3 Golf Swing Tips That Are Destroying Golfer's Swings!

Re: 3 Golf Swing Tips That Are Destroying Golfer's Swings!

Well saying the word "relax" without any context is pretty useless. But it is not always golf advice as much as it is a state of mind. I could say "relax your grip a bit", that may be good advice. I could say "relax" as in calm down which is good advice. I don't remember anybody telling me to stay loose.

As for "take the club inside" that advice in itself is probably taken the wrong way. It should be accompanied with a lot of detail.

Re: 3 Golf Swing Tips That Are Destroying Golfer's Swings!

I agree somewhat, but I think you'll have to read more into what the points mean.

1: You're not supposed to bring a chair on the course, but hitting it as hard and as fast as you can rarely produce good results. The thing is to swing smooth and don't rush it.

2: Being too lose won't help, but we're not talking about relaxing all your muscles. Of course you have to stretch your arms and use your body, but holding the club too hard or trying to throw the club down doesn't work for me.

3: The idea, as far as I've understood, is that you should take the club away somewhat on the plane of the shaft when you take your stance. Of course, you can take the club away any way you want to, but if you take it away outside the line, the chances of you coming down the same plane are higher than if you took it away inside. Using Furyk as an example is a bit cheap, he's got a very weird swing, most players do not swing like he does. Just because he's got a weird swing doesn't mean everyone else should swing like that. You can take the club away on the outside and come down on the inside, you can also take it away on the inside and come out on the outside, but I still think it's useful to take the club away somewhat on the plane of where you want to come down.

Re: 3 Golf Swing Tips That Are Destroying Golfer's Swings!

I disagree.

What would your advise be in contrast? Grip tightly? Swing with a lot of tension? In my swing, those things are speed killers. I swing my best when I am loose and relaxed.

I can't tell you how many people I've watched swing with the death grip and violent lurch, giving them zero chance of success.

Re: 3 Golf Swing Tips That Are Destroying Golfer's Swings!

Points 1 & 2 would take a book to do justice. Consider that it takes hand STRENGTH to hold the club lightly, and it takes directional strength to relax the body during the swing, so which came first, the strength or directional education? There are many different muscular tensions which can be employed throughout the body to assist in manufacturing clubhead velocity. The more those are understood and strengthened, the subtler, or looser they can be employed. If educated and strengthened, loose is much better than tight, but loose just for loose sake is counterproductive.

In point 3, the club isn't "taken" one direction of the other unless the swing is powered by the extremities of the hands. If the swing is more efficiently powered by rotation of the core, the club will then follow the path dictated by the rotation of the torso and angle of the spine/thighs.

Re: 3 Golf Swing Tips That Are Destroying Golfer's Swings!

I think you just read Joe Dante's book, "Four Magic moves to better Golf" where he states just that.

Did anyone ever say to take the club back inside. I don't think so.

Look at any good pro golfer with muscle tone and you will the lead forearm is much larger and stronger than the back one. Clearly, brute strength is applied somewhere in the swing with the lead hand way beyond holding Sam Snead's little bird. Dante believed a good player uses the hand to hold the lag in the downswing.

While you may be able to play with a tight grip, I think it is a problem if the tension creeps into the core muscles

Re: 3 Golf Swing Tips That Are Destroying Golfer's Swings!

I hope this is a joke...I completely disagree.
In a previous post in another thread http://thesandtrap.com/forum/showthread.php?t=8987
So this is 180* from what you had posted. This forum is here to help other golfers, not hinder thier progression. Remember, bad advice is worse than no advice.

And I would warn any double digit handicappers from following his advice. Tension locks up your wrists preventing them from turning over at impact. It's proven. You obviously don't want your wrists and club "loose" at the top because that would promote inconsistant ballstriking, but staying "loose" and relaxed with your repeatable swing is what you're looking for.

You'd be hard pressed to find any + handicap player, PGA Pro, top 100 teacher, or any golf pro worth his pay that would agree that you should have a death grip and swing tight. They'll all say that the swing is a fluid mechanic with tempo. You don't see PGA Pro's with white knuckles and gritting teeth before they hit that approach shout or putt on the 18th while in the hunt. You see them breathing deeply and taking easy practice swings to "stay loose". The whole purpose of the waggle is to remove tension before the swing.
As far as bringing the club inside, I think it's more of a thought process during the takeaway than anything for helping those that have an outside-in swing. By telling them to take the club inside it makes them turn thier hips. You just can't tell a high handicapper to turn thier hips, they wont understand what it does, but bringing the club back inside is something they can understand and see. That said, You HAVE to bring the club inside on the backswing. No way around it. The better the player, the sooner the club comes back and in, it's a matter of mechanics when the hips turn. Better players turn thier hips better than high handicappers. I'll guarantee you can't not bring the club inside during your hip turn and hit it consistantly. I've watched my instructor teach new golfers with a crazy and unorthadox aid...the computer chair. He'll have the student sit it it and lock it in place and have the student hit the ball. Then he unlocks it so it swivels and tells the student to use his legs to turn the chair 45* back on the backswing and thru to 45* towards the target. Guess which way hits the ball further and more consistant. This stunt educates the student on the importance of using your legs and hip turns to hit the ball correctly with distance and accuracy. It demonstrates the arm swing vs the body swing.

Re: 3 Golf Swing Tips That Are Destroying Golfer's Swings!

