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Posted
I have only been playing a few montgs and I have been working on changes in my swing. One of the suggestions he made was to create lag by not releasing the club until my left hand was in my left pocket. I tried this with very little success as it was hard for me to release it consistantly. I did some research on creating lag and some of it warned of the dangers of doing so especially for beginners. What do you think?

Posted

if you do the research, youll find that "lag" is a result of a good sequence, not necessarily something you can "create" to cover over other issues.  the main thing you want is to form a straight line from the left shoulder down the left arm and wrist and all the way down the shaft of the club to the ball.

Colin P.

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Posted

yes, the ball position would be different for every club, but you still want to have that straight line from the left shoulder to the ball on virtually all shots.  some people are able to get their hands ahead of the ball at impact and therefore have a forward leaning shaft which is ok, but under no circumstance would having a backwards leaning shaft and flipping be considered an efficient way of hitting the ball.  guess which way i play?  lol...i suck...

Colin P.

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Posted
I appreciate your quick response! It really had me confused and worried becuase I was really struggling with that!

Posted

no prob!

generally, ball position for the driver is off the left heel, and the irons would be between the middle of your stance and off your left shoulder, depending on the iron.

Colin P.

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Posted
Good advice by Colin. I would not try to add lag. Lag is a byproduct, not something you just go get.

 - Joel

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Posted

Weight forward, steady head, flat left wrist will produce a good amount of lag for you. Most loss of lag occurs because players loose there foundation in there swing and have to help the swing with there hands.

Matt Dougherty, P.E.
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Driver; :pxg: 0311 Gen 5,  3-Wood: 
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Wedges: :edel: (52, 56, 60),  Putter: :edel:,  Ball: :snell: MTB,  Shoe: :true_linkswear:,  Rangfinder: :leupold:
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Posted
I am definitely guilty of that!!! Sorry for all of the beginner questions but you keep your spine angled back so is the weight tranfer more of an increase to the front foot?

Posted
Would this be enough for you to consider a different coach? Maybe he is used to working with people with more experience but it seems like I should be working on more fundamentals and let the other things come with time. I just feel like we may be putting the cart before the horse a little

Posted
Originally Posted by blaylock6502

I am definitely guilty of that!!! Sorry for all of the beginner questions but you keep your spine angled back so is the weight tranfer more of an increase to the front foot?

Not really weight transfer, though you could say it is. Its better to think of it as pressure. You want to add pressure under your left heal through out the downswing. To me i like to almost get the sense i am pushing my foot into the ground in the downswing.

As for spine angle. I don't worry about it. If i keep my head still, spine angle takes care of it self. I always think of the swing in terms of body movements. The core follows the hips, shoulders follow the core, the arms follow the shoulders. So if you spin out, straighten your front leg fast, your shoulders will turn to fast, and now your hands have to come across the body. If you keep the flexion in your front leg longer, get your weight forward, you give time for the hands to work outward.

Matt Dougherty, P.E.
 fasdfa dfdsaf 

What's in My Bag
Driver; :pxg: 0311 Gen 5,  3-Wood: 
:titleist: 917h3 ,  Hybrid:  :titleist: 915 2-Hybrid,  Irons: Sub 70 TAIII Fordged
Wedges: :edel: (52, 56, 60),  Putter: :edel:,  Ball: :snell: MTB,  Shoe: :true_linkswear:,  Rangfinder: :leupold:
Bag: :ping:

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Posted
So it starts in the hips and let everything else follow in an upward sequence? Everything should be in line with the target at impact right?

