Amateur vs Pro putting stroke

[iacas]

Originally Posted by The_Pharaoh

I should have been more specific, I meant on putts under 10 ft. For more than that distance, I would say it is almost impossible to be SBST. I feel as if I am SBST on every putt but the longer the stroke the more arc I have.

Yes. Though I don't recall the specific numbers, something like 0.5% of the pros tested are SBST for very small strokes.

I would maintain that an SBST stroke requires wrist manipulations to keep the putter face square to the target line, but on small strokes those manipulations can be off a fair amount and still deliver the putter head with enough accuracy to find the cup.

Originally Posted by JetFan1983

I feel SBST as well, but mostly because I used to swing on too big of an arc. I would hear stuff like "you cannot be SBST. You are always playing on an arc." And of course, that is true. But I misinterpreted the point because when I would putt, I would think about this arc I had to be on... and of course, it made the face angle at impact too erratic.

I started to think about SBST as my feeling and I've been able to start the putt on my line. So I'm still on an arc, but I need the SBST "feeling."*

Exactly. The lie angle of a putter is pretty upright. It's a small arc.

Hence Mike's post about the fact that pros have less face rotation. If you take the putter back two feet the face shouldn't be 40 degrees open. ;-)

[MotorMike]

I'm a huge fan of Dave Pelz.  His Bible on putting is all about trying to attain SBST.  In that pursuit pros are more proficient at attaining that due to more practice.  The movement toward longer putters that require more upright stances allow for more ease of efficiency  toward SBST.

I note in some of the posts about putting is easier on faster green speeds.  What I find interesting is the lack of discussion surrounding course conditioning.  Typically I find when I play better places the green speeds are faster but it's much more than that. The greens are in better shape.  So even if great course let their grass grow a little and the speed was average to lesser quality courses they would still putt better due to their condition. Rolling greens regardless of speed makes putting easier.

Pelz spoke of amount of play too in his book.  When you play a course that is played a lot around the hole you'll find a circumference of a donut like pattern.  As golfers step in to get their ball and typically finish with a short putt they form this ever so slight donut pattern.  Courses with less play have less of a donut pattern.

[iacas]

Originally Posted by MotorMike

I'm a huge fan of Dave Pelz.  His Bible on putting is all about trying to attain SBST.  In that pursuit pros are more proficient at attaining that due to more practice.  The movement toward longer putters that require more upright stances allow for more ease of efficiency  toward SBST.

Did you miss the part of the discussion where we talked about how no pro is SBST on putts longer than 10-15 feet because it's basically impossible?

[IceDave]

Having seen some excellent putters, it seems to be based on belief, skill and a lot of practice.  You've got to believe that ball will fall into the hole.  The worst putters I've seen have all broken the belief rule and fail and fail again.

Regarding SBST and Pelz, do those of you who use his methods miss the "feel" in putting as he advocates more of a shoulder turn and dead hands?  I went from Pelz over to something more like Utley basically because I couldn't "feel" anything on long putts, I was all over the place with regards to distance.

[bunkerputt]

This weekend I tried making the setup changes from Mike's videos, basically pull the elbows back and make a more connected stroke with less of an armsy motion.  What a complete disaster.  Everything was short.  I couldn't even get to the hole on putts longer than 10 feet if I tried.  I felt like I would have to basically jump and hit the ball very hard with my body just to get to the hole.  There was a lot of acceleration and "hit" whereas with my armsy action I could just take a long stroke and let gravity do the work.  My conclusion is:  when playing on long grainy grass that stimps at 8 or less, be prepared to suffer unless you use your arms and make a long stroke.  Did Ben Crenshaw have a long armsy stroke because he was from Texas?  I don't know.  But you need the length to develop touch on most of the greens here.  Otherwise you have to force the putt with a lot of "hit".  The longer the stroke, the more the face rotates.  Far from leading to inconsistency, this longer stroke greatly improves consistency on slower greens .  Maybe the connected thing works on fast greens, but I find it frustratingly stodgy on slow greens.