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Posted
Just now, BC-to-MI said:

To work on that at the range, could that be something as simple as making swings with a towel/glove/headcover under my left arm to maintain the feeling of keeping it closer to my chest through the downswing?

No. That's generally a bad way to go about that one.

Put a stick in the ground outside the target line and behind the ball, angled over your right shoulder. Like the Hogan pane of glass. Then keep your left arm under that.

I think someone has a picture somewhere.

Erik J. Barzeski —  I knock a ball. It goes in a gopher hole. 🏌🏼‍♂️
Director of Instruction Golf Evolution • Owner, The Sand Trap .com • AuthorLowest Score Wins
Golf Digest "Best Young Teachers in America" 2016-17 & "Best in State" 2017-20 • WNY Section PGA Teacher of the Year 2019 :edel: :true_linkswear:

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Posted
8 minutes ago, iacas said:

No. That's generally a bad way to go about that one.

Put a stick in the ground outside the target line and behind the ball, angled over your right shoulder. Like the Hogan pane of glass. Then keep your left arm under that.

I think someone has a picture somewhere.

Glad I asked. So, like this?

Pane of Glass Drill.png

Pane of Glass Drill FO.png

Justin

Driver: :callaway: Rogue Draw 11* Evenflow Blue 65 X

Fairway Wood: :callaway: Epic Flash 5 Wood 18* Tensei Blue AV 75 X
Irons: :titleist: AP3 4-PW Project X 6.5   |   Wedges: :callaway: MD4 50*/56*/60*
Putter: :odyssey: O-Works Tank #1
                                                                       

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Posted

Yep. A bit closer to the ball target line, and a bit lower, too. But yeah, like that.

Erik J. Barzeski —  I knock a ball. It goes in a gopher hole. 🏌🏼‍♂️
Director of Instruction Golf Evolution • Owner, The Sand Trap .com • AuthorLowest Score Wins
Golf Digest "Best Young Teachers in America" 2016-17 & "Best in State" 2017-20 • WNY Section PGA Teacher of the Year 2019 :edel: :true_linkswear:

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Posted
3 minutes ago, iacas said:

Yep. A bit closer to the ball target line, and a bit lower, too. But yeah, like that.

Awesome. Thanks for the input. I will give it a run next time I can get out to the range.

Justin

Driver: :callaway: Rogue Draw 11* Evenflow Blue 65 X

Fairway Wood: :callaway: Epic Flash 5 Wood 18* Tensei Blue AV 75 X
Irons: :titleist: AP3 4-PW Project X 6.5   |   Wedges: :callaway: MD4 50*/56*/60*
Putter: :odyssey: O-Works Tank #1
                                                                       

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Posted

Just need to get the driver on track and I think I could really be getting somewhere. I've gotten past the couple week period there where it felt I couldn't hit a good iron shot to save my life, and now I have hit them extremely well the last couple times out. Standing closer to the ball really seems to have helped eliminate the feeling that I need to throw my hands out after the ball, making it much easier to keep my arms closer to my body in the downswing and eliminate most of the horrible sliced irons (though I'm still good for my one obligatory hosel rocket every nine holes). Also came across this thread and fixed my grip, which was the exact one that creates the wear pattern shown on the glove in the comments.

Been hitting a slight push at times with the grip on my wedges and short irons, but the considerably straighter and more consistent ball flight is well worth the trade off. Hoping to get to the range tomorrow to work on the drill suggested above.

Justin

Driver: :callaway: Rogue Draw 11* Evenflow Blue 65 X

Fairway Wood: :callaway: Epic Flash 5 Wood 18* Tensei Blue AV 75 X
Irons: :titleist: AP3 4-PW Project X 6.5   |   Wedges: :callaway: MD4 50*/56*/60*
Putter: :odyssey: O-Works Tank #1
                                                                       

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Posted

Got out to the range today to give the drill suggested earlier a try. @iacas , can you confirm if I am doing this properly?

I made a bunch of swings with the alignment stick there at about 70-80% speed to get the feeling down without being concerned about the outcome of the swing. At the end of the range session, I made some normal swings and had some great results with my irons. I was hitting high baby draws right on target and had basically none of the thin/fat strikes I often struggle with.

With the driver, however, I still struggled, even at a much lower speed, to get the hang of the swing feel. The regular swings I took at the end generally resulted in playable shots, they were just incredibly inconsistent ball flight (pulls, fades, high, low). Work in progress.