Posted
theory yes, application of, good luck

Matt Dougherty, P.E.
 fasdfa dfdsaf 

What's in My Bag
Driver; :pxg: 0311 Gen 5,  3-Wood: 
:titleist: 917h3 ,  Hybrid:  :titleist: 915 2-Hybrid,  Irons: Sub 70 TAIII Fordged
Wedges: :edel: (52, 56, 60),  Putter: :edel:,  Ball: :snell: MTB,  Shoe: :true_linkswear:,  Rangfinder: :leupold:
Bag: :ping:

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Posted
Originally Posted by blaylock6502

I have only been playing a few montgs and I have been working on changes in my swing. One of the suggestions he made was to create lag by not releasing the club until my left hand was in my left pocket. I tried this with very little success as it was hard for me to release it consistantly. I did some research on creating lag and some of it warned of the dangers of doing so especially for beginners. What do you think?

Adding lag or holding lag can lead to shanks, steepness, early extension and a myriad of other issues. As others have said it's a byproduct of good swing sequence and a backswing that doesn't get too long.


Posted

I have found the first this most people need to do to create more lag is in the transition and the beginning of the downswing.  If you rip at it from the top you give away your lag right away.

You have heard people say I feel like the start of my downswing I just drop the club correct.  They are dropping their arms into a position (in front of their right pocket and the lag is maintained because they are not ripping from the start of the swing.  Effortless power.

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Posted
I have found the first this most people need to do to create more lag is in the transition and the beginning of the downswing.  If you rip at it from the top you give away your lag right away. You have heard people say I feel like the start of my downswing I just drop the club correct.  They are dropping their arms into a position (in front of their right pocket and the lag is maintained because they are not ripping from the start of the swing.  Effortless power.

Also guilty of that! :) That is one of the things I have been working on-letting the first move out of the top of my swing be a gravity move and pulling through with my left hand rather than push with the right. This seems to be helping more than anything else.


Posted
This is a seductive term especially for beginners because of its association with power and distance. Truth be told power and distance are not totally reliant on wrist cock or hingeing in your swing Its one part of a correct chain of movements. It happens because of other sequences in your swing. If you are tight or allow the right hand to dominate you can throw away lag actively. Also trying to create more lag can ruin your swing. I know I tried for a time trying to hold my lag. Not all of us are going to hit the ball 300 yards. Is it worth pursuing more lag for maybe a few extra yards even if its for another 10-15. If you concentrate on the swing as an overall package it will fall into place and distance will start to max out for you whatever talent you have will be revealed.

"Repetition is the chariot of genius"

Driver: BENROSS VX PROTO 10.5
Woods: BENROSS QUAD SPEED FAIRWAY 15"
Hybrids:BENROSS 3G 17" BENROSSV5 Escape 20"
Irons: :wilson: DEEP RED Fluid Feel  4-SW
Putter: BENROSS PURE RED
Balls: :wilsonstaff:  Ti DNA


