Selling my clubs to buy Miura?

[Golfingdad]

  ApocG10 said:

Originally Posted by ApocG10

no bone to pick, and not worked up. Just sick of people pretending that Miura makes some magical irons that are somehow better than Mizuno or any other forged club. Forged is forged. The only difference is the finishing technique, which is done by hand. No way Mizuno or Titleist or any large club maker could finish clubs by hand, because they make far too many. Miura's irons are expensive because of the low quantity made, and the hand finishing. But they dont feel or work any better than any other forged club.

  GaijinGolfer said:

Originally Posted by GaijinGolfer

For someone who is supposedly such a expert, you clearly dont understand the finer details of forging.  Forged isnt forged because you can tailor the feel of the iron based upon the blend of metals that you use and the temperature that you forge the metals at.

Forging is a fairly simple process but it does take skill and knowhow to get it right.  I suggest you drop the ego, open your mind and do some more reading on forging because you still have something to learn on the subject.

About Miuras, theyre great irons and you cant deny the quality and attention to detail with them.

I think Apoc is right, and I don't think he's being a jerk or anything either.  A lot of the "aura" surrounding Miura comes from the fact that they are able to be done by hand because of the low quantity made.  The same could be said for some brands of wooden baseball bats, or fly fishing rods, or any number of specialty items.  If Apoc's dad started making clubs with his equipment, there is no doubt that he could carve out a loyal following of customers with his attention to detail, quality control, etc etc.

[newtogolf]

I saw your later posts refined your position, but I had already responded to your post relating them to art.  I have no doubt Miura's are amazing, but the post I responded to sounded too much like a marketing blurb.  Sometimes high prices are related to higher quality while other times it's with the intent of exclusivity.  My guess is Miura sits somewhere in the middle.

  Mr. Desmond said:

Originally Posted by Mr. Desmond

No, I think you're carried away and did not read my posts.

It's a golf club, nothing more, nothing less is what I said.

I have perspective because I've looked back and learned from mistakes. Like others here, I've owned many different brands of golf clubs and was happy with them. I could choose another set and be happy with them.

I have no attachments to golf clubs, but I do have opinions about them.

[Mr. Desmond]

  newtogolf said:

Originally Posted by newtogolf

I saw your later posts refined your position, but I had already responded to your post relating them to art.  I have no doubt Miura's are amazing, but the post I responded to sounded too much like a marketing blurb.  Sometimes high prices are related to higher quality while other times it's with the intent of exclusivity.  My guess is Miura sits somewhere in the middle.

I do think any golf club is part art (not just Miura). But you can extend that to anything - an auto, a can opener, a television, etc., they are a blending of function and form. Good golf club design appeals to the eye and the mind and gives one confidence or just an overall good feeling that this club belongs in your hand and that you will plop it next to the hole with that club (it offers hope).

[newtogolf]

I agree with that 100%.  No matter how much I tried, I couldn't stand looking at my Callaway Diablo Edges and clubs like the Mizuno MP-59 I tested or the Hogan Apex II and my current AP1's line up right in my eyes.  I saw Miura makes a lefty club so when my game gets good enough I might have to try them out.

  Mr. Desmond said:

Originally Posted by Mr. Desmond

I do think any golf club is part art (not just Miura). But you can extend that to anything - an auto, a can opener, a television, etc., they are a blending of function and form. Good golf club design appeals to the eye and the mind and gives one confidence or just an overall good feeling that this club belongs in your hand and that you will plop it next to the hole with that club (it offers hope).

[Mr. Desmond]

  newtogolf said:

Originally Posted by newtogolf

I agree with that 100%.  No matter how much I tried, I couldn't stand looking at my Callaway Diablo Edges and clubs like the Mizuno MP-59 I tested or the Hogan Apex II and my current AP1's line up right in my eyes.  I saw Miura makes a lefty club so when my game gets good enough I might have to try them out.

If Miura appeals to you. The lefty CB irons they have is similar (or is) to a CB-202. It's a demanding club, older, and will not win a beauty contest in 8-PW. But they are gorgeous below 8i. I wish they had a lefty PP-9003. It is a friendlier design - still minimalist, still a thin top line and medium sole - still player-like as all Miura clubs. I would wait or email Adam Barr and ask them if they have plans... But the great thing is -- we have so many choices in clubs.

[ApocG10]

  GaijinGolfer said:

Originally Posted by GaijinGolfer

For someone who is supposedly such a expert, you clearly dont understand the finer details of forging.  Forged isnt forged because you can tailor the feel of the iron based upon the blend of metals that you use and the temperature that you forge the metals at.

Forging is a fairly simple process but it does take skill and knowhow to get it right.  I suggest you drop the ego, open your mind and do some more reading on forging because you still have something to learn on the subject.

About Miuras, theyre great irons and you cant deny the quality and attention to detail with them.

