My Swing (Nick Wahl)

[Nick_wahl_]

I've been Playing Golf for: 20 years
My current handicap index or average score is: +3
My typical ball flight is: Slight draw
The shot I hate or the "miss" I'm trying to reduce/eliminate is: none

Hello everyone,

This is my first post ever on Sand Trap. I figured I’d give it a try to get a little advice on a swing flaw.
My club doesn’t shallow out early enough in the downswing to allow free upper body rotation through the swing. Notice the slight jammed look in the left shoulder right after transition. For the most part it looks like I recover from it ok but every once in a while it feels like I can’t stay in the shot long enough because of this. Especially with long irons. Anyone know what’s causing this? 
 

..

 

[iacas]

52 minutes ago, Nick_wahl_ said:

The shot I hate or the "miss" I'm trying to reduce/eliminate is: none

Then… what are you after, here?

52 minutes ago, Nick_wahl_ said:

My club doesn’t shallow out early enough in the downswing to allow free upper body rotation through the swing. Notice the slight jammed look in the left shoulder right after transition.

I'm not sure I'd start there.

Since you didn't tell us what shot you're trying to avoid or whatever, I'd look at two things right now. First, your lack of dynamic motion. It's very still, and what motion you do have is down and up a little. Actually, that kinda just makes it one thing:

I don't see the left shoulder bit. If anything, I was thinking you might want to go less steep, because the club gets underneath a good bit, and only by pulling the handle a bit lower and left than you'd expect from that A6 do you take curve off the ball, I think. That too can decrease the "dynamic" nature of the swing.

---

But again, since you didn't give us much… I could see going different directions entirely, depending on what kinds of shots are holding you back, etc.

[Nick_wahl_]

3 minutes ago, iacas said:

Then… what are you after, here?

I'm not sure I'd start there.

Since you didn't tell us what shot you're trying to avoid or whatever, I'd look at two things right now. First, your lack of dynamic motion. It's very still, and what motion you do have is down and up a little. Actually, that kinda just makes it one thing:

I don't see the left shoulder bit. If anything, I was thinking you might want to go less steep, because the club gets underneath a good bit, and only by pulling the handle a bit lower and left than you'd expect from that A6 do you take curve off the ball, I think. That too can decrease the "dynamic" nature of the swing.

---

But again, since you didn't give us much… I could see going different directions entirely, depending on what kinds of shots are holding you back, etc.

Hey, thanks for the reply. I just put none because I explained what I was having trouble with in the post. The struggle is that sometimes it feels like I can’t stay in the shot with mid - long irons and I can’t get down and into the ball. It the bottom of the face a lot.  

[iacas]

1 minute ago, Nick_wahl_ said:

Hey, thanks for the reply. I just put none because I explained what I was having trouble with in the post. The struggle is that sometimes it feels like I can’t stay in the shot with mid - long irons and I can’t get down and into the ball. It the bottom of the face a lot.  

So you're a patient that has pre-diagnosed himself? That usually doesn't work out very well. 🙂

I'll only add this for now: if you come in too shallow you'll often hit the ball a little thin. Pretty common thing, particularly for a better player who has figure out how not to fat it (which you've done by pulling the handle forward a bit too much).

[Nick_wahl_]

8 minutes ago, iacas said:

First, your lack of dynamic motion. It's very still, and what motion you do have is down and up a little. Actually, that kinda just makes it one thing:

I don't see the left shoulder bit. If anything, I was thinking you might want to go less steep, because the club gets underneath a good bit, and only by pulling the handle a bit lower and left than you'd expect from that A6 do you take curve off the ball, I think. That too can decrease the "dynamic" nature of the swing.

When you say it’s very “still” and has a lack of dynamic motion how can I improve this and make it more dynamic? Do I need to rotate more? 

[iacas]

14 minutes ago, Nick_wahl_ said:

When you say it’s very “still” and has a lack of dynamic motion how can I improve this and make it more dynamic? Do I need to rotate more? 

It's more about how your swing is almost "only" rotational.

But again, I'd probably address the shallow/steep stuff first.

Tough to say, really. As a +3, you're talking about smaller and smaller errors, and we've got a whole two swings (into a net, off a mat) to work with here. So I'm not dying on any hill here, so to speak. But I'd look, at first, in the two areas I've mentioned:

1. Dynamic movement (a little lower body, a little shift back and a re-center or "fall" left at A3)
2. Excessive shallowing and a little forcing of the handle forward.

[Nick_wahl_]

11 minutes ago, iacas said:

It's more about how your swing is almost "only" rotational.

But again, I'd probably address the shallow/steep stuff first.

Tough to say, really. As a +3, you're talking about smaller and smaller errors, and we've got a whole two swings (into a net, off a mat) to work with here. So I'm not dying on any hill here, so to speak. But I'd look, at first, in the two areas I've mentioned:

1. Dynamic movement (a little lower body, a little shift back and a re-center or "fall" left at A3)
2. Excessive shallowing and a little forcing of the handle forward.

Great! Thank you! 
I’m not hitting off a mat here but I get it. Corona virus has me turning my backyard into a practice facility lol. I’ll try the shift / fall into the left side and report back with a video. 🤙🏻 
 

thanks again for the time! 

[downbylaw11]

to me it just looks like you get a little wristy at the top, and you start down with the hands and arms before your lower body fires. overall i really like your swing and i can see why youre a +3 handicap, or +3 average score, either way, thats pretty good. i prescribe to you about 10,000 freezers, stopping at the top, and really feel your first move is getting into the ground while trying to keep your arms up.  youll get shallow as f*** and you can just rotate through the shot. 