 

Justin

Driver: :callaway: Rogue Draw 11* Evenflow Blue 65 X

Fairway Wood: :callaway: Epic Flash 5 Wood 18* Tensei Blue AV 75 X
Irons: :titleist: AP3 4-PW Project X 6.5   |   Wedges: :callaway: MD4 50*/56*/60*
Putter: :odyssey: O-Works Tank #1
                                                                       

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  • Administrator
Posted
42 minutes ago, BC-to-MI said:

Got out to the range today to give the drill suggested earlier a try. @iacas , can you confirm if I am doing this properly?

No…?

The shaft has to go over your shoulder, to keep the left arm in, not right outside the ball or else you'll just want to toe it like you did in the one video.

01.jpg02.jpg

 

 

Erik J. Barzeski —  I knock a ball. It goes in a gopher hole. 🏌🏼‍♂️
Director of Instruction Golf Evolution • Owner, The Sand Trap .com • AuthorLowest Score Wins
Golf Digest "Best Young Teachers in America" 2016-17 & "Best in State" 2017-20 • WNY Section PGA Teacher of the Year 2019 :edel: :true_linkswear:

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Posted
10 hours ago, iacas said:

The shaft has to go over your shoulder, to keep the left arm in, not right outside the ball or else you'll just want to toe it like you did in the one video.

Ok, I had it about 4 inches behind the ball, so I will move it back to be in line with my shoulder. Am I also going to want to find a way to make the alignment stick longer, as well?

Justin

Driver: :callaway: Rogue Draw 11* Evenflow Blue 65 X

Fairway Wood: :callaway: Epic Flash 5 Wood 18* Tensei Blue AV 75 X
Irons: :titleist: AP3 4-PW Project X 6.5   |   Wedges: :callaway: MD4 50*/56*/60*
Putter: :odyssey: O-Works Tank #1
                                                                       

My Swing

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  • Administrator
Posted
1 hour ago, BC-to-MI said:

Ok, I had it about 4 inches behind the ball, so I will move it back to be in line with my shoulder. Am I also going to want to find a way to make the alignment stick longer, as well?

Yes, that's the whole point - so that it changes the way your left arm works.

Erik J. Barzeski —  I knock a ball. It goes in a gopher hole. 🏌🏼‍♂️
Director of Instruction Golf Evolution • Owner, The Sand Trap .com • AuthorLowest Score Wins
Golf Digest "Best Young Teachers in America" 2016-17 & "Best in State" 2017-20 • WNY Section PGA Teacher of the Year 2019 :edel: :true_linkswear:

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Posted
4 minutes ago, iacas said:

Yes, that's the whole point - so that it changes the way your left arm works.

Sounds good. I'll go scrounge up some tape and an old shaft or something like that.

Justin

Driver: :callaway: Rogue Draw 11* Evenflow Blue 65 X

Fairway Wood: :callaway: Epic Flash 5 Wood 18* Tensei Blue AV 75 X
Irons: :titleist: AP3 4-PW Project X 6.5   |   Wedges: :callaway: MD4 50*/56*/60*
Putter: :odyssey: O-Works Tank #1
                                                                       

My Swing

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Posted

Played a couple rounds this weekend and really tried to keep the swing thought of the left arm staying in, especially with the driver. For the most part, it went really well. Driver was really good at times, pretty good most of the time, and I believe I only hit one driver OB in 27 holes. Ended up shooting a 41 (37.1/142) and an 86 (73.2/143) despite terrible short game and putting relative to how I usually play, so it's clear how much the long game impacts my scores.

Justin

Driver: :callaway: Rogue Draw 11* Evenflow Blue 65 X

Fairway Wood: :callaway: Epic Flash 5 Wood 18* Tensei Blue AV 75 X
Irons: :titleist: AP3 4-PW Project X 6.5   |   Wedges: :callaway: MD4 50*/56*/60*
Putter: :odyssey: O-Works Tank #1
                                                                       

My Swing

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Posted

Hopefully I did a better job of setting this drill up the second time around. Unfortunately, I didn't realize that my buddy was standing a bit off to the side when he took the videos until too late, so it isn't the best angle for what I'm trying to see here.

 

 

Justin

Driver: :callaway: Rogue Draw 11* Evenflow Blue 65 X

Fairway Wood: :callaway: Epic Flash 5 Wood 18* Tensei Blue AV 75 X
Irons: :titleist: AP3 4-PW Project X 6.5   |   Wedges: :callaway: MD4 50*/56*/60*
Putter: :odyssey: O-Works Tank #1
                                                                       

My Swing

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  • Administrator
Posted
5 hours ago, BC-to-MI said:

Hopefully I did a better job of setting this drill up the second time around. Unfortunately, I didn't realize that my buddy was standing a bit off to the side when he took the videos until too late, so it isn't the best angle for what I'm trying to see here.