HAHAHAHAHAHA.

You are Miuras target audiance. That being people who are willing to believe their hype on a process that has changed very little since it was first introduced probably 2 thousand years ago. The heat you forge a metal at makes ZERO difference in feel. Only the way you cool the metal can have an effect, and forged irons are never quenched, because the last thing a club maker wants is hard face. You do not 'mix metals' when you forge. You stat with a SAE# steel, and from start to finish, that steel is the same. Miura doesn't make some magic steel, you need to come back to reality.

Again, you know nothing. I have been working with forges and metal presses since I could walk. My father has been forging metal his whole life. My brother will take over the business when he is gone. It comes down to one simple thing, the metal used. I say it again, tell me the SAS number steel they use, and I can hand you a set of irons that youu would NEVER be able to tell from a set of Miuras.

Give up your bullshit crusade, trying to make Miura into something they aren't. A forging is a forging, and the longer we have blind, deaf, and dumb consumers who believe that Miura somehow makes an iron that feels different, and performs better than other forgings, when it simply isn't true, the longer his irons will continue to be overpriced my double.There is no ego here. There is knowledge. I know far more than you do about forging, thats for sure. And I guarantee my dad knows every bit as much about forging as the Miura family does. You are arguing with someone who uses a forge regularly. The closest you have come to one is a silly video..

Miura irons are nothing special. At 12-1300$ they would be WELL PAID. The other $1500~ is what we call 'stupid tax', which is basicly the extra premium that stupid people pay to be seen with a name brand.

Give up, we are too smart around here to believe this crap. Many of us have tried Miuras, myself included. I played for two weeks with a set in California last winter, and Titleist makes a better feeling forged club, at 1/3rd the price. Continue to pay your stupid tax, ill continue to spend my money on equipment that will make a true difference, like shafts for my woods and hybrids.

[Sai-Jin]

Apoc: Can you please get the **** out of my thread and go to your dad for maturity lessons?

stop being a little bitch kid.  If you want to act tough or stupid, do it in real life where you see the person face to face.

And not behind the internet.

[ApocG10]

  Sai-Jin said:

Originally Posted by Sai-Jin

Apoc: Can you please get the **** out of my thread and go to your dad for maturity lessons?

stop being a little bitch kid.  If you want to act tough or stupid, do it in real life where you see the person face to face.

And not behind the internet.

Funny, when your wrong and have no more 'outs' to your outlandish claims, you get upset like a child and try to kick me out of 'your' thread. It doesn't work like that, you posted totally incorrect information, and we aren't going to just let you believe it, because doing so means that through your ignorance, others will get bad information about the forging process.

See, im not the bitch kid looking for validation on the internet. I also don't review irons after hitting a couple of dozen balls with them. Oh, and I dont give people incorrect information. The only little bitch here is you. Wanting to believe that your irons are somehow special. Going as far as to try to call them art.

No sir, I think you should leave this thread, or at least stop trying to mislead people.

So don't be angry. Be happy that I have educated you on a simple process that you knew nothing about.

And no, I will not get out of this thread. You dont get to make those decisions. When you stop giving out incorrect information, I will stop correcting you.

[GaijinGolfer]

  ApocG10 said:

Originally Posted by ApocG10

HAHAHAHAHAHA.

You are Miuras target audiance. That being people who are willing to believe their hype on a process that has changed very little since it was first introduced probably 2 thousand years ago. The heat you forge a metal at makes ZERO difference in feel. Only the way you cool the metal can have an effect, and forged irons are never quenched, because the last thing a club maker wants is hard face. You do not 'mix metals' when you forge. You stat with a SAE# steel, and from start to finish, that steel is the same. Miura doesn't make some magic steel, you need to come back to reality.

Again, you know nothing. I have been working with forges and metal presses since I could walk. My father has been forging metal his whole life. My brother will take over the business when he is gone. It comes down to one simple thing, the metal used. I say it again, tell me the SAS number steel they use, and I can hand you a set of irons that youu would NEVER be able to tell from a set of Miuras.

Give up your bullshit crusade, trying to make Miura into something they aren't. A forging is a forging, and the longer we have blind, deaf, and dumb consumers who believe that Miura somehow makes an iron that feels different, and performs better than other forgings, when it simply isn't true, the longer his irons will continue to be overpriced my double.There is no ego here. There is knowledge. I know far more than you do about forging, thats for sure. And I guarantee my dad knows every bit as much about forging as the Miura family does. You are arguing with someone who uses a forge regularly. The closest you have come to one is a silly video..

Miura irons are nothing special. At 12-1300$ they would be WELL PAID. The other $1500~ is what we call 'stupid tax', which is basicly the extra premium that stupid people pay to be seen with a name brand.

