MacKinzie Kline and the USGA

[Thrash13]

I was watching this story on The Golf Channel last night, and it really caught my attention much like the Casey Martin story of the late-1990s.

MacKinzie Kline is a 14-year old girl with a congenital heart disease that makes it tough to walk 18 holes of golf. She asked to be granted the use of a cart for the U.S. Girls Junior and U.S. Women's Amateur coming up soon.

She was originally not granted the use of a cart, but the USGA overturned that decision yesterday much to the pleasure of the Kline family.

I know the Casey Martin situation raised a lot of controversy, and this one obviously raised a little.

My question is this: Is it fair to grant certain people the use of a cart during competition?

[slimeberry]

I think the USGA is dead wrong on this one.

[cmarkmyers]

It is a very slippery slope. How does the one determine how serious an injury/condition has to be in order to grant an exception to use a cart? Isn't it possilbe that we could get to the point where one person with a similar affliction to another can be told they cannot use a cart while the other person is able to? It is just very difficult to determine where to draw the line.

This situation - an amateur event with a young girl who has a definite problem - does warrant the use of a cart. But lets say there were three people who had asthma. One has a very, very mild chronic conditon. Another has a severe conditon, and the third is somewhere in between. Should any of these people get to use a cart? None? Some?

The problem with the Mackinzie case is that it opens the door for others to attempt to use a cart. That in turns opens the door for competitors (healthy and not so healty alike) to complain about preferentral treatment.

My opinion is that in the professional ranks there should be no carts, not even on the Champions tour. Seeing a pro race around in a golf cart really takes away from the majesty and traditions of competative golf. Not able to walk an entire four rounds? Sorry, you are not meant to play competative professional golf.

However, amateurs should be judged on a case by case basis. In the past I would have said no all around on the use of carts but seeing this poor 14-year old girl softened my heart of stone (albeit just a bit). So let some people use them but be prepared to make them prove their case. And then get ready for the backlash.

[slimeberry]

The issue is not wether she does or does not need a cart. Her Dr. says she does. The USGA is not questioning that. The USGA is not ruling her ineligible to use a cart because she isn't sick enough, but because she didn't get her request turned in at the same time she registered to play. That is the USGA rule. Although her heart condition has been w/ her since she was a toddler, the shortness of breath and chest pains only started to affect her recently during play, and after she had already registered to play in this particular event. Her Dr. says that it is dangerous for her to walk 18. The USGA is keeping her from riding on a technicality, not because she isn't sick enough. SHE IS!!! Just a technicality, which they are good at clinging to. I think a young woman should be supported and encouraged, and not discouraged, to play w/ her condition. She is not requesting a cart for every event, like Casey Martin, but only until her Dr.s can run more tests and can make sure she doesn't DIE during match play. That would be good for the game!!!

[iacas]

I was watching this story on The Golf Channel last night, and it really caught my attention much like the Casey Martin story of the late-1990s.

Bear in mind that Casey Martin sued the PGA Tour, not the USGA.

My question is this: Is it fair to grant certain people the use of a cart during competition?

I agree that walking is an intrinsic part of golf. They aren't even carrying their own clubs.

As politically incorrect as it may seem (or truly be), I think that sports are what they are, and if you can't play under the same rules as anyone else, for some reason, then you can't play. I am not suing the NBA because I can't slam dunk a basketball. I don't possess the physical traits to do it, that's all. If she has a health issue that prevents her from walking 18 holes of golf, she should find something else to occupy her time. Tough beans. Life isn't fair sometimes. I still think the PGA Tour should have won against Martin. He has a good job as a golf coach now - it's not like the game in its entirety shut him out. He just wasn't blessed with the physical traits And finally, on the Kline case, she had the option to request a cart. She failed to do so. She didn't because she wasn't aware of her condition at the time. She was going to play anyway, even without a cart and even with doctors telling her she could literally die. Once again I'm led to question the parents - why would you let your kid play if they could die? The USGA shouldn't have had to cave in here, but they did so only to avoid the media shitstorm that would have ensued. Maybe I should sue the NBA...

