Lesson Frequency

[GlasgowsGreen]

I have been having lessons for 2 years now, averaging about 1 lesson every 6 to 8 weeks. After each lesson I spend a lot of time (a lot!) practicing what I have been taught.

To be honest, I'm really not satisfied with my progress over the 2 years. It has been slow and at time backwards and I don't feel that I am much further forward.

Whilst I appreciate that there are a huge number of factors affecting my progress e.g. quality of instruction, personal ability etc, could it be that I am not having lessons on a frequent enough basis?

If you can only afford 4 lessons (for example) Is it better to have a block of 4 lessons in a month than have the 4 lessons spread over 6 months?

[GlasgowsGreen]

To expand on my post, on a number of occasions I have left a lesson with a 'thought' in my head, which I then spend 6 weeks trying to ingrain into my swing, only to return for a lesson and discover that I have either;

1. Got the wrong end of the stick entirely i.e. misconstrued advice I'd been given

2. Went from one extreme to the other

This is very frustrating as I have spent a great deal of time and effort, not to mention money at the driving range, trying to ingrain the incorrect technique, which I then must try and 'undo'.

If I had only left it 1 week rather than 6 I would have realised the error of my ways much sooner before it did me too much harm.

But obviously lessons are expensive and if I pay for 4 in a short space of time, I will have to wait an even longer period of time before returning for the 5th!

[The_Pharaoh]

I recommend half an hour a week just to keep you on track. Make sure the pro you are working with uses a video camera so you can see what he wants you to do. Then practice using a video camera yourself so you know you are achieving the right positions.

[Hollister]

+1 for videoing your swing.

Did you consider online lessons? I can recommend http://evolvr.thegolfevolution.com good value - check it out.

[iacas]

We had one student, Roger, come to us each spring the past few years. He'd get one or two things to work on, do those things ALL YEAR, and then come back the next spring for tweaks/refinements/new stuff. He went from a 27 to an 11 the first year, went "up" to a 14 over the winter, and went down to a 6 that summer. Some people come to see us every two weeks. Some every few months. Most people have the same flaws over and over and over and over and over again. If you're not diligent about fixing them, and actually WORKING on those particular things, then technically you should get the same lesson again because that thing is still the #1 priority piece for you to fix. Now, one of the many differences between a lousy instructor and a good or great instructor is that the GOOD or GREAT instructor will give you the SAME LESSON again. It's the #1 priority piece, after all, so you need to fix it first. Now, they may not give the same exact lesson in terms of how you feel it, or accomplish fixing it, but they should attack the same problem. The lousy instructor will just make up something new to work on. They'll be afraid that if they tell you "same lesson" you won't come back. Of course, this assumes the lousy instructor can even identify the #1 priority piece. A lot of them just say things like "nope, your tempo was bad there" and other b.s. until you hit a good shot and then they say "see, you did it on that one." :-)

[Hollister]

Originally Posted by iacas

Most people have the same flaws over and over and over and over and over again.

Count me in on that. Thats why a cam is so damn important. Self assessment and correction gets you further. I am repeating the lessons from a year ago over and over, because several things tend to revert back to where I was 18 months ago. And that is the very reason why I value distance/video instruction. Would be nice to have Erik and friends for an in-person lesson a bit nearer to where I am.

Thats the fun of golf - learning never ends. Hit, view the video, smile, repeat.

[GlasgowsGreen]

Thanks for the comments guys

[turbosdad]

this post fits with some of the questions that I have.  I have been in lessons, once per week for a year.  Take away holidays, missed days or inclement weather and it may really be one lesson every 10 or 12 days for a year.

In this time frame, my instructors consisted of a guy that hung his shingle at a driving range, golftec, course pro at a quality course, and a guy with a big school and several instructors working under him.

during the week, I will practice about 2-3 times.

My problem is I played today and shot a 107 from the white tees on a 5600 yard course.  At this point I cant use my driver due to the big slice so I hit my three wood now.  Irons are ok, driver is 200 yards and rarely straight.  Fairway woods are reasonable, 180 and 200.  Chip and pitch are 50% at best.  Putting is reasonable.

What do I do, 107 from the whites just seems terrible.

[GlasgowsGreen]

Originally Posted by turbosdad

this post fits with some of the questions that I have.  I have been in lessons, once per week for a year.  Take away holidays, missed days or inclement weather and it may really be one lesson every 10 or 12 days for a year.

In this time frame, my instructors consisted of a guy that hung his shingle at a driving range, golftec, course pro at a quality course, and a guy with a big school and several instructors working under him.

during the week, I will practice about 2-3 times.

