Upgrade From Adams A7?

[SullyGolf]

10 hours ago, Denny Bang Bang said:

@SullyGolf There are some that would disagree (and have), but I think the A7 (not A7OS) was a great starter set of irons & hybrids.  No crazy offset, not a big profile, forgiving.

 As you’re also considering the used route, I think it’s worth looking at the Mizuno JPX or Mizuno MP HMB.  I personally know two people who “graduated” to those after starting out with the A7, and were very happy.  Titleist AP1 and AP2 could also be good options.  Hopefully there’s a golf shop near by that you can try before you buy.

Hey thanks!

I couldn't put my finger on it but offset was a huge thing I hated about my prior irons which were some old big bertha. Something about the big offset just really nuked my confidence at address on the ball. It's definitely something I think I would want to keep in line with what my A7 had in that regard, I also really like how the higher irons looked in terms of profile while addressing the ball.

I guess I forgot to mention that I was looking for Irons that I could sort of grow into, which I believe the A7 allowed me to do. I feel my game got better by using them compared to my prior oversized, heavy offset irons. So I would like it if my next set accomplished the same thing for me. I'll take a look at those Mizuno's!

I'm thinking used is probably going to be my best option of getting something high quality but in my price point so thank you for the suggestions.

Edited August 17, 2022 by SullyGolf

[SullyGolf]

On 8/16/2022 at 9:40 AM, jshots said:

You may want to get fit even though you think you are standard standard. I was in the same boat, got fit around 2010 at standard standard so in 2018ish I bought some clubs off the shelf thinking I was standard standard.

Well I went to my local pro this summer to have him check them for me, and turns out they were 3 degrees too flat for my swing. He said that he frequently sees standard clubs are not the same from the manufacturer, and you should always get them checked and bent after you get them, and additionally checked every season.

 

23 hours ago, Shindig said:

I haven't looked into them, sorry.  

 

22 hours ago, ChetlovesMer said:

This may work for you.

Adams Idea a7OS Hybrid Single 7 Iron Performance Lite 85 Steel Regular

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Gender: Men, Dexterity: Right-Handed, Shaft Material: Steel, Shaft Model: Performance Lite 85, Length: 37.5", Lie: Standard, Flex: Regular, Grip: Adams Velvet, Grip Size: Standard, Condition Rating: 7.

 

Do you guys think a set of Wilson D7 5-GW for $400 would be a decent price / performance buy?
Not pulling the trigger yet but thought they looked pretty nice for recent clubs (2020) and they seem to have the look / feel with minimal offset that I'd be looking for.

[ChetlovesMer]

30 minutes ago, SullyGolf said:

 

 

Do you guys think a set of Wilson D7 5-GW for $400 would be a decent price / performance buy?
Not pulling the trigger yet but thought they looked pretty nice for recent clubs (2020) and they seem to have the look / feel with minimal offset that I'd be looking for.

I've never used those per se. But They got great reviews when they came out. And Wilson makes good stuff. Very under-rated. 

[Shindig]

17 minutes ago, SullyGolf said:

Do you guys think a set of Wilson D7 5-GW for $400 would be a decent price / performance buy?
Not pulling the trigger yet but thought they looked pretty nice for recent clubs (2020) and they seem to have the look / feel with minimal offset that I'd be looking for.

I agree they meet the look and feel, but they're a lot less forgiving than some others with that look and feel.  This seems to be a pattern for Wilson lately.  Don't get me wrong, I've hit some of Wilson's offerings and they feel great when you hit them well.  I don't think you listed a particular handicap, but I wouldn't suggest that model to someone whose handicap is higher than about five and who plays and practices very often (and has for a while). 

Here's the thing:  approach shots are the single most important aspect of golf to get right.  You can play pretty good golf with good approach shots and minimal short game knowledge/practice.  If you're having trouble with approach shots, you'd need something like a Tour quality short game to have a semi-satisfying score.  If you're having good approach shots, you can have a short game like... well, like me, and still break 80 on occasion.

This is why I'm a big believer in having the right set of irons, and several factors fit into this.  The right look is important -- if you address the ball, look at the clubface, and think "who am I kidding?," then the hypothetical best-ever irons don't mean anything.  But it's true in the other direction too:  high quality players' irons aren't helping you unless you're a top ball striker.   I should know, I spent three years playing Mizuno MP-series irons back when I thought I was a good iron player because I didn't slice my 7-iron;  nevermind that it only went 120 yards. 

But it's also important to have forgiving clubs -- put some impact tape or any of the various "spray the face" offerings and hit a half dozen shots with a mid-iron at the range.  When I do this, I am surprised at how many good shots I hit that aren't where I expected them on the clubface.  

I can elaborate on this point later if you'd like me to do so.

