Elbow Position and Its Effects on the Downswing

[LuciusWooding]

I nailed a PW 150 yds carry, uphill and dead straight yesterday.

So you hit your PW 150, uphill, and don't let your hands reach shoulder height? Does PW stand for something besides pitching wedge that I'm not aware of?

Come on, man.

[Vinsk]

Correction: " I BLADED a PW 150yds uphill"

[mvmac]

Greetings iacas and all. This is my first activity here, and this post caught my eye.

I think the left position is a much more powerful one; accurate too, and for one simple reason. The plane of the forearm triangle is still relative to the shoulder angle on the left, facilitating a direct route back to the ball. On the right, the triangle is skewed open. It has to get back on it's plane, or some other compensation must be made prior to impact. On the left, you don't have any extra moves to make; just right back down to the ball. And you don't wan't any interference in allowing that right arm to do what it can do.

Hi Joe, welcome to the site.

The left position is not one you typically see from good players. As Erik said, it's off plane and the golfer will need to do something to try to shallow it out prior to impact. Either tip the head back and/or uncock the wrist prematurely. At A5 the shaft should be pointing at or just outside the ball.

[Hammer 4]

Hold on....maybe Joe lives in Colo, in the mile high city...? That would/could explain the 150 yd. pw...

[mvmac]

Easy guys, let's give Joe a chance

[Vinsk]

Yeah...just messing with ya Joe. Welcome, you're gonna love this place!

[Joe Hill]

The difference in all of those examples mvmac are they have their hands open to the arc of the hands. My hands are square to their arc. If the hands are open to the spine angle, the club is open. (edit: neutral grip) I don't rotate my wrists or forearms. I'm not off plane at all. It's the hinge square which makes you think it is. I promise you, all I do is rotate my arm pits back to the ball from there and the arms and hands respond. I manipulate them not a whit.

[Joe Hill]

Correction: " I BLADED a PW 150yds uphill"

lol  You guys are cracking me up. I'm serious. High and soaring. The distances I'm getting are mind boggling to me.

[Joe Hill]

Hold on....maybe Joe lives in Colo, in the mile high city...? That would/could explain the 150 yd. pw...

Muggy, sea level Gulf coast.

[mvmac]

The difference in all of those examples mvmac are they have their hands open to the arc of the hands. My hands are square to their arc. If the hands are open to the spine angle, the club is open. (edit: neutral grip) I don't rotate my wrists or forearms. I'm not off plane at all. It's the hinge square which makes you think it is. I promise you, all I do is rotate my arm pits back to the ball from there and the arms and hands respond. I manipulate them not a whit.

Not really sure what you're saying here but I stand by my post. It's rare to see a good player with the shaft pointing inside the ball at A5. Not saying you're not a good player or that it can't be done but the positions I posted are much more common because we're delivering the club down a diagonal path.

Also check out this thread and read about multi-quoting, thanks

[Joe Hill]

Not really sure what you're saying here but I stand by my post. It's rare to see a good player with the shaft pointing inside the ball at A5. Not saying you're not a good player or that it can't be done but the positions I posted are much more common because we're delivering the club down a diagonal path.

Also check out this thread and read about multi-quoting, thanks

Thanks for the posting tip. I did jump in with both feet prior to reading all the guidelines. Hopefully you can understand my zeal, having seen the picture resembling the top of my swing labelled as "wrong". I'll be sure to familiarize myself with the guidelines before proceeding further. Despite my controversial views on the swing, I do wish to be a member here in good standing. We all love the game, and that is our glue.

I know I am challenging convention mvmac. It's never easy to breach accepted paradigms. My basic premise is the movement of the triangle is misunderstood, generally across the board, including TGM. I know that's a big statement, but it's hard to argue with the results.150 yd carry pitching wedge uphill? 65 year old out of shape swing junkie? Sternum high back swing? "What the heck you been smokin boy?" But it is fact, not a dream.

What is not understood is, unless you set up like Moe Norman with your arm plane perpendicular to your spine line, the hands never reach shoulder height until a 180 shoulder turn is made without lifting the leading arm. I will say boldly, based on years of thought and experimentation, that the lifting of the arms is wasted energy; it gains nothing, complicates the swing. and considering the distances I am achieving, is a major power leak. My premise is, instead of focusing on the club plane, swing a stable triangle on it's true plane. The club is then forced to hinge perpendicular to the triangle plane. Keeping the triangle in position at that point is critical, rather than let the momentum carry the arms up and off their plane. Just rotate the base of the triangle back down as hard or as soft as you wish. So far, my premise is proving correct. The beauty is it's simplicity; turn/turn, with never a thought about sequencing, timing, get in the slot, hip bump or turn,etc.When executing correctly, I just rotate the arm pits. That's all I did on the 150 pw.

Peace, and I'll familiarize myself better with the site prior to jumping in elsewhere.

[iacas]

Post some proof please. We are not opposed to learning anything. We try to all the time. But we're also cynical, too. You have to be or you waste a lot of time.

[Joe Hill]

DTL view of 150 yd pitching wedge

http://www.swingacademy.com/videoplayer.aspx?id=32507

[iacas]

DTL view of 150 yd pitching wedge [URL=http://www.swingacademy.com/videoplayer.aspx?id=32507]http://www.swingacademy.com/videoplayer.aspx?id=32507[/URL]

To be fair, Joe, I did say proof. That's just a swing.

[Joe Hill]

True, but I can't go back in time and have you pace it off with me. My step is 101 per 100 yds, and it paced at 153. As time goes forward and I develop this swing further, gaining confidence, I'll surely have it speed checked etc. Til then...

[iacas]

True, but I can't go back in time and have you pace it off with me. My step is 101 per 100 yds, and it paced at 153. As time goes forward and I develop this swing further, gaining confidence, I'll surely have it speed checked etc. Til then...

Yes, till then, we have our doubts. PGA Tour pros don't average that speed.

[Joe Hill]

PGA Tour pros don't average that speed.

I know...that's what scares me.

But back to my original point, because I didn't want to make this about my swing per se, the right arm indeed releases directly and authoritatively back to the ball with no manipulation from that position. Can you see that?

[iacas]

I know...that's what scares me.

But back to my original point, because I didn't want to make this about my swing per se, the right arm indeed releases directly and authoritatively back to the ball with no manipulation from that position. Can you see that?

I disagree that it does, and I think you're confusing your feels for what happens in reality.

Your sweet spot isn't on the plane, so you need to do something to get it on the plane. You're having to make an out-of-plane adjustment/compensation or you'd swing several inches inside the ball.