I just went and hit a few balls as tense as possible and taking the club outside, and the craziest thing happened: I whiffed.

I knew your advice couldn't be wrong so I thought it must have been something I was doing. I went back and re-read your post, but I found I was following it closely so i went back out and tried it again. I made contact, but this time it was a feeble slice that went about 80 yards.

Hmm...

"Maybe I've been swinging correctly all along," I thought to myself. "Maybe this guy is just an idiot."

I loosened up and took the club back inside, and you'll never guess the result! It was a 290 yarder with a 2 yard draw. I'll take it.

Re: 3 Golf Swing Tips That Are Destroying Golfer's Swings!

Points 1 and 2 couldn't be more wrong. Show me a Pro that looks tensed up and rigid in their swing.......

Re: 3 Golf Swing Tips That Are Destroying Golfer's Swings!

Relax is a good tip when it pertains to the tension in the arms and the hands. A stiffer set up will hinder the rotation in the backswing and the rotation in the downswing/followthrough.

Referring to being loose, it is a similar philosophy with regard to the arms. As I try to follow in the 5 Lessons, I keep my right knee positioned so I do not sway to the side on the backswing. I don't think being loose referred entirely to the base of the stances (legs/feet). The excessive rotation by lifting the left foot and straightening the right leg will hinder the ability to achieve contact consistently.

The two biggest "Tips" that are a hindrance are "Keep your head down" and "Keep your left arm straight". Those two tips lead to the unnecessary tension in the swing.

Re: 3 Golf Swing Tips That Are Destroying Golfer's Swings!

That's very interesting. Dante's book did not help me at all. For me it was "The Golf Swing and Its Master Key Explained" by Noel Thomas. I guess that just proves the old saying, "What works for one, may not work for another."

There is something else that should be kept in mind about golf instruction or swing tips. A lot of things can be overdone. As Harvey Penick said, "If I tell you to take an aspirin, don't take the whole bottle."

Re: 3 Golf Swing Tips That Are Destroying Golfer's Swings!

Thanks Rubbery, your post had me laughing.

The OP really is rubbish spawned by the era of "power addicted golf". Just read any of the classic golf instructional books and you will learn that relaxed yet athletic poise is incredibly important. Restrict the hip turn? Lots of amateurs don't turn enough. Just look at Bobby Jones. His hip turn was huge. A good number of pros have large hip turn today, and they generate plenty of power.

Peter Kostis drives me nuts with some of the same stuff. I have some of his golf books, and even he admits that the hips must turn, that you need some lateral transfer, some weight shift, etc. Then he goes on to the Konaka Minolta SwingVision BizHub Camera (man I hate that line already) and makes everyone think you need to swing with stiff hips, one-plane, flat wrists, etc. The golf industry needs to stop this "power mechanics analysis mentality" and get back to golf "the ultimate game of feel and control". The average golfer needs to learn smoothness and tempo, not "grip it and rip it".

In regards to the hips, the X-Factor stuff is hogwash. Even the guy who came up with it later came out and said he was wrong and misleading. Now we have a generation of golfers who are physically trying to restrict the body's motion throughout the swing. In reality, the torque is created in the swing by a full turn, and the correct progression of motion on the downswing. Learn to manage the hip turn and you can release even more power from the body. Just look up Shawn Clement on Youtube if you want more proof.

We need to stop teaching people to STRIKE the ball and start teaching them how to SWING the golf club. Golf is not a game restricted to the athletically perfect. Take it from Ben Hogan himself, I'll paraphrase, "a fundamentally correct golf swing is not a violent exertion, it is a physical pleasure" or his most famous line, again paraphrased, "any person of average coordination, with dedicated practice, is fully capable of breaking 80." And by the way, look at Hogan's hips. Those suckers rotated too.

For me, golf is very much like learning to play the piano. I started learning piano at age 5, and I have played seriously ever since, taking classical and jazz instruction. You don't start a pianist with Debussy or Rachmaninoff. You learn the basics, in painstaking slow motion, you learn touch, you learn tempo, then you work up to greater and greater pieces of complexity. Approaching golf in the same way, we learn how to putt, we learn how to chip, we learn how to make short pitches, we learn how to hit short irons, long irons, then woods and drivers. All along we are focusing on tempo and feel, memorizing what works and what doesn't. In the end, it takes the greatest ingredients to success in any endeavor...

patience, dedication, and time.

I'll close by quoting Ben Hogan one last time:

"The secret is in the dirt"

Re: 3 Golf Swing Tips That Are Destroying Golfer's Swings!

You sir are correct. Those are exactly the things I expected to read when I first openned this post.

Re: 3 Golf Swing Tips That Are Destroying Golfer's Swings!

Hogan said the same thing in his SI articles. I think relaxed athletic position is the best description. Which is opposite to relaxed couch potato position. :)

Re: 3 Golf Swing Tips That Are Destroying Golfer's Swings!

AAAAND the #1 swing tip that destroys a golfer's swing:
-Using Jim Furyk as an example of someone that goes against the norm but still gets it to work.

Honestly - the first two tips you mentioned are not as black and white as you put it. Relaxed muscles mean there's no tension (esp. in the arms). And we all know what tense muscles do to a golf swing. It seems you're a very good golfer, but I would have to disagree with you on your examples. Let's be a bit more specific