My problem is I played today and shot a 107 from the white tees on a 5600 yard course.  At this point I cant use my driver due to the big slice so I hit my three wood now.  Irons are ok, driver is 200 yards and rarely straight.  Fairway woods are reasonable, 180 and 200.  Chip and pitch are 50% at best.  Putting is reasonable.

What do I do, 107 from the whites just seems terrible.

That's a lot of lessons but to be fair a year isn't a long time. How were you playing when you started?

Golf is a very hard game with very fine margins. My game and my swing have visibly improved but my scorecards haven't. From a scorecards perspective there's not much difference between a 5 iron that slices right into the rough, and a 5 iron that flys straight as an arrow but over shoots the green. The latter is a better/ harder/ more enjoyable shot but even still you are having to play another shot onto the green.

[The_Pharaoh]

Originally Posted by iacas

Most people have the same flaws over and over and over and over and over again. If you're not diligent about fixing them, and actually WORKING on those particular things, then technically you should get the same lesson again because that thing is still the #1 priority piece for you to fix.

Now, one of the many differences between a lousy instructor and a good or great instructor is that the GOOD or GREAT instructor will give you the SAME LESSON again. It's the #1 priority piece, after all, so you need to fix it first. Now, they may not give the same exact lesson in terms of how you feel it, or accomplish fixing it, but they should attack the same problem.

I couldn't agree more. 75% of my students do not practice in between lessons so it is no wonder I keep working with them on the same thing. The lesson changes because I pull up another drill to help them with their number one issue. Quite often I tell my students NOT to come back for another lesson until they've nailed it.

Then, those that do practice do so incorrectly so inevitably get nothing out of their sessions. Even something as simple as laying clubs down on the ground to make sure they are aimed correctly at their target is overlooked. I spend a huge chunk of my lessons explaining to students how to practice efficiently AND get the most out of their lessons.

[sportsnut]

+1 on there is a lot to this game. Lessons are good for identifying flaws in your swing and developing a repeatable swing. The number of lessons anyone requires is a personal thing in my opinion in addition to do you practice and try to ingrain checkpoints. Thats what I call it anyway. I was a beginner last year at 61 decided on lesssons because I did not want to spned the rest of my life trying to get up to speed where I would feel comfortable at "playing the game", thats the important part, results take time and effort, but you want to be able to play and feel somewhat comfortable on the course so you can have "fun" at it. it took me till this summer to reach that point of fun, I break 100 fairly regularly and my instructor tells me I should be breaking 90 regularly according to the swing he sees. So I attribute that to the mental aspect of the game since I know I am making poor choices at times on the course, in other words always going for it and scrambling. An example of this is a few months ago I decided that short game was the key, eventually you reach the green but if you cant chip or putt you are lost. on monday I played a new course, my major mental problem took over when I dont know where the green is I try to bomb every shot, looked like I regressed to last year when I started, hitting poor tee shots and iron shots, once I got under 150 yads my short game took over and after getting my long game in order actually broke 100 in spite of some poor opening tee shots. moral of the story in my opiinion is practice your short game as much as possible even for only 15 minutes chip for a while then putt for a while, its actually free if you have a course nearby, practice at the driving range to eliminate and identify problems and take lessons as you can afford working on problem areas, play as often as you can cause the driving range means nothing if you cant play the course. track you stats: GIR, Fairways hit and putts, "make me a better golfer" is one site that works well and again is free. lastly dont give up and use your strengths.

JMHO and good luck.

[blue72ss]

KEEP IN MIND:  Golf may be the one sport where you can put in the time and actually get worse instead of better.  Problems I've had throughout my life:

1.  Practicing the wrong thing.

2.  Getting a lesson, practicing what I've been taught and then over-doing it and developing a new problem.

3.  Poor instructor/teacher - might help you hit balls better that paticular day but not necessarily for the long haul.

I've finally seen drastic improvements in my game when I've gotten older and wiser, I read alot and disect what info pertains to me.

Use video, this site is great.

Use video and compare it to guys on TV, generally you can see drastic differences.

[tasker]

Great thread. I too am in the same flaw crowd. But this year i am working with my coach on some prctical check points i can use and remeber to relate to a good outcome. Before this i would do the drills etc, but would gravitate back to no mans land. At least now i feel like i have some markers i can latch on to.

[1puttit]

I'd say every 2-3 weeks.  A lot of it depends on how much time you have to practice. You want to have enough time between lessons to really work on what you've been taught but not so much time that you waste a lot of effort if you've strayed down the wrong path.