[SullyGolf]

16 minutes ago, Shindig said:

I agree they meet the look and feel, but they're a lot less forgiving than some others with that look and feel.  This seems to be a pattern for Wilson lately.  Don't get me wrong, I've hit some of Wilson's offerings and they feel great when you hit them well.  I don't think you listed a particular handicap, but I wouldn't suggest that model to someone whose handicap is higher than about five and who plays and practices very often (and has for a while). 

Here's the thing:  approach shots are the single most important aspect of golf to get right.  You can play pretty good golf with good approach shots and minimal short game knowledge/practice.  If you're having trouble with approach shots, you'd need something like a Tour quality short game to have a semi-satisfying score.  If you're having good approach shots, you can have a short game like... well, like me, and still break 80 on occasion.

This is why I'm a big believer in having the right set of irons, and several factors fit into this.  The right look is important -- if you address the ball, look at the clubface, and think "who am I kidding?," then the hypothetical best-ever irons don't mean anything.  But it's true in the other direction too:  high quality players' irons aren't helping you unless you're a top ball striker.   I should know, I spent three years playing Mizuno MP-series irons back when I thought I was a good iron player because I didn't slice my 7-iron;  nevermind that it only went 120 yards. 

But it's also important to have forgiving clubs -- put some impact tape or any of the various "spray the face" offerings and hit a half dozen shots with a mid-iron at the range.  When I do this, I am surprised at how many good shots I hit that aren't where I expected them on the clubface.  

I can elaborate on this point later if you'd like me to do so.

Really for single digit handicappers? I'm not talking the tour version, just the D7 which I've seen categorized as "super game improvement" on several sites.

Wilson Staff D7 Irons Review - Plugged In Golf

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The new Wilson Staff D7 Irons send the golf ball high and long. Easy on the eyes and the wallet as you'll discover in this review.

 

[ChetlovesMer]

17 minutes ago, Shindig said:

I agree they meet the look and feel, but they're a lot less forgiving than some others with that look and feel.  This seems to be a pattern for Wilson lately.  Don't get me wrong, I've hit some of Wilson's offerings and they feel great when you hit them well.  I don't think you listed a particular handicap, but I wouldn't suggest that model to someone whose handicap is higher than about five and who plays and practices very often (and has for a while). 

Here's the thing:  approach shots are the single most important aspect of golf to get right.  You can play pretty good golf with good approach shots and minimal short game knowledge/practice.  If you're having trouble with approach shots, you'd need something like a Tour quality short game to have a semi-satisfying score.  If you're having good approach shots, you can have a short game like... well, like me, and still break 80 on occasion.

This is why I'm a big believer in having the right set of irons, and several factors fit into this.  The right look is important -- if you address the ball, look at the clubface, and think "who am I kidding?," then the hypothetical best-ever irons don't mean anything.  But it's true in the other direction too:  high quality players' irons aren't helping you unless you're a top ball striker.   I should know, I spent three years playing Mizuno MP-series irons back when I thought I was a good iron player because I didn't slice my 7-iron;  nevermind that it only went 120 yards. 

But it's also important to have forgiving clubs -- put some impact tape or any of the various "spray the face" offerings and hit a half dozen shots with a mid-iron at the range.  When I do this, I am surprised at how many good shots I hit that aren't where I expected them on the clubface.  

I can elaborate on this point later if you'd like me to do so.

Hold on a tic.

Are we talking about these? 

or are we talking about these? 

Cuz, if we are talking about the second set. I don't think you'll find anything much more forgiving. 

1 minute ago, SullyGolf said:

Really for single digit handicappers? I'm not talking the tour version, just the D7 which I've seen categorized as "super game improvement" on several sites.

Wilson Staff D7 Irons Review - Plugged In Golf

---

The new Wilson Staff D7 Irons send the golf ball high and long. Easy on the eyes and the wallet as you'll discover in this review.

 

Oops, you must have posted this the same time I did.

 

[Shindig]

@SullyGolfand @ChetlovesMer yes, I meant the D7 that are marketed as Super Game Improvement.  I don't think they're anywhere near as forgiving as marketed.  

[SullyGolf]

31 minutes ago, Shindig said:

@SullyGolfand @ChetlovesMer yes, I meant the D7 that are marketed as Super Game Improvement.  I don't think they're anywhere near as forgiving as marketed.  

ok good to note.

Damn this is hard, seems like what you get $400 has gone way downhill in the last 10 years or so since I bought clubs, which of course it has.

The search will continue... The TaylorMade Stealth are super sexy and I want but definitely pushing the budget. Those Mizuno are nice too, I'll have to keep holding and wait for a sale before I strike.

