PGA Fiasco

[jetsknicks1]

Why wouldn't he expect it? They've been in bunkers all week.

Off topic. What the hell is with all that trash on the course? Cmon people, you're supposed to be fans of the game, how about showing some repect for the course?

Rant over.

[GolfBear]

Fer chrissakes, it's not like his ball landed in someone's sand castle, foot print, etc. He had a good lie. All he had to do was not ground his club. He might have done that if he had read the rules sheet, which made it clear.

I'll disagree with you here. He was the only player that was

caught and penalized this week. I'm willing to be there may have been a number of similar infractions during the tournament that weren't caught by cameras.

[Fat Slice]

Hole, sand, grounded club, penalty. The rules are simple and when in doubt ask.

[albatross]

Erik, at least read my posts before you respond to them. I said over and over that Dustin should have been penalized. Go back and read them. Don't respond by saying I thought he shouldn't be penalized when I said the opposite 4 times. I said he should clearly have been penalized and that he should have read the rule sheet.

I really can't believe you're making the argument "where are they supposed to stand?" NOT IN A HAZARD. This is one point that it seems only you are arguing. Faldo, Fehrety, Nobilo, all guys that know more golf than you and I have all said today that the big mistake the PGA and course officials made was allowing patrons to stand in an area deemed a hazard. Go back and listen to the Dan Patrick show this morning and the interview with David Feherty. He just said this morning that there were many areas on the course with patches of sand and dirt that were not hazards and that guys were grounding their clubs in them. My point is again if that's the case, if you remove all of those people from the hazard, it becomes obvious that it was a bunker. Bottom line, Dustin or his caddy should have asked. But he wouldn't have needed to if he could actually see the hazard that was obstructed by hundreds of people.

The PGA got the call right. They also got it wrong by allowing patrons to stand in a hazard. If there isn't a place to stand, then don't let anyone stand there. Pretty simple. Think of some of the areas you can't stand at Augusta for example. You don't see patrons in the bunkers on 12 at Augusta because they "have no where to stand." You watch the action from where you can stand without impeding on the course. Ridiculous argument.

[Doswell]

I have a question for you folks.

There were many errant drives over the four days at the bunker-infested Whistling Straits, and some of them ended up in tightly-packed spectator areas. Just like DJ's drive on 18 in round four.

BUT, none of them was subject to anything like the same, up-close camera coverage that Johnson's was.

Could there be any players who, on reflection, think that they MIGHT have done exactly the same thing as Johnson at some point during the tournament?

[DavidFehertysBike]

Off topic. What the hell is with all that trash on the course? Cmon people, you're supposed to be fans of the game, how about showing some repect for the course?

I think one of the stupid spectators throwing the trash everywhere should have informed johnson that he was standing in a bunker..lol

[JWL1957]

David Ferhety said he couldnt tell if it were a bunker, or a area that spectators had been standing on all week. He said the absence of any lips made him wonder because the course has such a sandy base.

[albatross]

David Ferhety said he couldnt tell if it were a bunker, or a area that spectators had been standing on all week. He said the absence of any lips made him wonder because the course has such a sandy base.

If you're referring to this morning, he said a lot more than that. He definitely said that he saw players hitting off of other sandy portions of the course that were not hazards. I just listened to it. Go back and listen. It doesn't make an excuse for Johnson but it's another good reason to not have patrons standing in the bunker.

[iacas]

Nantz calls it a bunker. The GolfTrax or whatever clearly shows it going into a bunker. It was a bunker. It's not opinion, folks.

[albatross]

Not arguing that point. It was a bunker. Just hard to tell because of the trash and mob of people standing in it.

[TourSpoon]

When DJ got to his ball and grounded his club and then pointed I thought he had called the penalty on himself or was going to get an official. I was like OMG, then I was just hoping it was a waste area. When they questioned it I thought he is done...two strokes.

Once his ball was in the bunker (or even if it was in the rough), the marshalls should have moved the spectators back. I thought the tunnel was just ridiculous and when the caddy went into the crowd I joked that he was trying to protect himself just in case DJ skanked one.

The PGA guy really stressed that the #1 rule was there are no waste areas for the tourney, and I felt that Feherty should have known that as he was stirring everyone up.