[iacas]

7 hours ago, downbylaw11 said:

to me it just looks like you get a little wristy at the top, and you start down with the hands and arms before your lower body fires. overall i really like your swing and i can see why youre a +3 handicap, or +3 average score, either way, thats pretty good. i prescribe to you about 10,000 freezers, stopping at the top, and really feel your first move is getting into the ground while trying to keep your arms up.  youll get shallow as f*** and you can just rotate through the shot. 

I think you're over-estimating how much earlier the lower body starts forward of the upper body.

[downbylaw11]

On 4/7/2020 at 5:04 AM, iacas said:

I think you're over-estimating how much earlier the lower body starts forward of the upper body.

in op's case i don't think i am

[iacas]

2 hours ago, downbylaw11 said:

in op's case i don't think i am

No, I think you are. IIRC the lower body starts forward about 10 ms before the upper body.

The blink of an eye is 300 to 400 ms.

The upper and lower body effectively start down together.

[downbylaw11]

hey i get that.  but even when you start the downswing only with your lower body, your arms move on their own, but they fall into a more shallow position if you leave you leave your arms at the top.  so yes, the arms move basically at the same time as the lower body, but initiating the downswing with the lower body allows the club to shallow better and more efficiently than it would if you start both down at the same time.   heck, many pros who get wicked shallow and have tremendous lag are already firing the lower body for the downswing before the club has even reached the top.  I could show you some videos or make a video of my own demonstrating this, but this isnt my thread.   I think you may be overcomplicating what seems like an already very effective golf swing by using terms like dynamic movement when maybe op could be greatly helped by a slightly more efficient sequence.  I mean, thats just what I think

[iacas]

I fail to see how suggesting he get a bit more dynamic is overcomplicating things.

Nick doesn’t need the club to shallow more.

[Vinsk]

26 minutes ago, downbylaw11 said:

many pros who get wicked shallow and have tremendous lag are already firing the lower body for the downswing before the club has even reached the top. 

I wouldn’t say firing. Maybe starting the lower body...

[GolfLug]

5 minutes ago, Vinsk said:

I wouldn’t say firing. Maybe starting the lower body... 

Ha ha ha...

[downbylaw11]

im simply replying to his request to shallow out earlier.  whether or not he needs it i dunno. but his face looks toe up at p6 which means he can't rotate freely through the shot without losing his wrist angles and standing up through the shot to square the face. his body is simply reacting to an openish clubface in the downswing imo and doing whatever it can to square which means flipping and standing up a little.  I would say if he wishes to rotate through the shot without stalling, flipping, or standing up, then he would have to add more flexion in his lead wrist on the downswing to get the clubface square to his backline at which point he can simply rotate through without any compensations or power loss

[Nick_wahl_]

On 4/2/2020 at 2:23 PM, iacas said:

It's more about how your swing is almost "only" rotational.

But again, I'd probably address the shallow/steep stuff first.

Tough to say, really. As a +3, you're talking about smaller and smaller errors, and we've got a whole two swings (into a net, off a mat) to work with here. So I'm not dying on any hill here, so to speak. But I'd look, at first, in the two areas I've mentioned:

1. Dynamic movement (a little lower body, a little shift back and a re-center or "fall" left at A3)
2. Excessive shallowing and a little forcing of the handle forward.

 

So I’ve been trying to feel a very small shift to the right side in my backswing. Do you mind taking a look now? 
Also,  You were right. I noticed I was forcing the handle forward a little bit which was hurting my speed. To combat it I’ve been feeling like my right arm starts extending through the shot early in the downswing. What’s crazy is that feeling actually Gave me more lag lol But It helped because I release the lag rather than trying to hold on to it. 

One more thing..

My speed has improved in the last week but although to me, It looks like my swing is coming along nicely and I don’t really see anything that would hinder my club head speed but for some reason I can’t get driver above 115 on my swing speed radar. 
Two of my golf buddies don’t have the lag or dynamics I have but they are getting 123 mph on the radar. To me, it looks like I should be able to swing it way faster but I’m not. 

Do you see anything that is hindering my speed? 

 

 

13 hours ago, downbylaw11 said:

im simply replying to his request to shallow out earlier.  whether or not he needs it i dunno. but his face looks toe up at p6 which means he can't rotate freely through the shot without losing his wrist angles and standing up through the shot to square the face. his body is simply reacting to an openish clubface in the downswing imo and doing whatever it can to square which means flipping and standing up a little.  I would say if he wishes to rotate through the shot without stalling, flipping, or standing up, then he would have to add more flexion in his lead wrist on the downswing to get the clubface square to his backline at which point he can simply rotate through without any compensations or power loss

Hey man, I appreciate you chiming in. I don’t really see the hands starting down before the body though.. 

 

[iacas]

3 hours ago, Nick_wahl_ said:

So I’ve been trying to feel a very small shift to the right side in my backswing. Do you mind taking a look now? 
Also,  You were right. I noticed I was forcing the handle forward a little bit which was hurting my speed. To combat it I’ve been feeling like my right arm starts extending through the shot early in the downswing. What’s crazy is that feeling actually Gave me more lag lol But It helped because I release the lag rather than trying to hold on to it. 

That's kinda to be expected. And these are better, IMO. Can still be better though:

You vs. Rory:

Yeah, these differences are small, and no, you don't have to swing like Rory, but watch Day 10:

3 hours ago, Nick_wahl_ said:

One more thing..

My speed has improved in the last week but although to me, It looks like my swing is coming along nicely and I don’t really see anything that would hinder my club head speed but for some reason I can’t get driver above 115 on my swing speed radar. 
Two of my golf buddies don’t have the lag or dynamics I have but they are getting 123 mph on the radar. To me, it looks like I should be able to swing it way faster but I’m not. 

Some people simply have the ability to swing faster than others. Do some SuperSpeed training or something…?