Specific questions about slow play.

[zeg]

Originally Posted by BuckeyeNut

Even if their pace is 4hrs and they still fall behind, they are in the wrong and need to pick it up.  If they have an early tee time and cant keep up with a brisk early morning pace, they shouldn't be on the course early.

I disagree. There's no need to speed up if you're playing a decent pace (i.e., keeping with a posted pace or the typical pace for the course). Sure, if you can play faster, by all means do so, but there's no need to hurry up just because a group of race horses is ahead of you.  Everyone has a right to play a comfortable round at a reasonable pace.

If a space opens up ahead and the group behind is right on your heels, then let them through, of course.

Finally, regarding playing through and when to do so, I often find it works best to play through by teeing off with the group you're passing.  Everyone hits a tee shot and heads off to their balls, they just wait for you to get ahead before they play their seconds. This way no time is wasted if there's an errant tee shot---they can search and re-tee if needed while you're moving ahead, rather than waiting for you to clear and then teeing off.  Sometimes I've even seen it work to play most of the hole with the group, then putt out first and move on at the next hole.

[sean_miller]

Originally Posted by zeg

Quote:

Originally Posted by BuckeyeNut

Even if their pace is 4hrs and they still fall behind, they are in the wrong and need to pick it up.  If they have an early tee time and cant keep up with a brisk early morning pace, they shouldn't be on the course early.

I disagree. There's no need to speed up if you're playing a decent pace (i.e., keeping with a posted pace or the typical pace for the course). Sure, if you can play faster, by all means do so, but there's no need to hurry up just because a group of race horses is ahead of you.  Everyone has a right to play a comfortable round at a reasonable pace.

If a space opens up ahead and the group behind is right on your heels, then let them through, of course.

Finally, regarding playing through and when to do so, I often find it works best to play through by teeing off with the group you're passing.  Everyone hits a tee shot and heads off to their balls, they just wait for you to get ahead before they play their seconds. This way no time is wasted if there's an errant tee shot---they can search and re-tee if needed while you're moving ahead, rather than waiting for you to clear and then teeing off.  Sometimes I've even seen it work to play most of the hole with the group, then putt out first and move on at the next hole.

Is it fair to beginners and slowish players (hacker or scratch - either way) to have to keep a faster less relaxing pace than the mid-day groups? Who's to say what's fair? Considering it's the accepted practice on every course in our area that if you're teeing off before 09:00 you'd better do your best to keep up with the group ahead, (twilight rounds also really hum along - hold up certain twilight groups and you'd better be wearing a helmet) I'd say most golfers see it as fair.

Also, who's to say what's a reasonable pace? Basically around here not every tee time comes with the same expectations for pace of play. The "posted pace of play" does not apply to the morning groups and if you get the first tee time of the day play very quickly (or let groups through quickly - and politely). It's not about fair. It's just how it's done.

[zeg]

Originally Posted by sean_miller

Is it fair to beginners and slowish players (hacker or scratch - either way) to have to keep a faster less relaxing pace than the mid-day groups? Who's to say what's fair? Considering it's the accepted practice on every course in our area that if you're teeing off before 09:00 you'd better do your best to keep up with the group ahead, (twilight rounds also really hum along - hold up certain twilight groups and you'd better be wearing a helmet) I'd say most golfers see it as fair.

Also, who's to say what's a reasonable pace? Basically around here not every tee time comes with the same expectations for pace of play. The "posted pace of play" does not apply to the morning groups and if you get the first tee time of the day play very quickly (or let groups through quickly - and politely). It's not about fair. It's just how it's done.

That's what I meant by "typical pace for the course." If the pace for Saturday mornings is faster than Sunday afternoons, that's fine. If it's just one group ahead of you, though, that's different.

And the pro shop or course management get to say what's a reasonable pace. Everywhere I've played has a note on the scorecard and/or the tee placards indicating what the expected pace is. If there is the expectation that certain times are intended to be faster, they have a duty to inform new players to the course of that expectation.

[sean_miller]

Originally Posted by zeg

Quote:

Originally Posted by sean_miller

Is it fair to beginners and slowish players (hacker or scratch - either way) to have to keep a faster less relaxing pace than the mid-day groups? Who's to say what's fair? Considering it's the accepted practice on every course in our area that if you're teeing off before 09:00 you'd better do your best to keep up with the group ahead, (twilight rounds also really hum along - hold up certain twilight groups and you'd better be wearing a helmet) I'd say most golfers see it as fair.

Also, who's to say what's a reasonable pace? Basically around here not every tee time comes with the same expectations for pace of play. The "posted pace of play" does not apply to the morning groups and if you get the first tee time of the day play very quickly (or let groups through quickly - and politely). It's not about fair. It's just how it's done.

That's what I meant by "typical pace for the course." If the pace for Saturday mornings is faster than Sunday afternoons, that's fine. If it's just one group ahead of you, though, that's different.

And the pro shop or course management get to say what's a reasonable pace. Everywhere I've played has a note on the scorecard and/or the tee placards indicating what the expected pace is. If there is the expectation that certain times are intended to be faster, they have a duty to inform new players to the course of that expectation.

New players to the game or new players to that course?

If they're brand new golfers they have a duty to ask what is a good time to play for someone who will certainly be slower than the average player.

[zeg]

Originally Posted by sean_miller

New players to the game or new players to that course?

If they're brand new golfers they have a duty to ask what is a good time to play for someone who will certainly be slower than the average player.

Well, I was thinking of new to the course---or really, players who may not be aware of the "busy" times. If the course expects to maintain a particular pace, it needs to inform those playing of that expectation. Leaving it to the players on the course to sort out is not a good solution.

[colin007]

if youre playing by yourself and you take more than 3 hours, youre slow.

[sean_miller]

Originally Posted by zeg

Quote:

Originally Posted by sean_miller

New players to the game or new players to that course?

If they're brand new golfers they have a duty to ask what is a good time to play for someone who will certainly be slower than the average player.

Well, I was thinking of new to the course---or really, players who may not be aware of the "busy" times. If the course expects to maintain a particular pace, it needs to inform those playing of that expectation. Leaving it to the players on the course to sort out is not a good solution.

It's very possible that someone doesn't know the earliest times of the day, especially on Friday-Sunday, are most often preferred by the quickest players who want to get done ASAP and get on with other things. At many courses there will certainly be a lot of peer pressure to either speed up, pick up, or not play that early again.

I have to assume this type of peer pressure is generally considered a good thing based on countless comments I've read on this site. Experienced golfers are often encouraged to help new golfers learn the intracacies of on course etiquette and ways to play quicker. Imagine how much quicker this new player will become. They'll probably wonder "what's the hold up?!?" when teeing off at 11:00 am.