What to do when lessons aren't enough.....?

[Warik]

I've been playing for about 3 years, have had close to $1,000 worth of lessons over the past 2 years with 4 different instructors. I still suck at golf. By "suck" I don't mean "oh man I can't break 80 I totally suck" - I mean I'm a 36 handicap who shoots in the 110s, has only broken 100 once (98), and has no idea where to turn to start playing this game respectably.

I love the game but I can't play 9 holes without wanting to snap my clubs in two after each shot. It's not the short game either. No, I don't have a Tour-quality short game, but I have a good enough short game to be a 15-20 handicap. I simply have NO long game. Tee shots are sliced to kingdom come, fairway shots (if I ever end up in the fairway, that is) are either hit fat or sliced. Unless of course I try to hit a 3/5-wood off the deck... then they just end up getting topped.

The point of my post isn't to whine about my game (ok, at least not the entire point) - I just don't know where to go from here and need some guidance. I just want to be able to play a round of golf without wishing I had just stayed home after the 4th hole. Do I need to buy a particular swing training aid? Do I need to forget about trying to learn to swing the golf club correctly and just start making compensations (i.e. introducing swing flaws) to correct my other swing flaws? Do I forget about my last instructor and go find another one and another one and another one? Do I need to drive up to the Leadbetter Academy and blow a paycheck on one of their mini-schools? Heck, do I need to fly to Vegas and see Butch?

I feel like I'm so close to the "oh yeah... it all makes sense now" point where you suddenly realize what's been wrong the whole time and instantly drop 15 strokes and start having fun, but just can't get there. I don't mind spending the money to get better but I'm tired of continuing to pay instructors just to end up with the same embarrassing handicap month after month.

Is there any hope? What do I do now?

[keygolf]

Either you are finding instructors who struggle with their teaching, or you are not understanding what they are saying or the skills eay are recommending for you to develop, or you aren't sure how to practice after you have your lessons.

Check out the following location

[Shindig]

I've been playing for about 3 years, have had close to $1,000 worth of lessons over the past 2 years with 4 different instructors. I still suck at golf. By "suck" I don't mean "oh man I can't break 80 I totally suck" - I mean I'm a 36 handicap who shoots in the 110s, has only broken 100 once (98), and has no idea where to turn to start playing this game respectably.

There's hope. What's with this switching instructors? Find a guy you click with and stick with him. Progress is slow. I played for a while - a year's worth of playing serious, a little longer's worth of hitting balls - before breaking 100. It'll happen. In the meantime, keep practicing the short game too. Once my long game came together, my short game keeps me in the bogeys-and-better game 15 holes a round.

[powerfade]

I've been playing for about 3 years, have had close to $1,000 worth of lessons over the past 2 years with 4 different instructors. I still suck at golf. By "suck" I don't mean "oh man I can't break 80 I totally suck" - I mean I'm a 36 handicap who shoots in the 110s, has only broken 100 once (98), and has no idea where to turn to start playing this game respectably.

You say you feel close. Maybe it's not all in your mechanics? You probably have the mechanics to consistently break 100 especially with a decent short game.

When you're over the ball, are you thinking about your mechanics trying to make the correct swing or are you picturing the shot you're about to make and being more target oriented? Are you trying to "hit" the ball or make a golf "stroke"? Avoiding the hit instinct can help your tempo which can make your mechanics work for you. Thinking about mechanics while trying to play golf is a swing killer. Were you able to make good swings with the pros at the range? Did you ever take an on-course lesson with your pro's? Do you accept the things the pros try to teach you? My brother in law has been playing for almost 20 years. Sadly, he still struggles to break 100. I worked with him earlier this year (for only the second time ever) to fix his chronic reverse pivot. (His new baby put the lessons on the back burner for now ). I'm by no means a golf pro, but I feel I can get anyone to a point to where they can play good enough to enjoy it. I did that with my son (bogey golfer after 1 year with adult sized clubs). To make a long story short, I love the guy but I think he's unbelievably stubborn. Maybe he's read too many Golf Digest articles? His setup is offensive. If it worked, I wouldn't say that. I do know that he thinks about his mechanics while playing instead of just playing (he told me so). We played last weekend and I was happy to see a good weight shift, but there's still a lot of work to be done. He was well into the triple digits. I can hardly wait to work with him again, because there is always hope in golf.

[J.P.]

My humble opinion . . .

I have a somewhat similar past. Except I thought I could learn to play on my own, by books, video taping myself, etc . . . Alas, I could not.