Give up, we are too smart around here to believe this crap. Many of us have tried Miuras, myself included. I played for two weeks with a set in California last winter, and Titleist makes a better feeling forged club, at 1/3rd the price. Continue to pay your stupid tax, ill continue to spend my money on equipment that will make a true difference, like shafts for my woods and hybrids.

Once again you prove that you arent anywhere near the expert that you claim to be.  The temp has nothing to do with feel?  LOL...Ok, whatever.

[DufnerDip]

Miura blows

[PinnacleGold]

Get the Miura's or you'll regret it. Golf clubs last so long, get what you really want. Give us some pics and reviews when you get em.

[DufnerDip]

Thank you pinnacle one of the only guys that doesn't freak out over a set of golf clubs that they won't even be owning to begin with. Someone actually has an honest opinion and doesn't get angry at the next guy. Everyone else, next time you have a thought, keep it to yourself. Guy asks about golf clubs and y'all have absolutely butchered his thread.

[Mr. Desmond]

  DufnerDip said:

Originally Posted by DufnerDip

Miura blows

... Everyone away?

It's just a golf club.

People ask questions because their friends, girlfriends, or wives don't share their interest, and they want to discuss them. Other people have agendas or are sensitive, and blow up threads. It happened with this one.

[iacas]

As usual the truth lies somewhere in the middle, most likely.

The shape of the club has a lot to do with the feel of the club.

The metal that's used, obviously, has a lot to do with it.

But that's about it.

P.S. This is all on topic, so far as I can tell. You asked what people thought of your plan, Sai-Jin. Don't get mad just because not everyone is backslapping you and telling you how awesome it'll be that you'll have a set of irons. I have a set of Miura. I don't even play them anymore. In fact, my current irons were built by a guy who worked for Miura in their forging factory.

[Sai-Jin]

Erik, opinions are fine and I'm not asking for a backslapping... but being a rude little kid and just cause arguments, is just annoying.

I don't like arguments in this manner

If someone doesn't like something, voice it in a mature way. And if it's the other way around, do the same.

I know I'm getting the clubs, I was mainly asking if it's worth it to get rid of my Mizunos.

[Shorty]

  Sai-Jin said:

Originally Posted by Sai-Jin

Erik, opinions are fine and I'm not asking for a backslapping... but being a rude little kid and just cause arguments, is just annoying.

I don't like arguments in this manner

If someone doesn't like something, voice it in a mature way. And if it's the other way around, do the same.

I know I'm getting the clubs, I was mainly asking if it's worth it to get rid of my Mizunos.

What you are going to find is that when you play your Miursa for the first time you will notice that they feel pretty much like every other club you have ever hit. ESpecially the MIzunos.

You will persist in convincing yourself that there is something special about them, whilst realising that they are like every other club on the market of a similar design.

I watched a program on how they make axes the other day. They showed the forging process which is EXACTLY what you see in the Miura factory, but because it wasn't a golf club they were showing there was no mystique. Just a hot and sweatuy workshop, juts like in those ridiculous Miura videos where they pretend that there is a link between the manufacture of Samurai swords and golf clubs. It was just a steelwoorking process in a modern factory, just like Miura.

You seem to be getting offended because you have made claims about these clubs that cannot be backed up. If anything, ownership of Miura clubs is an indicator of someone's preparedness to spend money, not their knowledge of golf clubs.

If they were any better than other clubs, the top players would gladly play them without a sponsorship fee because the extra money and titles they would win would compensate.

[Shorty]

  PinnacleGold said:

Originally Posted by PinnacleGold

Get the Miura's or you'll regret it. Golf clubs last so long, get what you really want. Give us some pics and reviews when you get em.

There are pics and reviews all over the internet already.

[Golfingdad]

  Shorty said:

Originally Posted by Shorty

What you are going to find is that when you play your Miursa for the first time you will notice that they feel pretty much like every other club you have ever hit. ESpecially the MIzunos.

You will persist in convincing yourself that there is something special about them, whilst realising that they are like every other club on the market of a similar design.

I watched a program on how they make axes the other day. They showed the forging process which is EXACTLY what you see in the Miura factory, but because it wasn't a golf club they were showing there was no mystique. Just a hot and sweatuy workshop, juts like in those ridiculous Miura videos where they pretend that there is a link between the manufacture of Samurai swords and golf clubs. It was just a steelwoorking process in a modern factory, just like Miura.

You seem to be getting offended because you have made claims about these clubs that cannot be backed up. If anything, ownership of Miura clubs is an indicator of someone's preparedness to spend money, not their knowledge of golf clubs.

If they were any better than other clubs, the top players would gladly play them without a sponsorship fee because the extra money and titles they would win would compensate.

See, this is what keeps popping up in imy head too.  I presume, based on the fact that a lot of pros play a lot of different brand clubs, that all of the top brands are all equally good ... it just comes down to what feels right to you.

Then again, what do I know? ... I play cast irons.