so confused about posting handicap scores

[soloredd]

Right, so after doing some reading today I've come to realize that myself and my buddies have potentially been posting the wrong scores for our handicap index. Now, we've always followed ESC (equitable stroke control) and because my handicap is currently 21 (never been below 20), I've always put a max of 8 on any given hole. The problem comes into play when doing course handicap. On my home course, my handicap of 21 and it's slope of 119 comes to a course handicap of 22. Meaning I would get a stroke on 1-18 and then another stroke on 1-4, correct? So, how does this work?

If on the #1 handicap rated hole I score a 6 (this is a par 4) would I then, for handicap index purposes, mark a 4? And so on...

It's not a major issue for the simple reason that we do not currently play in tournaments but I would like to start next year. I want to make sure everything is legit with my postings and my understanding of the rules. Thanks.

[trickymicky69]

I am gonna put my neck on the line and say esc is a load of crap.

If you score a nine, you should mark a nine.

I was on for my best round ever yesterday and was 5 over after 14 holes.

I then got a 13 (yes you read that right) on hole 14

I still put it down.

IMO I would be cheating otherwise

[soloredd]

Well, I am in the same boat you are. I always thought it to be bogus and used to mark total strokes like you said. However, I've also come to realize that someone with a 5 handicap could mark a 10 to inflate their handicap (again, this is all assuming there is tournament play involved). So, we've used ESC in our group.

[moparman426]

It aids in cutting back on sandbagging. It reflects what you are capable of, not an overall average. If you aren't following the rules for posting scores properly, then stop posting them.

[vmsea]

I don't get ESC either..

The example is always.. if someone shoots par for 17 holes, and takes a 18 over on the 18th.. they're a bogey golfer. but they dont' record 18..
ok.
how is that different than someone who's +1 on each hole.. ?

why would the first guy have a lower handicap? If he's better.. shouldn't he be able to avoid an 18 over on a hole?
just curious. still learningthe game..

[Fourputt]

Right, so after doing some reading today I've come to realize that myself and my buddies have potentially been posting the wrong scores for our handicap index. Now, we've always followed ESC (equitable stroke control) and because my handicap is currently 21 (never been below 20), I've always put a max of 8 on any given hole. The problem comes into play when doing course handicap. On my home course, my handicap of 21 and it's slope of 119 comes to a course handicap of 22. Meaning I would get a stroke on 1-18 and then another stroke on 1-4, correct? So, how does this work?

Handicaps work in different ways depending on the style of play, the players involved, and why you are using them. Applying handicaps on course is different depending on whether you are playing match play or stroke play.

For a match, it normally involves either 2 or 4 players. The lowest handicap plays scratch, then the other players in the match get the difference between their handicaps and his and they get those strokes on the handicap holes as rated on the scorecard. If a 13 and a 19 are playing a match, then the 13 plays scratch and the 19 would get one stroke on each of the 1-6 handicap holes (19-13=6), or 3 strokes on each side. For a stroke competition, you simply subtract the number of strokes allowed for the course handicap from the final gross total to get a net stroke total. If your course handicap is 14 and you shoot a gross score of 88, your net score is 74. When you return the card for handicap, you return the gross score of 88 minus any necessary ESC adjustment. As 14 handicap that means you reduce any hole score over 7 down to 7, but no other scores get adjusted. Today I had a 10 on one hole but I adjusted it to 7 before entering the score in the handicap computer. That reduced my 93 to 90 for handicap purposes.

I am gonna put my neck on the line and say esc is a load of crap.

No sir... YOU are cheating by posting scores which inflate your handicap. You are simply sandbagging.

I don't get ESC either.. The example is always.. if someone shoots par for 17 holes, and takes a 18 over on the 18th.. they're a bogey golfer. but they dont' record 18.. ok. how is that different than someone who's +1 on each hole.. ? why would the first guy have a lower handicap? If he's better.. shouldn't he be able to avoid an 18 over on a hole? just curious. still learningthe game..

