Pace Problem

[David in FL]

We can give better insight if we can see the specifics of the course....layout, tees, length, CR/slope, etc..... But if it's some kind of secret, I'm going to have to go back to, if you expect/accept slow play (and 4:30 is slow) you're going to get it. BTW.....they're holding the Q School finals for the Champions Tour down here this week. I played the same course 4 weeks ago, on Sunday morning. We finished in about 4:15. Tourists, long hard course, smokin fast greens, and all....

[Lihu]

We can give better insight if we can see the specifics of the course....layout, tees, length, CR/slope, etc.....

But if it's some kind of secret, I'm going to have to go back to, if you expect/accept slow play (and 4:30 is slow) you're going to get it.

BTW.....they're holding the Q School finals for the Champions Tour down here this week. I played the same course 4 weeks ago, on Sunday morning. We finished in about 4:15. Tourists, long hard course, smokin fast greens, and all....

And to add to that, it would be nice to meet at the said course for a "discounted $25" round?

Those tour ists, wouldn't happen to on the PGA?

[Cartboy]

BTW.....they're holding the Q School finals for the Champions Tour down here this week. I played the same course 4 weeks ago, on Sunday morning. We finished in about 4:15. Tourists, long hard course, smokin fast greens, and all....

See, you know the drill.

[Cartboy]

OK, season's almost over, but I'll entertain a foursome at $25 each next Spring, and y'all can critique it in person.

[David in FL]

See, you know the drill.

Yep.  And it doesn't have to take 5+ hours.

[David in FL]

And to add to that, it would be nice to meet at the said course for a "discounted $25" round?

Those tourists, wouldn't happen to on the PGA?

Actually, took the Dutch guys here.  Orange County National.  Mid-week, and they had the deal of the year.  $50 for all you can play for the day on two world class courses.  Included range balls, lunch in the grill, a sleeve of balls, and a $20 bounce back round for the following week!

[Cartboy]

Yep.  And it doesn't have to take 5+ hours.

See you next Spring, and you straighten us out.

At my 27-hole Florida course last Winter, we did 350-400 golfers a day, and it never took more than 4 hours.  We had the opposite problem, groups turning too fast, before their second nine was open.  FWIW, that always pissed them off.  (I'm new here . . .can I say that?)

It's a different animal.

[David in FL]

It's a different animal.

I wouldn't know. You won't tell us where you are...... I've played all over the country (relatively new to FL) and all over the world though. Tell em that 4:30 is ok and you'll get 5 hours every time. Golf is golf, wherever you are, I doubt that you're as unique as you think you are. I'll bow out of this one and just wish you guys the best. :beer:

[Cartboy]

Any other ideas on how to speed up slow groups on a very challenging course?

[ccotenj]

yes... make it less challenging.... your course (as well as many others i've played) seems to want to have its cake and eat it too... long rough, trees just off every fairway, fast greens with tough pin positions plus "tourist" golfers is not a recipe for a fast pace of play... heck, eliminate the "tourist" golfer part and its still not a recipe for fast pace of play... you can't have it both ways... cut the rough, slow the greens, put the pins in the easiest possible positions... station course workers in the most likely "i can't find my ball" locations to help find balls.... etc... give people an opportunity to play faster... you can put a ranger up the butt of every group on the course, but if the course setup is too hard, it won't make an appreciable difference (not to mention it'll tick off your customers to no end to have ranger rick aggravating them constantly)... example... a course i used to play had 3 foot (or more) long "grass like stuff" no more than 15 feet off of every fairway, 4-6" rough between the fairway and that and had horrible pace of play problems... cutting that stuff down to size improved the pace of play tremendously... i'm not saying that golfers aren't partially at fault for slow play (because they most definitely are), we've all seen (on more occasions that we can count) ways that "the other guy" can play faster... but course conditions/setup also contribute considerably to slow play... give me and the guys i play with a course we can handle, and we will get around it as fast as the group in front of us (and we suck bad, but play ready golf and don't follow the "rules")... give us a course where every ball off the fairway requires a search followed by a pitch out, and the results are what you might expect.... side note: given how strident some here are about "playing golf by the 'rules', and if you don't play by the rules, you aren't playing golf", i'm surprised at how many are blithely suggesting enforcing "don't play by the rules" policies... personally, i play "golf like" golf, but my guess is if you tried to force the "rules enforcers" to simply drop a ball every time it went in the treess, they wouldn't like it very much...