It could still be a lot closer to your shoulder. Like, six to ten inches lower?

At any rate… those look like some thick impacts. Where's the FO video? At least the left arm is in more throughout the downswing.

Erik J. Barzeski —  I knock a ball. It goes in a gopher hole. 🏌🏼‍♂️
Director of Instruction Golf Evolution • Owner, The Sand Trap .com • AuthorLowest Score Wins
Golf Digest "Best Young Teachers in America" 2016-17 & "Best in State" 2017-20 • WNY Section PGA Teacher of the Year 2019 :edel: :true_linkswear:

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Posted
On 8/29/2019 at 9:29 PM, iacas said:

It could still be a lot closer to your shoulder. Like, six to ten inches lower?

At any rate… those look like some thick impacts. Where's the FO video? At least the left arm is in more throughout the downswing.

I'll make sure to get both videos next time. I just ran out over lunch last week, so I only grabbed a few videos, but yes, I was hitting a decent amount of balls fat here.

Justin

Driver: :callaway: Rogue Draw 11* Evenflow Blue 65 X

Fairway Wood: :callaway: Epic Flash 5 Wood 18* Tensei Blue AV 75 X
Irons: :titleist: AP3 4-PW Project X 6.5   |   Wedges: :callaway: MD4 50*/56*/60*
Putter: :odyssey: O-Works Tank #1
                                                                       

My Swing

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  • 3 weeks later...
Posted

Grad school starting up again means I haven't been able to get out much in the last few weeks, and when I have, I spend the first few holes trying to get my feel back. Fortunately, my irons have felt much better the last couple times out after a stretch of just miserable golf for a couple weeks. Unfortunately, that has come at the same time as my driver completely abandoning me. Haven't had a ton of issue keeping it in play, but my home course loves to line the fairways with trees, and I have been spending most of my holes punching out. Hopefully I can correct that down the stretch of golf season here.

 

Justin

Driver: :callaway: Rogue Draw 11* Evenflow Blue 65 X

Fairway Wood: :callaway: Epic Flash 5 Wood 18* Tensei Blue AV 75 X
Irons: :titleist: AP3 4-PW Project X 6.5   |   Wedges: :callaway: MD4 50*/56*/60*
Putter: :odyssey: O-Works Tank #1
                                                                       

My Swing

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  • 4 months later...
Posted

Posted this in the goal thread, but thought I would copy it here, as well, so that I can easily reference it and be held accountable.

Goals:

  1. Keep a single-digit handicap. I got down to a 9.1 last year (8.9 now with the handicap system change) from an 18.4 at the beginning of the year, but a stretch during the summer where I played or went to the range pretty much daily is bringing that down. I'm probably between a 9-12 or somewhere in there, so I want to improve to the point where I can stay in the single digits.
  2. Break 80 over 18 holes and break par on 9 holes. I've shot an 81 for a full round and even par on 9 holes, but never broken either benchmark.
  3. Win at least one half of our men's league. We break the league into two seasons and then the winners face off, so I want to win one of the seasons to have a chance to play for the overall title.
  4. Fix my attitude on the course. I am a super perfectionist and I get way too upset over bad shots, which often leads to another bad shot. I also know it can be frustrating to play with people who are overly negative, so I want to improve my on-course demeanor.

How:

  1. Get lessons for the first time. I have never taken lessons, so I plan on starting that as the Michigan golf season gets closer. I hope to get one every month or two, depending on finances/time.
  2. Practice better. I have a tendency to just bang balls at the range, so I need to focus my time better and remember to take video. The lessons will hopefully give some guidance on what to practice, as should being more diligent in posting video to my swing thread here.
  3. Eliminate the blow up holes. Hopefully the lessons will help with this, too, as a lot of my big numbers come from driving the ball into terrible positions/OB, but I also have a tendency to play the hero shot or not focus enough when I am taking my medicine, which leads to more issues.
  4. Eliminate the three putts. I am pretty good at reading the break of greens, but I am dreadful at speed control. I leave a huge number of putts short, and often put myself in situations where I leave myself a 5-10 footer after my first putt.
  5. Track my stats. I plan on tracking my FIR, GIR, and stuff like that so that I have a better idea of where I need to improve. I keep track during the round, but never end up doing anything with the data afterward.
  6. Read Lowest Score Wins. I got the book for Christmas, so I need to carve out some time to dig in.

