Match play opponent not truthful

[CraiginKSA]

I tee off and I think I see my ball go into a hazard.  The hazard is an area of grass, then water.  My opponent sees a ball which is beyond the hazard and states that ball is hers.  So I drop my ball, take a penalty and hit my third shot.

Then, she declares that no, that isn't her ball after all, it is my ball!  She finds her ball over in the rough.  I guess it's too late for me, as I already hit my third shot.  She ends up winning the hole.

No intention on her part to deceive.  I guess it's on me to verify.  Is there a rule that states you can't give out false information to your opponent?  Probably not.

Also, I hit my third shot from behind the hazard, so rightfully I would take another penalty for dropping and hitting a shot when my original ball was not in the hazard!

Anyway, it was only the second hole.  I recovered and put a nice, friendly, beat-down on her for the rest of the match.

[Mordan]

The rule regarding giving information to your opponent in match play is as follows:

b. Wrong Information

A player must not give wrong information to his opponent. If a player gives wrong information, he loses the hole.

A player is deemed to have given wrong information if he:

(i) fails to inform his opponent as soon as practicable that he has incurred a penalty, unless (a) he was obviously proceeding under a Rule involving a penalty and this was observed by his opponent, or (b) he corrects the mistake before his opponent makes his next stroke; or

(ii) gives incorrect information during play of a hole regarding the number of strokes taken and does not correct the mistake before his opponent makes his next stroke; or

(iii) gives incorrect information regarding the number of strokes taken to complete a hole and this affects the opponent’s understanding of the result of the hole, unless he corrects the mistake before any player makes a stroke from the next teeing ground or, in the case of the last hole of the match, before all players leave the putting green.

A player has given wrong information even if it is due to the failure to include a penalty that he did not know he had incurred. It is the player’s responsibility to know the Rules.

So she did not break any of those rules, however I'd say that a ruling would probably go in your favour from the match committee under equity should your opponent find your ball and deliberately conceal that from you. But if she was just mistaken then I doubt you'd get a ruling against her.

[MacDutch]

I think there is more to it than the above. First of all the rule above is rule 9: info as to strokes taken . So you must give correct info on strokes taken during a matchplay (including penalties).

Next there is the issue of seeing your ball go in the waterhazard.

Quote:

I tee off and I think I see my ball go into a hazard. The hazard is an area of grass, then water. My opponent sees a ball which is beyond the hazard and states that ball is hers. So I drop my ball, take a penalty and hit my third shot.

You thought the ball came to rest in the hazard and because a ball is not yours there is proof. This is not a correct way to establish virtual certainty, not even when that proved to be her ball. Desicion 26-1/1 is cristal clear:

26-1/1

Meaning of "Known or Virtually Certain"

When a ball has been struck towards a water hazard and cannot be found, a player may not assume that his ball is in the water hazard simply because there is a possibility that the ball may be in the water hazard. In order to proceed under Rule 26-1 , it must be "known or virtually certain" that the ball is in the water hazard. In the absence of "knowledge or virtual certainty" that it lies in a water hazard, a ball that cannot be found must be considered lost somewhere other than in a water hazard and the player must proceed under Rule 27-1 .

When a player's ball cannot be found, "knowledge" may be gained that his ball is in a water hazard in a number of ways. The player or his caddie or other members of his match or group may actually observe the ball disappear into the water hazard. Evidence provided by other reliable witnesses may also establish that the ball is in the water hazard. Such evidence could come from a referee, an observer, spectators or other outside agencies. It is important that all readily accessible information be considered because, for example, the mere fact that a ball has splashed in a water hazard would not always provide "knowledge" that the ball is in the water hazard, as there are instances when a ball may skip out of, and come to rest outside, the hazard.

In the absence of "knowledge" that the ball is in the water hazard, Rule 26-1 requires there to be "virtual certainty" that the player's ball is in the water hazard in order to proceed under this Rule. Unlike "knowledge," "virtual certainty" implies some small degree of doubt about the actual location of a ball that has not been found. However, "virtual certainty" also means that, although the ball has not been found, when all readily available information is considered, the conclusion that there is nowhere that the ball could be except in the water hazard would be justified.

In determining whether "virtual certainty" exists, some of the relevant factors in the area of the water hazard to be considered include topography, turf conditions, grass heights, visibility, weather conditions and the proximity of trees, bushes and abnormal ground conditions.

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Now back to the question asked

Giving information is ok as long as you are not giving advise. Giving incorrect information is ok as long as you are not giving advise but......... see rule 33-7 and desicion 9-2/12

33-7 . Disqualification Penalty; Committee Discretion

A penalty of disqualification may in exceptional individual cases be waived, modified or imposed if the Committee considers such action warranted.