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    • Please see this topic for updated information:
    • Please see this topic for updated information:
    • When you've been teaching golf as long as I have, you're going to find that you can teach some things better than you previously had, and you're probably going to find some things that you taught incorrectly. I don't see that as a bad thing — what would be worse is refusing to adapt and grow given new information. I've always said that my goal with my instruction isn't to be right, but it's to get things right. To that end, I'm about five years late in issuing a public proclamation on something… When I first got my GEARS system, I immediately looked at the golf swings of the dozens and dozens of Tour players for which I suddenly had full 3D data. I created a huge spreadsheet showing how their bodies moved, how the club moved, at various points in the swing. I mapped knee and elbow angles, hand speeds, shoulder turns and pelvis turns… etc. I re-considered what I thought I knew about the golf swing as performed by the best players. One of those things dated back to the earliest days: that you extend (I never taught "straighten" and would avoid using that word unless in the context of saying "don't fully straighten") the trail knee/leg in the backswing. I was mislead by 2D photos from less-than-ideal camera angles — the trail leg rotates a bit during the backswing, and so when observing trail knee flex should also use a camera that moves to stay perpendicular to the plane of the ankle/knee/hip joint. We have at least two topics here on this (here and here; both of which I'll be updating after publishing this) where @mvmac and I advise golfers to extend the trail knee. Learning that this was not right is one of the reasons I'm glad to have a 3D system, as most golfers generally preserve the trail knee flex throughout the backswing. Data Here's a video showing an iron and a driver of someone who has won the career slam: Here's what the graph of his right knee flex looks like. The solid lines I've positioned at the top of the backswing (GEARS aligns both swings at impact, the dashed line). Address is to the right, of course, and the graph shows knee flex from the two swings above. The data (17.56° and 23.20°) shows where this player is in both swings (orange being the yellow iron swing, pink the blue driver swing). You can see that this golfer extends his trail knee 2-3°… before bending it even more than that through the late backswing and early downswing. Months ago I created a quick Instagram video showing the trail knee flex in the backswing of several players (see the top for the larger number): Erik J. Barzeski (@iacas) • Instagram reel GEARS shares expert advice on golf swing technique, focusing on the critical backswing phase. Tour winners and major champions reveal the key to a precise and powerful swing, highlighting the importance of... Here are a few more graphs. Two LIV players and major champions: Two PGA Tour winners: Two women's #1 ranked players: Two more PGA Tour winners (one a major champ): Two former #1s, the left one being a woman, the right a man, with a driver: Two more PGA Tour players: You'll notice a trend: they almost all maintain roughly the same flex throughout their backswing and downswing. The Issues with Extending the Trail Knee You can play good golf extending (again, not "straightening") the trail knee. Some Tour players do. But, as with many things, if 95 out of 100 Tour players do it, you're most likely better off doing similarly to what they do. So, what are the issues with extending the trail knee in the backswing? To list a few: Pelvic Depth and Rotation Quality Suffers When the trail knee extends, the trail leg often acts like an axle on the backswing, with the pelvis rotating around the leg and the trail hip joint. This prevents the trail side from gaining depth, as is needed to keep the pelvis center from thrusting toward the ball. Most of the "early extension" (thrust) that I see occurs during the backswing. Encourages Early Extension (Thrust) Patterns When you've thrust and turned around the trail hip joint in the backswing, you often thrust a bit more in the downswing as the direction your pelvis is oriented is forward and "out" (to the right for a righty). Your trail leg can abduct to push you forward, but "forward" when your pelvis is turned like that is in the "thrust" direction. Additionally, the trail knee "breaking" again at the start of the downswing often jumps the trail hip out toward the ball a bit too much or too quickly. While the trail hip does move in that direction, if it's too fast or too much, it can prevent the lead side hip from getting "back" at the right rate, or at a rate commensurate with the trail hip to keep the pelvis center from thrusting. Disrupts the Pressure Shift/Transition When the trail leg extends too much, it often can't "push" forward normally. The forward push begins much earlier than forward motion begins — pushing forward begins as early as about P1.5 to P2 in the swings of most good golfers. It can push forward by abducting, again, but that's a weaker movement that shoves the pelvis forward (toward the target) and turns it more than it generally should (see the next point). Limits Internal Rotation of the Trail Hip Internal rotation of the trail hip is a sort of "limiter" on the backswing. I have seen many golfers on GEARS whose trail knee extends, whose pelvis shifts forward (toward the target), and who turn over 50°, 60°, and rarely but not never, over 70° in the backswing. If you turn 60° in the backswing, it's going to be almost impossible to get "open enough" in the downswing to arrive at a good impact position. Swaying/Lateral Motion Occasionally a golfer who extends the trail knee too much will shift back too far, but more often the issue is that the golfer will shift forward too early in the backswing (sometimes even immediately to begin the backswing), leaving them "stuck forward" to begin the downswing. They'll push forward, stop, and have to restart around P4, disrupting the smooth sequence often seen in the game's best players. Other Bits… Reduces ground reaction force potential, compromises spine inclination and posture, makes transition sequencing harder, increases stress on the trail knee and lower back… In short… It's not athletic. We don't do many athletic things with "straight" or very extended legs (unless it's the end of the action, like a jump or a big push off like a step in a running motion).
    • Day 135 12-25 Wide backswing to wide downswing drill. Recorder and used mirror. 
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