGood]

Well the pro shop guys is wrong in one regards...

Yes this came up in the pro shop. Problem is guy #1 didn't do this< hejust picked up his 6".

[2bGood]

How badly was that lip damaged that the ball could have gotten wedged between the flag and the lip and still be knocked out by another ball going into the hole? I would've guessed that practically 100% of the time, any ball against the flagstick usually already inside the cup (at least up to its equator) and would therefore require an upwards (or at least horizontal) force to knock it out.

I would say it was about half out of the hole, the hole was roled over on the edge a fair bit.

[treebound]

Yes this came up in the pro shop. Problem is guy #1 didn't do this< hejust picked up his 6".

Oh oh, I think he incurred an additional penalty or two, picking up a ball in play, not marking it on the green before doing so, and not putting it in to finish that hole. Am I right on that?

[clearwaterms]

Oh oh, I think he incurred an additional penalty or two, picking up a ball in play, not marking it on the green before doing so, and not putting it in to finish that hole. Am I right on that?

his hole in one eagle just became a double bogey. Hahah.

[2bGood]

his hole in one eagle just became a double bogey. Hahah.

Yes, not that it mattered, once you lose your hole in one, a birdie is no big deal.

[Kingfisher]

Crazy story, the first guy whose ball was wedged must be kicking himself silly - if in fact his ball was wedged and he threw away his ace.

It's a pretty common situation to come across 'experienced' golfers who don't know the rules as well as they should. A lot of them still don't realise that the rules can often help just as much as hinder them.