Any penalty less than disqualification must not be waived or modified.

If a Committee considers that a player is guilty of a serious breach of etiquette, it may impose a penalty of disqualification under this Rule.

9-2/12

Conscious Failure to Correct Opponent's Misunderstanding of State of Match; What Constitutes Wrong Information

Q. In a match, B is 1 up on A playing the 14th hole. A and B take 6's at the 14th hole, but B, assuming A scored a 5, says: "We are now all square." A says nothing although he knows that both have scored a 6 and he is still 1 down.

At the end of the 17th hole, B, believing he is 2 down, concedes the match, although in fact he is only 1 down. Is A subject to penalty under Rule 9-2 for giving wrong information?

A. No. Rule 9-2 deals with giving wrong information as to the number of strokes taken at a hole and would include acquiescence by the player (whether oral or tacit) in a misstatement by his opponent of the number of strokes taken by the player. Wrong information does not include acquiescence by the player in a misstatement by his opponent of the result of a hole or the state of the match.

However, A's conscious failure to correct B's misunderstanding of the state of the match is so contrary to the spirit of the game that the Committee should disqualify A under Rule 33-7 and reinstate B.

[Dormie1360]

Originally Posted by CraiginKSA

I tee off and I think I see my ball go into a hazard.  The hazard is an area of grass, then water.  My opponent sees a ball which is beyond the hazard and states that ball is hers.  So I drop my ball, take a penalty and hit my third shot.

Then, she declares that no, that isn't her ball after all, it is my ball!  She finds her ball over in the rough.  I guess it's too late for me, as I already hit my third shot.  She ends up winning the hole.

No intention on her part to deceive.  I guess it's on me to verify.  Is there a rule that states you can't give out false information to your opponent?  Probably not.

Also, I hit my third shot from behind the hazard, so rightfully I would take another penalty for dropping and hitting a shot when my original ball was not in the hazard!

Anyway, it was only the second hole.  I recovered and put a nice, friendly, beat-down on her for the rest of the match.

The ruling can go two ways based on whether there was Known or Virtual Certainty (KVC).  I'm not in a position to decide that, however you can read decision 26-1/1 that was posted to help decide.

If there was KVC you played the hole correctly under the rules.  The fact that your original ball was found outside the hazard is irrelevant.  You are required to continue with the dropped ball under Rule 26-1, (Water Hazard).  See Decision 26-1/3.5

http://www.usga.org/Rule-Books/Rules-of-Golf/Decision-26/#26-1/3.5

If there was not KVC, then you were required to find your original golf ball.  If you did not find your original ball, you were required to play under Rule 27-1 (lost ball) and play your tee shot over. ( Rule 20-5 playing from previous spot).  The fact that you dropped a ball under the Water Hazard Rule means that you incorrectly substituted for your original ball under an inapplicable rule.  As you should have gone back to the tee and played, by dropping by the hazard and making a stroke, you played from a wrong place.  Rule 20-7.  As soon as you did this you lost the hole under match play.

I see nothing done by your opponent that would warrant any kind of breach on her part.  As you said there was no intention to deceive.

I should add that although you lost the hole because you played from a wrong place, what happens if you are not aware of this?  Depends.  If your opponent feels that you did something wrong and makes a "claim" (Rule 2-5) before anyone plays from the next tee, or if on the last hole, before everyone leaves the green,  then the matter is to be decided by the committee.  In this case because your opponent made a valid claim you lost the hole.  If your opponent watches everything you do and does not say anything, because she did not no the rule, then the hole stands as played.  If she were to later find out that she actually won the hole, it would not matter because the facts of what you did were known to her and she did not make a timely claim.

This would be different if you breached the rule and the breach was not observed by your opponent.  In this case,  if your opponent became aware of the breach before the match results were officially announced, and then made a claim, the committee could rule on the claim.

If the match results were officially announced, then she would have recourse only if you knowingly breached a rule and did not say anything, and she was unaware of these facts.

[Rulesman]

The only rule that could apply is the last para of 33-7 but as there was no dishonesty it doesn't.

It is your responsibility to know the state of your ball.

[phan52]

Originally Posted by Rulesman

The only rule that could apply is the last para of 33-7 but as there was no dishonesty it doesn't.

It is your responsibility to know the state of your ball.

This.

Plus, if you weren't really sure if the ball went in the hazard, you can't assume as much. You should have gone back to the tee.

But personally, I would have exhausted all possibilities before conceding that my ball was out of play.