I got so tired of not knowing the TRUTH - what was I doing and why. I finally decided I wanted to learn to strike the ball correctly - not some quick fix. I decided to give a swing overhaul a 1.5 year commitment. I decided my body would need to be in better shape, so I began a stretching program. I decided I needed first rate training - I did not want there to be any question about the swing info I was receiving.

I attended a Jim Mclean 2 day golf school to begin. I was given a couple critical items to work on/rehearse EACH DAY. I return for a follow up. I get a couple new items, with attention still paid to the first things. I continue to follow up every few months, and continue to work daily at home on those things my instructor tells me to focus on. ie. . we began with perfecting grip and set up. Next backswing, now progressing on to impact.

With daily work, the moves are ingrained by the time I get to the range for practice. It works. I am striking the ball like never before. Well.

When I began the training, last October, I was a 11.5 hcp mostly cause of a passable short game. I decided I would not keep a handicap till 2008 and have no expectations in this time of change. We'll see where I am next year.

There is no changing of teachers.

There is no experimenting and trying new things/tips.

There is no watching golf channel or reading Golf Digest to find out what to try.

There is only daily focus on stretching and positions/drill practice at home that have been directed by my teacher.

Time wise it only takes 20-30 minutes of stretch and 15 minutes of drill/position rehersal a day.

When I get to the range and course - all this is paying off in better ball striking. I still have a ways to go - impact is a challenge for me - but there is hope - I am a slow learner - and am getting better.

I am not familiar with Florida, but I know Jim Mclean has a school out there and I highly recommend you try them. They are very good.

Expect this to take some time - there is no quick fix.

Best of luck.

[gbk56]

I say hang in there and try something different. Maybe go to one of those courses or schools you mentioned. For me I found an instructor I was comfortable with, who I felt understood my questions and whose answers I could understand. For me asking lots of questions and spending more time playing on the course rather on the range really helped. Maybe you should consider playing lessons or something, but obviously your current methodology is not working for you; so change it.

[Logie]

Sounds to me like its either a mental issue when you stand over that ball or your not understanding what the instructor is trying to explain and your not feeling anything.

I had a small phase where i could not feel what the instructor was trying to teach. It sounds a bit naff but you really do need to feel whats happening in your swing.

Now i can feel when i swing over the top, leave the hands open etc

[Jack_2251]

Sounds to me like its either a mental issue when you stand over that ball or your not understanding what the instructor is trying to explain and your not feeling anything.

I completely agree with this. When I first started getting lessons I would do what I was told for the lesson, but give up on it as I played bad in the comp rounds. Also mental may be a huge part of it. If you are thinking about slicing, you WILL top it. I am not a great golfer, but I am 14 and have been playing for 14 months and reguarly play to 13/14. I have terrible swing mechanics but manage 70% of fairways of the tee and all drives over 210 yards.

[fusioncal]

I've been playing for about 3 years, have had close to $1,000 worth of lessons over the past 2 years with 4 different instructors. I still suck at golf. By "suck" I don't mean "oh man I can't break 80 I totally suck" - I mean I'm a 36 handicap who shoots in the 110s, has only broken 100 once (98), and has no idea where to turn to start playing this game respectably.

Do you have any difficulties with swinging golf clubs? Any back pain, disabilities, have had any accidents? How old are you?

Ok, here's a thing a pessimist would say, "Perhaps golf isn't for you." But an optimist would always say, "When there's a will, there's a way." Let's analyze your situation from what you've told us. - 3 years of playing. - 4 different instructors in the past 2 years. - Broke 100 only once. - Decent in the short game. - Having difficulties with long clubs. - Hitting inconsistently. Slice, fat, or thin shots are common. I'd respectfully say that the problem is you. You need to revisit your golf fundamental and find a very good instructor. Seems to me having 2 years of golf lesson with 4 different instructors means that either they're that bad or you weren't listening and following to their lead. Even the "okay" instructor should able to help you in your golf fundamental. Are you resisting to change? Some people I know are like that. Sometimes when I point to their mistake and they're just, "I'm okay." So I'm like, "Hey whatever, it's your swing." And this guy I'm referring to is the worst hitter among us and has never been able to hit the ball right. Again, my suggestion is to look for professional help and follow their lead. See where it takes you. I hope you improve. Cheers! Remember, golf isn't a perfect game. P.S: How's your putting anyway?

[Crate]

Motion Analysis Technology by TaylorMade. I'm going for it. It will tell you what your prob is.

[nevets88]

I was in a similar rut as well.