[shades9323]

I see you guys saying that the fans shouldn't have been in the bunker with him. How is that any different than when a player hits it off line into the rough and people are just feet away from them there?

[Elvisliveson]

I see you guys saying that the fans shouldn't have been in the bunker with him. How is that any different than when a player hits it off line into the rough and people are just feet away from them there?

Yes, because the rough is not a hazard.

[albatross]

I see you guys saying that the fans shouldn't have been in the bunker with him. How is that any different than when a player hits it off line into the rough and people are just feet away from them there?

If you're talking about an area that is deemed only as rough, it's much different. The bunker is a hazard that has margins that are hard to see with hundreds of people around it. "Rough" is a general term and it can or can't be part of a hazard depending on the course.

[albatross]

Yes, because the rough is not a hazard.

Exactly right.

[TourSpoon]

I see you guys saying that the fans shouldn't have been in the bunker with him. How is that any different than when a player hits it off line into the rough and people are just feet away from them there?

I think that they were too close even if he was in the rough.

[sc13ntific]

The rules were posted and extra emphasis was given to the bunker situation on the course. DJ or his Caddie should have asked for some clarity when the ball landed where it did. It is unfortunate that it played out like that though.

[iacas]

However, I have no problem with someone that feels that fans should not be on the course and certainly not standing in the hazard. I don't have a problem with it but if they want to change it, it's really simple, put down white stakes and call it O.B. and the problem is solved. This way fans can actually get close enough to see the darn players and there are no hazard issues to complain about.

That would make 90% of the course OB, and internal OB doesn't sit well with anyone.

Erik, at least read my posts before you respond to them.

I've read them. I think you're being reactionary and emotional because it was DJ on the 72nd hole. Nice dig by the way - grow up.

I really can't believe you're making the argument "where are they supposed to stand?" NOT IN A HAZARD.

You keep making the same point and I keep asking the same question: where else could they stand? Seriously, look at a course map, and tell me. You couldn't fit half the number of spectators on the course if they weren't allowed in the bunkers. And what, you're gonna tell them "okay, don't walk in the bunkers" - they're gonna do it anyway. It was impractical not to have them in the bunkers. The PGA did the best they could and the players were clearly told.

Faldo, Fehrety, Nobilo, all guys that know more golf than you and I have all said today that the big mistake the PGA and course officials made was allowing patrons to stand in an area deemed a hazard.

Doesn't make their opinions more valid. Where else were they to stand? I'm not going to go listen to Dan Patrick, and if Feherty, Nobilo, etc. said things, link to and quote them. At least we'll have something to parse.

You guys will, anyway. I've got a tournament to play.

He just said this morning that there were many areas on the course with patches of sand and dirt that were not hazards and that guys were grounding their clubs in them. My point is again if that's the case, if you remove all of those people from the hazard, it becomes obvious that it was a bunker.

Nantz knew it was a bunker. His ball was sitting on sand. Could DJ not have asked? As other golf writers I read have said, "if your ball is on sand, whistles should go off."

Bottom line, Dustin or his caddy should have asked. But he wouldn't have needed to if he could actually see the hazard that was obstructed by hundreds of people.

Hey, it looked like a bunker on TV to me, and I have no doubt that if I'm DJ and I'm actually there and not looking through a camera lens, how much it looks like a bunker only increases, not decreases.

Think of some of the areas you can't stand at Augusta for example.

Stupid argument. Augusta National can fit 25,000+ people without asking them to hover off the ground. Whistling Straits can't fit enough people without them in bunkers. The Augusta comparison doesn't even make sense. Augusta doesn't have 1200+ bunkers. Simple as that.

Here's the question I have - where was DJ's ball, exactly, in the bunker. From the pictures posted above and having watched the replay several times, the area that is marked with a circle in the pictures above is not where his ball was.

That's where his ball was. If the ball was where you say it was he'd have been standing on a big sidehill lie. I wasn't there, but I accept the validity of the people who marked the bunker and took the video and photos that his ball was where they drew the line.

Even if his ball was where you say it was, it's in the bunker. There's sand beneath and to a reasonable distance on all sides of the ball. Enjoy. I'm off to play in my tournament.