[ChetlovesMer]

29 minutes ago, Shindig said:

@SullyGolfand @ChetlovesMer yes, I meant the D7 that are marketed as Super Game Improvement.  I don't think they're anywhere near as forgiving as marketed.  

That's interesting. My pops played the D300's which were Wilson's offering before the D7's and they were great. I have to admit, when I hit them they were like cheating. Definitely one trick ponies, but that one trick was a high dead straight shot. My playing partner in league plays the D9's which came out right after the D7's and basically the same story. 

So, if I understand you correctly you are saying that Wilson made this?

2019 - D300's = Awesome and easy to hit.

2020 - D7's = Terrible and difficult to hit.

2021 - D9's = Awesome and easy to hit. 

Seems odd to me, What are you basing your dislike of the D7's on? 

[SullyGolf]

Sorry @ChetlovesMer and @Shindig

One last thing, my uh budget just recently expanded quite a bit. I bought a semi expensive piece of equipment for my home office which died a short and abrupt death. Was going to return it when I posted on social media about it and the brand's director of relations offered to replace it and throw in another free much more expensive unit as I spent some time talking to him and his team and sent my failed unit directly to the engineers for testing. I don't have much a use case for the other unit so I'll probably sell it and put the money towards my irons. Incredible how life works sometimes isn't it?

So uh, bump the budget to 1k.

Do your recommendations change? Thoughts on the Stealth Irons from TaylorMade? I'm kind of falling in love with them and heading over to dicks to hit them tomorrow.

[Denny Bang Bang]

10 hours ago, SullyGolf said:

I guess I forgot to mention that I was looking for Irons that I could sort of grow into, which I believe the A7 allowed me to do. I feel my game got better by using them compared to my prior oversized, heavy offset irons. So I would like it if my next set accomplished the same thing for me. I'll take a look at those Mizuno's!

Yea, that’s what was also great about them.  They were still appropriate whether you played to a 30 or a 10 index.  I think the same can be said for the Mizuno JPX or Titleist AP1.

19 minutes ago, SullyGolf said:

Do your recommendations change? Thoughts on the Stealth Irons from TaylorMade? I'm kind of falling in love with them and heading over to dicks to hit them tomorrow.

If you fall in love with the Stealth irons, you like how they set up to a ball, they’re fit appropriately (length, shaft, you can adjust lie down the road if necessary), and within budget… I say go for it.  I mean you’ll probably be playing them for 8+ years, and will get your money’s worth.

I would recommend hitting a few other irons while there, just to confirm you’re in love (kinda like dating before you tie the knot).

Edited August 17, 2022 by Denny Bang Bang
Add last sentence

[SullyGolf]

21 minutes ago, Denny Bang Bang said:

Yea, that’s what was also great about them.  They were still appropriate whether you played to a 30 or a 10 index.  I think the same can be said for the Mizuno JPX or Titleist AP1.

If you fall in love with the Stealth irons, you like how they set up to a ball, they’re fit appropriately (length, shaft, you can adjust lie down the road if necessary), and within budget… I say go for it.  I mean you’ll probably be playing them for 8+ years, and will get your money’s worth.

I would recommend hitting a few other irons while there, just to confirm you’re in love (kinda like dating before you tie the knot).

Yeah was planning on a bit of speed dating. Would AP1 be the T100 now?

[Shindig]

9 hours ago, SullyGolf said:

ok good to note.

Damn this is hard, seems like what you get $400 has gone way downhill in the last 10 years or so since I bought clubs, which of course it has.

The search will continue... The TaylorMade Stealth are super sexy and I want but definitely pushing the budget. Those Mizuno are nice too, I'll have to keep holding and wait for a sale before I strike.

It's like that high school civics lesson, when we discuss the time George Washington threw a $1 coin across the Potomac.  Some cynical students will mention that he couldn't have been strong enough to do so, or the river was too wide, or air resistance would stop it, and basically they just don't understand that a dollar went a lot further in those days. 

9 hours ago, ChetlovesMer said:

That's interesting. My pops played the D300's which were Wilson's offering before the D7's and they were great. I have to admit, when I hit them they were like cheating. Definitely one trick ponies, but that one trick was a high dead straight shot. My playing partner in league plays the D9's which came out right after the D7's and basically the same story. 

So, if I understand you correctly you are saying that Wilson made this?

2019 - D300's = Awesome and easy to hit.

2020 - D7's = Terrible and difficult to hit.

2021 - D9's = Awesome and easy to hit. 

Seems odd to me, What are you basing your dislike of the D7's on? 

I'm not saying Wilson made a stinker in the middle, although it's possible, but I don't think the irons are bad, I just don't think they're as forgiving as they're marketed as being.  I find the Maltby Playability Factor comparisons to be much more meaningful than which Golf Digest Hot List category they appear in.  Many years ago, I read a lot about how he came up with the system and it resonated with me. 