[MS256]

If anybody can figure out how to speed up golfers that simply don't give a crap, and are in their own little universe, without losing business they should patent the idea.

There is one new player in our Saturday game that takes forever to hit a shot. The captains pick him last and argue over who is going to get him. There was even talk this week of banning him from the game. It's a shame he doesn't get it because other than being slower than smoke off of $%&% he's a nice guy.

[Lihu]

Any other ideas on how to speed up slow groups on a very challenging course?

You mean legally?

[Fourputt]

Quote:

Originally Posted by David in FL

Yep.  And it doesn't have to take 5+ hours.

See you next Spring, and you straighten us out.

At my 27-hole Florida course last Winter, we did 350-400 golfers a day, and it never took more than 4 hours.  We had the opposite problem, groups turning too fast, before their second nine was open.  FWIW, that always pissed them off.  (I'm new here . . .can I say that?)

It's a different animal.

Try 120,000 rounds in a year on an 18 hole course in Colorado where we actually have winter.  Then you have learned to manage a golf course. The best I've heard mentioned there is 140,000 rounds, but that is the high end.

[Cartboy]

I generally agree that a tough course is going to offer pace problems, but I would disagree that we should not try to improve it.

I disagree that a slow group seeing a Ranger once an hour is harassment.  A Ranger staying with a group, lurking, watching, is.

When golfers see me on the course, even without a clearcut policy, most ask me how they're doing, and very few get upset when told they're behind pace.  It's all about how you do it, and that's what trying to fine tune.

When the pace is bad, the first comment we hear almost every time is, "& I didn't see a Ranger out there anywhere."  Y'all know that.

Our suggestions are only that, and would only be given to groups that need them.  I don't see that as harassment.

We are not suggesting that everyone who comes to our course play a different game of golf, just that they play the game of course at the pace it was intended to be played.

Because someone has paid money, it doesn't entitle them to screw up the day for 100 other golfers.

I understand that some golfers should not play our course, but I suspect if we promoted it that way, more who should not play it would.

[BuckeyeNut]

Although we have tried a lot of things, I will leave this open-ended.

I am in charge of Player Services at a very popular, very challenging course in a tourist area.  We get a lot of senior golfers, but they are not always the pace probblem. It can be the flatbellies who just have to play the tips!!!

We have shortened our tees, stress Tee it Forward, thinned the OB to speed up ball-hunting, have pace clocks on the first and tenth tees, have notices in the signholders on each cart,etc.

I'm looking for ideas on how to handle the groups we know are on a 5-hour-plus pace.  You know the ones . . . who never do anything wrong, so it can't be them!!!

We stress customer service and diplomacy

the only thing you can do is to tell any group not maintaining pace with the group ahead is.......................they need to catch up.  If they can't....make them pick-up and move forward to maintain pace.  That is all you can do.........

I play a tough course every day, and I'm here to say the same problem exists on all courses.  Whether it's tough or easy doesn't matter......maintaining pace of play is an issue on all courses.  To combat slow play...I choose to play first and lead the way.  For me.....it's the only way!!

My group plays so fast, that when we look back.........there is never a golfer in sight.......The closest thing in pursuit is an early morning rainbow...LOL

Nothing beats leading the way and setting the pace..........

[flopster]

I think one of the biggest causes of slow play is that people don't understand how to play with a cart, too often you see one player sitting in the cart while the other is taking his swing instead of parking the thing halfway between them and each walk to his shot, also one guy should walk in the last 100 yards if he has a pitch or chip to play while the other drives the cart as near the next tee as possible, maybe if courses would post this type of info/technique to playing with golf carts I'm sure it would help some.

[wils5150]

Try 120,000 rounds in a year on an 18 hole course in Colorado where we actually have winter.  Then you have learned to manage a golf course.   The best I've heard mentioned there is 140,000 rounds, but that is the high end.

that seems a bit high

[Fourputt]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fourputt

Try 120,000 rounds in a year on an 18 hole course in Colorado where we actually have winter.  Then you have learned to manage a golf course.   The best I've heard mentioned there is 140,000 rounds, but that is the high end.

that seems a bit high

It's a fact, however the 140,000 number includes players on the lighter used 9 hole executive course.  The actual number was 142,000 and change.  The 18 hole course is usually busy on the first tee from open (as early as 5:30 AM in summer), until 3 PM, then after 5 for 9 hole after work players.  Most tee times are filled with groups of 4.  I've seen Wednesday mornings when I couldn't even get a single walk-on out for up to 2½ hours because the tee sheet was full and everybody was showing up.