Originally Posted by iacas

Most people have the same flaws over and over and over and over and over again. If you're not diligent about fixing them, and actually WORKING on those particular things, then technically you should get the same lesson again because that thing is still the #1 priority piece for you to fix.

Now, one of the many differences between a lousy instructor and a good or great instructor is that the GOOD or GREAT instructor will give you the SAME LESSON again. It's the #1 priority piece, after all, so you need to fix it first. Now, they may not give the same exact lesson in terms of how you feel it, or accomplish fixing it, but they should attack the same problem. The lousy instructor will just make up something new to work on. They'll be afraid that if they tell you "same lesson" you won't come back.

HUGE +1000 on this. My son as a junior took lessons every week. He'd work on one issue one week, next week a different issue and by the third or fourth week we'd be back to the first issue. This cycle went on for almost a year. We never got the key issue straightened out as we did not just keep pounding away at it. Each week it was something different and we kept going around in circles.

[The_Pharaoh]

Originally Posted by 1puttit

You want to have enough time between lessons to really work on what you've been taught but not so much time that you waste a lot of effort if you've strayed down the wrong path.

This is very important. The large majority of students struggle to exaggerate the new change enough to make any difference. A lot of my students stay on after the lesson to hit balls, yet the moment I am not standing there with them they drift back to what they were doing prior to the lesson. They've already removed the alignment sticks/clubs from the ground and are wildly swinging away as if the objective is to hit 1,000 balls in 5 minutes. When I go back over to them to offer some assistance, they tell me the change isn't working! I, of course, tell them the change will work, your old swing doesn't.

The details in golf are very important. I am a very active teacher and like to move around while the student is hitting balls so I can be sure they are not slipping back into old habits i.e. incorrect ball position, handle position, shoulder alignment etc. This is why I like to put alignment sticks down on the ground so they can see where their feet are positioned and where the ball should be placed relative to the position of their feet. This is another reason why a lot golfers complain they hit the ball really well during the lesson, but terribly hitting balls on their own or on the course. They lack attention to detail.

At my academy we are actually considering preparing a small flyer to hand out to everyone that passes through detailing how to take full advantage of a golf lesson and make the most out of their practice time. Also, we are studying the idea of offering a monthly rate to golfers that have the time to practice 3-4 times a week. So instead of paying for an hour lesson once a week, they can have 4 15-min lessons or 3 20-min lessons a week just to make sure they don't go off the rails.

[The Recreational Golfer]

We have only limited practice time, so I don't think you should have another lesson until you have learned what the original lesson was trying to teach you. If that's two weeks, fine. If it's all year, fine. Along the way, there's nothing wrong with having another lesson the same thing just to make sure you're on the right track.

I find that the problems I take a lesson to solve have elements in the solution that can affect every stroke in the bag, so the better I get at this one thing, the better I get at everything else -- if I've taken the time to really lean it.

"Learn it" means I can do it first time, not after a few warm-up tries, which you don't get on the course.

[GaryH]

Originally Posted by The_Pharaoh

At my academy we are actually considering preparing a small flyer to hand out to everyone that passes through detailing how to take full advantage of a golf lesson and make the most out of their practice time. Also, we are studying the idea of offering a monthly rate to golfers that have the time to practice 3-4 times a week. So instead of paying for an hour lesson once a week, they can have 4 15-min lessons or 3 20-min lessons a week just to make sure they don't go off the rails.

Wonderful idea.  I think that would really help your students.

[GaryH]

Originally Posted by iacas

We had one student, Roger, come to us each spring the past few years.

He'd get one or two things to work on, do those things ALL YEAR, and then come back the next spring for tweaks/refinements/new stuff.

He went from a 27 to an 11 the first year, went "up" to a 14 over the winter, and went down to a 6 that summer.

Some people come to see us every two weeks. Some every few months.

Most people have the same flaws over and over and over and over and over again. If you're not diligent about fixing them, and actually WORKING on those particular things, then technically you should get the same lesson again because that thing is still the #1 priority piece for you to fix.

Now, one of the many differences between a lousy instructor and a good or great instructor is that the GOOD or GREAT instructor will give you the SAME LESSON again. It's the #1 priority piece, after all, so you need to fix it first. Now, they may not give the same exact lesson in terms of how you feel it, or accomplish fixing it, but they should attack the same problem. The lousy instructor will just make up something new to work on. They'll be afraid that if they tell you "same lesson" you won't come back.

Of course, this assumes the lousy instructor can even identify the #1 priority piece. A lot of them just say things like "nope, your tempo was bad there" and other b.s. until you hit a good shot and then they say "see, you did it on that one."

Great post.