I was stuck at 90-100 for a couple of years, despite lessons and diligent practice and quit out of frustration. I had the typical wrist breakdown at impact most high handicaps have. Very inconsistent. I could have stuck with the swing and lowered the handicap with the short game, but I was stubborn and wanted to learn to swing correctly. I just couldn't figure it out though. My solution? I quit for 2 years.

I got the bug again and worked on impact, hitting the ball first, lowering my ball flight, etc... The goal was to get a technically correct swing, where that definition to me was hands ahead of the ball at impact, divot after the ball, proper release, decent distance, consistent and holds well under pressure.

It took awhile, but after hitting so many shanks, chunks and skulls that I lost count, I started to make progress to the point where I can shoot in the mid 80s. I've seen my swing on video and at impact, my hands are ahead of the ball now. Still have much room for improvement (especially when your swing is side by side with a pga pro's), but much better than the rut years.

What worked differently this time?

- Working on impact, lowering my ball flight, practicing more on grass, working on getting the divot after the ball, connecting where the clubhead actually is (and pointing to) to where I think/feel it is.

- Although I read alot of golf instruction during my rut, there was a disconnect between theory and on the course golf. It took awhile for all of it to sink in. Swing plane, cupped wrist, bowed wrist, weight on the insides of the feet, laid off, across the top, etc... Not being especially athletic, it just took alot of time, for me, for the theory to sink in.

- I took alot... alot of tension out of my swing - all swings. Especially in the arms. It's amazing how far you can hit the ball when you're loose.

My m.o. on instructors is to try different ones, and use what brings results. Although I've used different instructors, there are one or two I go back to.

When I was in my rut, one instructor, who has a good reputation, told me after 3 or 4 lessons over a month, that I basically hit a wall and to work with what I had, when I instinctively knew that my swing was not right.

To make a long story short, keep plugging away.

[beung]

Two keys to improving:

1) Work on one or two things at a time. You can't fix your whole swing at once. Work on one piece of the swing and once you have "mastered" that part of your swing then move onto the next thing.

2) Leasons are not enough, you have to practice what the swing coach is trying to teach you. If the instructor says do these drills to work on your alignment and grip, then when you are at the range make double sure and pay specific attention to the drill and what the drill is trying to do for your swing. Don't have what the instructor is trying to teach you in the back of your mind it should be your only thought while at the range. Don't get frustrated when your shots don't turn out the way you want and fall back onto your old swing. Of course the first half of the bucket of balls are going to be bad shots but give it some time for your body to adjust to the change and your game will be better for it.

[Warik]

Wow... a lot of replies. Thanks a lot. I'll try to address all questions/responses in this reply.

What's with this switching instructors?

First instructor was 2 free lessons + 2 I paid for when I bought my iron set a few years ago. Took the lessons, practiced a lot, didn't improve.

Second instructor was about a year later. I paid for a series of 4 lessons. Same deal as the previous.

Third instructor was a gift certificate for a 6 week clinic with like 9 other students who were ALL women whose boyfriends were trying to get them to learn how to play. Needless to say I got the minority of the attention and it was just an opportunity to pound away (incorrectly) at unlimited range balls.

Fourth instructor was a series of 6 lessons started about 3 months ago and taken 1 every 2 weeks. He helped me stop topping the ball. Now I just slice it or hit it fat. Hey, at least the distance has improved!

I don't expect a quick fix BUT I suck too much to not show significant improvement after more than a month. It should be much easier to improve your handicap starting at 36 than starting from 10-15 - and I haven't.

When you're over the ball, are you thinking about your mechanics trying to make the correct swing or are you picturing the shot you're about to make and being more target oriented?

Hands forward. Elbows together. Stay connected. Don't sway. Turn left shoulder. Left shoulder under chin. Don't pull the club down. Loose hands. Right side through the ball. Don't flip your hands. Move your head back but keep your head down. Transfer your weight. No tension. Don't forget to relax and stay connected.

Any one or more of those, depending on how bad my previous shot was.

Just picturing my shot and aiming at the target almost guarantees a hard slice.

I am not familiar with Florida, but I know Jim Mclean has a school out there and I highly recommend you try them. They are very good.

Jim McLean headquarters is walking distance from my job. He has a 2 day golf school for $795 and a 3 day golf school for $995. After spending over $1,000 on lessons already I'm reluctant to put down so much money after so many bad experiences.

However, there's a weird old man at my usual driving range who can't seem to NOT hit the ball straight who "will teach me to swing like a pro for $100 or I don't pay him anything." I can't imagine that making my swing any worse, right?

Do you have any difficulties with swinging golf clubs? Any back pain, disabilities, have had any accidents? How old are you?

