Meaning of the term "the player"

[fr0sty]

Here is Rule 16-1:

Quote:

16-1 . General

a . Touching Line of Putt

The line of putt must not be touched except:

(i) the player may remove loose impediments , provided he does not press anything down;

And 23-1 it says:

Quote:

23-1 . Relief

Except when both the loose impediment and the ball lie in or touch the same hazard , any loose impediment may be removed without penalty.

If the ball lies anywhere other than on the putting green and the removal of a loose impediment by the player causes the ball to move , Rule 18-2a applies.

So the wording is: " the player may remove" and "removal of a loose impediment by the player ". Does this imply that a player's caddie cannot take these actions?

I recently cemented in my head the distinctions meant by "a ball" and "the ball" in the rules and am curious if there is a similar fine distinction at play here.

[Fourputt]

The player is exactly what it sounds like.  It's the person whose ball or act is being referred to by the rule being discussed.  If more than one person is involved, then the other person is the player's partner, his opponent (in match play), or his fellow competitor (in stroke play).  I assume that you know that a caddie is not a player, even though he is subject to many of the same rules.

[fr0sty]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fourputt

The player is exactly what it sounds like.

That is true only when it isn't. Consider this decision:

Quote:

6-4/10

Acts Which Caddie May Perform

While the Rules do not expressly so state, the following are examples of acts which the caddie may perform for the player without the player's authority:

1. Search for the player's ball as provided in Rule 12-1 .
2. Place the player's clubs in a hazard – Exception 1 under Rule 13-4 .
3. Repair old hole plugs and ball marks – Rule 16-1a(Vi) and 16-1c .
4. Remove loose impediments on the line of putt or elsewhere – Rules 16-1a and 23-1 .
5. Mark the position of a ball, without lifting it – Rule 20-1 .
6. Clean the player's ball – Rule 21 .
7. Remove movable obstructions – Rule 24-1 .

So there are at least 7 instances where "the player" may in fact be "the player's caddie".

Maybe I'm being obtuse but all of that taken together seems to muddle the plain meaning of  "the player".

[6Aces]

Oops. Already answered.

[Dormie1360]

Quote:

Originally Posted by fr0sty

That is true only when it isn't. Consider this decision:

So there are at least 7 instances where "the player" may in fact be "the player's caddie".

Maybe I'm being obtuse but all of that taken together seems to muddle the plain meaning of  "the player".

No it's just what makes golf rules fun. There are things that one would not know, or be able to resolve an apparent conflict within the rules, without knowing the Decisions.  Rules, can also be contradictory at times, and one rule may override another.

20-1/0.5

Whether Player Himself Must Lift Ball

Q. Rule 20-1 states: "A ball to be lifted under the Rules may be lifted by the player, his partner or another person authorized by the player." On the other hand, other Rules, e.g., Rules 24-2b(i) and 25-1b(i) , state that the player shall lift the ball. Does Rule 20-1 override other Rules which imply that the player himself must lift the ball?

A.Y es.

20-3a/0.5

Whether Player Himself Must Place or Replace Ball

Q .Rule 20-3a provides that, in some instances, a person other than the player may place or replace the player's ball. On the other hand, other Rules, e.g., Rule 12-2 , state that the player must place or replace the ball. Does Rule 20-3a override other Rules that imply that the player himself must place or replace the ball?

A. Yes.

[Fourputt]

Quote:

Originally Posted by fr0sty

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fourputt

The player is exactly what it sounds like.

That is true only when it isn't. Consider this decision:

Quote:

6-4/10

Acts Which Caddie May Perform

While the Rules do not expressly so state, the following are examples of acts which the caddie may perform for the player without the player's authority:

1. Search for the player's ball as provided in Rule 12-1 .
2. Place the player's clubs in a hazard – Exception 1 under Rule 13-4 .
3. Repair old hole plugs and ball marks – Rule 16-1a(Vi) and 16-1c .
4. Remove loose impediments on the line of putt or elsewhere – Rules 16-1a and 23-1 .
5. Mark the position of a ball, without lifting it – Rule 20-1 .
6. Clean the player's ball – Rule 21 .
7. Remove movable obstructions – Rule 24-1 .

So there are at least 7 instances where "the player" may in fact be "the player's caddie".

Maybe I'm being obtuse but all of that taken together seems to muddle the plain meaning of  "the player".

That still  doesn't make him the Player.  He is the caddie and his job is fairly well defined in the rules.  The caddie is never the player.  The player is the only one who can make a stroke.  He is the only one upon whom a penalty can fall, no matter if the error was committed by him or by his caddie.  The reason for that list is not to create instances where the caddie can become the player, but to define some acts which the caddie can perform for the player.

[Dormie1360]

Unlike the term "Caddie", if you look in the definitions section of the rule book you will not find a definition for "Player".  When you see the word "player" ,  it means the person playing  "The Game" which is described in Rule 1-1.

Although a particular rule may seem implicit, if something can be done by someone else, as well as the player, (as Rick pointed out), the rules or decisions will tell you.  There are some things only the player can do.   Make a stroke, drop a ball, sign (attest)  his score card, deem his ball unplayable,  along with some things that have to be announced.  i.e.  concessions,   provisionals.    I'm sure there are more.

What was the movie....."there can be only one".

.

[turtleback]

Unlike the term "Caddie", if you look in the definitions section of the rule book you will not find a definition for "Player".  When you see the word "player" ,  it means the person playing  "The Game" which is described in Rule 1-1.

Although a particular rule may seem implicit, if something can be done by someone else, as well as the player, (as Rick pointed out), the rules or decisions will tell you.  There are some things only the player can do.   Make a stroke, drop a ball, sign (attest)  his score card, deem his ball unplayable,  along with some things that have to be announced.  i.e.  concessions,   provisionals.    I'm sure there are more.

What was the movie....."there can be only one".

.

Highlander.

[Dormie1360]

Highlander.

That's it!  Great movie.