This should teach me (it won't) about jotting off a quick note in a topic before heading out to the office. 

3 hours ago, SullyGolf said:

So uh, bump the budget to 1k.

Do your recommendations change? Thoughts on the Stealth Irons from TaylorMade? I'm kind of falling in love with them and heading over to dicks to hit them tomorrow.

Nice.  I love it when a plan comes together.

TaylorMade has really upped their game in recent years.  

3 hours ago, SullyGolf said:

Yeah was planning on a bit of speed dating. Would AP1 be the T100 now?

I think the T300 are their intended successor to the AP1.  They really didn't do themselves (or us) any favors with the naming convention.  Mizuno and Ping really do have the "you know the intention from the name" thing down. 

[ChetlovesMer]

3 minutes ago, Shindig said:

I find the Maltby Playability Factor comparisons to be much more meaningful than which Golf Digest Hot List category they appear in.  Many years ago, I read a lot about how he came up with the system and it resonated with me. 

Oh, ... I'm sorry. 

[Shindig]

1 hour ago, ChetlovesMer said:

Oh, ... I'm sorry. 

Nothing to be sorry about;  I was at fault when I omitted some key details in my rush to provide my comment this morning.

[SullyGolf]

Quick update.

Went and hit on the launch monitor for a solid 30 minutes this morning.

Hit the following clubs..

Taylormade Stealth, Taylormade P790, Callaway Mavrik and Callaway Mavrik Pro (they didn't have any mizuno's)

If I had to rank them

1) Mavrik Pro

2) Stealth

3) P790

4) Mavrik

Am I crazy, would Mavrik pro's be a terrible idea for me?

Also I hit the Mavrik pro's the best with the best consistency. Stealth were 2nd with more fat shots and Mavrik were decent too but they look like freaking shovels.

Edited August 18, 2022 by SullyGolf

[ChetlovesMer]

11 minutes ago, SullyGolf said:

Am I crazy, would Mavrik pro's be a terrible idea for me?

Not at all. 

There are tons a great clubs out there. You should get what you like the look of, what you hit well, feels good, and what gives you confidence. Don't underestimate feel. 

Plus, you can always tweak the set up. If they are very strong lofted maybe you for go the 5 iron and add a gap wedge. If the lofts are weaker, perhaps get a 5 iron or even a 4 iron. 

Others may disagree, but if I were you I'd ignore the labels. i.e. beginners clubs, game improvement, super game improvement, players clubs, etc. ... 

The only suggestion I'd make is see if you can hit them on grass to see if you still like them. If you can't make sure you can return or exchange them. Sometimes performance on grass can be very different from off a mat. 

Good luck. 

 

Edited August 18, 2022 by ChetlovesMer

[SullyGolf]

Ok probably one of my last updates, wound up with the Mavrik Pro in standard / standard with the Elevate 105 stiff shaft.

Clubs came in from CPO I also added the Epic Speed 3 wood and the new Stroke Lab version of the Odyssey 1 (have had my old Odyssey 1 White Ice for like 13 years now so gave her an upgrade too).

Of course UPS delivered the iron set to the wrong house nearly 5 streets over, luckily the nice lady that lived there came over and asked me to pick them up. Of course I had already been fighting UPS hard on this as they are 0% helpful with this stuff, glad I can just move on from that.

Went to the range yesterday and it was a complete disaster, but something was massively off with me, had a few stressful things going on (job interview, club delivery situation etc...). I even managed to crown my driver like 3x in a row which I haven't done in years... So decided to sleep that off and hit the range again today with a fresh start and made sure to focus.

Found myself flushing the 8-aw pretty consistently they all just felt amazing from the get go. 7 Iron is where it started to fall off a bit but I was able to work it out focusing on head position, shaft lean and ball position probably hit about 50-60% good strikes on the 7 and even the bad strikes weren't awful. Jumped down to the 5 iron and it took me a while to work it out, finally decided I would move on after 2 flush hits in a row and that took me probably 12 balls to accomplish. The 3 wood on the other hand was freaking money, profile is near identical to my old R11 3w and felt super natural from the first swing.

Signed up for some lessons next week at the course down the street from me, definitely think I'll need to focus and refine my swing a good bit to actually get the most out of these irons. Got a big round at a super fancy club my buddy is a member at this Sunday, think I might leave the 4i in the bag and bring along the 3h and 4h from my Adams set if I run into a 190-210 yard par 3 or fairway shot or something.

Thanks for the help guys, I'll probably update sometime down the road after I get a month of using these and lessons out of the way and see where I am at.

Edited August 25, 2022 by SullyGolf