No problems whatsoever. I'm 26, 5'10" 185lbs, very athletic build. Picture a shorter Tiger Woods. My inability to swing the golf club correctly is not due to physical limitations.

Are you resisting to change?

Not to my knowledge. I always try to do exactly what my instructor tells me. Not like what I was doing before was working, so how could a change make me any worse? Maybe his teaching style and my learning style are different? I don't know.

P.S: How's your putting anyway?

If my long game is OK I expect, at WORST, to lip-out everything within 6 feet or so. If I don't 1-putt, I expect my second to be nothing more than a guaranteed tap in. A 3-putt, if any, is an "OH MY GOD HOW DID THAT HAPPEN?" experience. If my long game is disastrous, I'm usually hitting my 6th or 7th shot at putting time, so I feel as though it doesn't really matter and end up being very nonchalant about aiming and a 2-putt with an occasional 3 becomes the norm.

Excellent putting? Hardly. But it's good enough to break 90 if the rest of my game were at that level. I sometimes cringe watching ~15-20 handicap players with whom I end up playing chip and putt.

------------

I HAVE hit excellent shots before. Effortless-feeling, high, straight balls that that hit the green and stop dead leaving nothing but island-sized flying divots in their wake. I just don't remember how long enough to get to the range and hit 5 buckets with the same swing to remember. I have (at least I think I have) all of the grip, alignment, posture, etc... fundamentals down but I haven't gotten a good enough education in swing mechanics to really know what I'm doing/trying to do in the swing. I think my instructors just hear me say I've been playing for 3 years and still suck, see that I'm at least making contact with the ball and just try to fix me up. Maybe I need someone who will treat me as though I've never swung a golf club before?

[Rynofskie]

In tha famous words of my friend...."I think what you need to do is hit the ball less curvy-like".

[Diggitydog]

Hands forward. Elbows together. Stay connected. Don't sway. Turn left shoulder. Left shoulder under chin. Don't pull the club down. Loose hands. Right side through the ball. Don't flip your hands. Move your head back but keep your head down. Transfer your weight. No tension. Don't forget to relax and stay connected.

OMG! I counted 16 things that you are thinking about while hitting a ball. So even if you aren't on all 16 of those during a shot and were thinking about 8 of them you should still be hitting balls on the range.

When I go for a lesson I might have 5 things to work on/think about but I'm not ready to get out on the course until I've got those items down to 2 at most 3 during a swing. I actually think that is too much to think about. Have you ever got so pissed off at the range that you just stood up and stopped thinking about anything but pure rage and hammered at the balls? I have done that when I'm hitting it like crap before and actually sometimes it works. Your instincts take over and you just start hitting. With your build you should be able to hammer the ball. I'm going to guess that your rhythm is terrible right now. I would work on that while at the same time sticking to one instructor. Oh, and quit thinking so much!!! You are definitely correct there is a huge gap in the effort you have put in and your score. I feel the same way, only I feel like I should be able to shoot close to par but don't seem to find my way there.

[Warik]

OMG! I counted 16 things that you are thinking about while hitting a ball.

That's only because I couldn't remember the other 8 right now. =)

Have you ever got so pissed off at the range that you just stood up and stopped thinking about anything but pure rage and hammered at the balls? I have done that when I'm hitting it like crap before and actually sometimes it works. Your instincts take over and you just start hitting. With your build you should be able to hammer the ball.

You mean: "OPEN CLUBFACE??? I'LL SHOW YOU AN OPEN CLUBFACE!" and then I proceed to take a swing thinking about nothing but connecting with a square clubface, which results a handsy takeaway, reverse-pivot backswing, leading to an all-upper-body downswing that should create the most disastrous shot ever EXCEPT my right hand+arm make a conscious effort to roll over and square the club face through impact? Yeah.

The result is my shot going dead straight because even though I'm mad and I do EVERYTHING wrong, I make a conscious effort to roll my right hand over and square the club face at impact; however, my last instructor said I shouldn't have any tension in my hands/arms. Yet the only thing that makes the ball go straight is a swing with more tension than the average human being is capable of having. What am I supposed to think after that?

You are definitely correct there is a huge gap in the effort you have put in and your score.

At least it's not from a lack of trying. I need to find an instructor with whom I click and who will start me off with the fundamentals instead of just trying to "fix" me. I guess it's time to start looking (again).

[Diggitydog]

You'll have to trust what the instructor is telling you. Even if you're producing lower quality shots when she tells you new information, you have to trust her.

....What you think all instructors are men?

[Warik]

You'll have to trust what the instructor is telling you. Even if you're producing lower quality shots when she tells you new information, you have to trust her.

I might pay more attention to a female instructor.