Because if you can shoot even par for 17 holes then that last hole is an exception, and the handicap system does not recognize exceptions. That's why it only uses the best 10 of your last 20 scores. If you average about 85, then return a score of 110, that 110 will never be in the calculation because it doesn't represent your true ability (unless you shoot that high for more than 10 straight rounds). The same theory applies to exceptional holes. If your handicap is 15, then you rarely shoot a score above 7 so the system uses that as reasonable maximum for posting purposes.

[steelernation]

I am gonna put my neck on the line and say esc is a load of crap.

Crap luck there. Thats one of the reasons ESC is used. Imagine if you did that every 18holes for 10 rounds, ---shoot18 over par and one hole accounts for 9 of those strokes---- sure you got a 18 and have a high HI. Now consider you stop blowing up that one or two holes per round and your in a tournament of stroke play and you shoot a 9 over you will quickly get the nickname sandbagger. It happens to me because i dont use ESC. I blow up 4 holes a round. The other 14 are usually 8 over par, factor in the 4 triple bogeys or quads and now im 20 over par. Ive been called a sandbagger jokingly when I play decent golf and actually avoid a blow up.

[vmsea]

ESC for hdcp 0-9, double bogey is max score.. ok

When they say for HDCP 10-19, the score is 7.
but a 7 is 4 over on a par 3, and 2 over on a par 5.

how does that work? 10-19 can score a 4 over par on a par3 hole?

[steelernation]

If I were to go back to every one of my rounds this year, I would bet that my HI drops by 3 to 4 strokes.

[steelernation]

ESC for hdcp 0-9, double bogey is max score.. ok

good question

[Tugglife2]

I tried following this thread as a newbie handicapper and I'm completely lost, wow.

[vmsea]

Found the answer to my own questions:

http://www.usga.org/Rule-Books/Handi...l/Rule-04/#4-3

Example: A player with a Course Handicap of 6 has a maximum number of par plus two strokes (double bogey) for any hole. A player with a Course Handicap of 13 has a maximum number of 7 for any hole regardless of par. A player with a Course Handicap of 42 has a maximum number of 10 for any hole.

[steelernation]

yea that would lower every round ive played over the last 10 rounds by 2 to 3 strokes per round, I usually score 2 snowmen per round.

[kpaulhus]

yea that would lower every round ive played over the last 10 rounds by 2 to 3 strokes per round, I usually score 2 snowmen per round.

U should go back and adjust those scores....

[max power]

yea that would lower every round ive played over the last 10 rounds by 2 to 3 strokes per round, I usually score 2 snowmen per round.

So stop sandbagging!

[meenman]

yea that would lower every round ive played over the last 10 rounds by 2 to 3 strokes per round, I usually score 2 snowmen per round.

but with an 18.7 index there is a good chance your course handicap was over 20 when you played

esc is based on course handicap, not handicap index

[max power]

I am gonna put my neck on the line and say esc is a load of crap.

You're cheating if you don't use ESC. It's designed to allow players of differing handicaps to compete on a fairly even footing. If you have one blow up hole per round that inflates your handicap you would win nearly every other hole against a competitor. Handicap is not a pure reflection of what you average over par, it's a tool to allow the 'handicapping' of multiple players, and it reflects what you shoot over the course rating on a good day. And on a good day you would probably avoid the huge blowup hole.

[Fourputt]

The whole point is that your handicap is intended to show your scoring potential , not an average of all of your scores. If you only blow up on one or two holes (or have an occasional really bad round) and shoot fairly well the rest of the time, then what you do on the majority of holes played shows your true potential scoring ability, and that is what should be reflected in your handicap.

When handicaps are honestly maintained, and employed as set out in the USGA handicap manual, they work quite well. Players who sandbag, or who carry vanity or ego handicaps are the ones who skew the system. I've played in a handicap club for 21 years, and in that time we have had to deal with only 3 or 4 players who tried to cheat the system. That in a men's club with up to 250 members. It helps immensely to have an active and aware handicap committee.