Justin

Driver: :callaway: Rogue Draw 11* Evenflow Blue 65 X

Fairway Wood: :callaway: Epic Flash 5 Wood 18* Tensei Blue AV 75 X
Irons: :titleist: AP3 4-PW Project X 6.5   |   Wedges: :callaway: MD4 50*/56*/60*
Putter: :odyssey: O-Works Tank #1
                                                                       

My Swing

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  • 3 months later...
Posted (edited)

Finally got back out to the range a couple times this week for the first time since last fall. Ball striking has been horrible in the couple Par 3 course rounds I have played, but I didn't expect much coming out such a long layoff. Really struggling with controlling the club face right now -- lots of really bad pushes with the occasional overcorrection into a dead pull. Hopefully driving ranges starting to open up again in Michigan will help with getting my consistency back. (Will try to get face on video as well next time, but a crowded range and trying to be mindful of social distancing didn't allow that here)

 

Edited by BC-to-MI

Justin

Driver: :callaway: Rogue Draw 11* Evenflow Blue 65 X

Fairway Wood: :callaway: Epic Flash 5 Wood 18* Tensei Blue AV 75 X
Irons: :titleist: AP3 4-PW Project X 6.5   |   Wedges: :callaway: MD4 50*/56*/60*
Putter: :odyssey: O-Works Tank #1
                                                                       

My Swing

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  • Posts

    • Nah, man. People have been testing clubs like this for decades at this point. Even 35 years. @M2R, are you AskGolfNut? If you're not, you seem to have fully bought into the cult or something. So many links to so many videos… Here's an issue, too: - A drop of 0.06 is a drop with a 90 MPH 7I having a ball speed of 117 and dropping it to 111.6, which is going to be nearly 15 yards, which is far more than what a "3% distance loss" indicates (and is even more than a 4.6% distance loss). - You're okay using a percentage with small numbers and saying "they're close" and "1.3 to 1.24 is only 4.6%," but then you excuse the massive 53% difference that going from 3% to 4.6% represents. That's a hell of an error! - That guy in the Elite video is swinging his 7I at 70 MPH. C'mon. My 5' tall daughter swings hers faster than that.
    • Yea but that is sort of my quandary, I sometimes see posts where people causally say this club is more forgiving, a little more forgiving, less forgiving, ad nauseum. But what the heck are they really quantifying? The proclamation of something as fact is not authoritative, even less so as I don't know what the basis for that statement is. For my entire golfing experience, I thought of forgiveness as how much distance front to back is lost hitting the face in non-optimal locations. Anything right or left is on me and delivery issues. But I also have to clarify that my experience is only with irons, I never got to the point of having any confidence or consistency with anything longer. I feel that is rather the point, as much as possible, to quantify the losses by trying to eliminate all the variables except the one you want to investigate. Or, I feel like we agree. Compared to the variables introduced by a golfer's delivery and the variables introduced by lie conditions, the losses from missing the optimal strike location might be so small as to almost be noise over a larger area than a pea.  In which case it seems that your objection is that the 0-3% area is being depicted as too large. Which I will address below. For statements that is absurd and true 100% sweet spot is tiny for all clubs. You will need to provide some objective data to back that up and also define what true 100% sweet spot is. If you mean the area where there are 0 losses, then yes. While true, I do not feel like a not practical or useful definition for what I would like to know. For strikes on irons away from the optimal location "in measurable and quantifiable results how many yards, or feet, does that translate into?"   In my opinion it ok to be dubious but I feel like we need people attempting this sort of data driven investigation. Even if they are wrong in some things at least they are moving the discussion forward. And he has been changing the maps and the way data is interpreted along the way. So, he admits to some of the ideas he started with as being wrong. It is not like we all have not been in that situation 😄 And in any case to proceed forward I feel will require supporting or refuting data. To which as I stated above, I do not have any experience in drivers so I cannot comment on that. But I would like to comment on irons as far as these heat maps. In a video by Elite Performance Golf Studios - The TRUTH About Forgiveness! Game Improvement vs Blade vs Players Distance SLOW SWING SPEED! and going back to ~12:50 will show the reference data for the Pro 241. I can use that to check AskGolfNut's heat map for the Pro 241: a 16mm heel, 5mm low produced a loss of efficiency from 1.3 down to 1.24 or ~4.6%. Looking at AskGolfNut's heatmap it predicts a loss of 3%. Is that good or bad? I do not know but given the possible variations I am going to say it is ok. That location is very close to where the head map goes to 4%, these are very small numbers, and rounding could be playing some part. But for sure I am going to say it is not absurd. Looking at one data point is absurd, but I am not going to spend time on more because IME people who are interested will do their own research and those not interested cannot be persuaded by any amount of data. However, the overall conclusion that I got from that video was that between the three clubs there is a difference in distance forgiveness, but it is not very much. Without some robot testing or something similar the human element in the testing makes it difficult to say is it 1 yard, or 2, or 3?  
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