The USGA is keeping her from riding on a technicality, not because she isn't sick enough.

Uh, no, they're not. They are allowing her to ride. Please get things straight.

[slimeberry]

I agree w/ questioning the parents in this situation. It is a strange choice they have made. I also agree w/ the Casey Martin comments as well. He physically isn't able, and never will be. He shouldn't play in competition. Fine.

My argument is that the USGA should, if they don't want her to ride, call a spade a spade and stand behing their decision. Accept the shitstorm that will follow. But don't hide behing a technicality. To me, that looks worse.

If the USGA would simply say "no", well... fine. I agree, I can't run a marathon. Should I get to ride a bike because I'm out of shape? No.

My issue is that the USGA said she COULD use a cart... if she had asked for it during registration. Well, to me that seems a little cold.

Don't throw it back on her as if it's her fault. If the USGA doesn't want to let her ride, have the balls to stand up to the media pressure, the bleeding hearts, etc. and stand behing their decision. To hide behind a technicality and throw the blame back to her, as if she somehow knew this would all come up is BS.

If she needs a cart and the USGA says it's OK, let her ride. If the USGA says no way, golf requires that you walk, as a marathon requires that you run, then that to is fine. Just don't hide behing red tape because you don't want to look mean. That , to me, just makes them look worse.

Make any sense at all??? I don't even know if I understand anymore.

[iacas]

My argument is that the USGA should, if they don't want her to ride, call a spade a spade and stand behing their decision. Accept the shitstorm that will follow. But don't hide behing a technicality. To me, that looks worse.

Okay... but then you contradict yourself:

Don't throw it back on her as if it's her fault. If the USGA doesn't want to let her ride, have the balls to stand up to the media pressure, the bleeding hearts, etc. and stand behing their decision. To hide behind a technicality and throw the blame back to her, as if she somehow knew this would all come up is BS.

They're not "standing behind" anything. They reversed their ruling. There is no "technicality." They could have stood behind the technicality, but instead they said, basically, "she's a special case, so we'll let this one slide."

They're not standing behind a technicality at all. Had they continued to say "no, she didn't request it when she was supposed to" that would be an example of them standing behind the technicality...

Just don't hide behing red tape because you don't want to look mean.

Again, they're not.

[allin]

I believe these decisions are incredibly complex, I am sure the USGA and PGA just hate dealing with them. Instead of evaluating each case from scratch, a process needs to be established. The medical condition should have to be serious enough that the participant is still at a disadvantage even while riding a cart. For example I have arthritic knees and hips and chronic tendinitis in my ankles. Most days I am better off walking because I stiffen up quickly. If it is above 95 though the benefit would exceed the loss. That would be unacceptable to me or fellow competitors. (See Peter Jacobsen) The USGA and PGA tour should designate a medical facility, say a university with a strong sports medicine program to evaluate the condition and reccomend whether it passes this fairness test. Some day there may be challenges based on drugs also, stimulants for ADD, muscle relaxants, parkinsons, alzheimers medications, and many more legal drugs potentially affect performance. Without an outside source, that is transparent, (not just a one doctor hired gun), golf could end up with the same kind of problems, bicycling, football, baseball, track & field etc. are dealing with. What types of factors which affect performance besides equipment can be regulated?

[Rafcin]

no way. One gains advantage by using a cart therefore it can't be allowed. What's next? Since I don't have a 0.7 hcp - can I ask for "exemption" from USGA to play in US Open qualifier from the Red tees, because my ability (physical / medical / mental - WHATEVER) doesn't make me competitive from the tips? Life is tough. You either have it or you don't - there should be no difference if it's your fault or not. Sounds rough, but fair in my book.

[Thrash13]

That's why I couldn't be the person making the final decision. I would let her ride in the cart. Hell, I got all teary-eyed just watching the story on The Golf Channel, and I don't even have kids.

I was on Casey Martin's side during his case as well.

I don't think golf should take away someone's dreams just because they are forced to ride in a cart. Don't get me wrong, I'm sure it's tiring to walk 18 holes of golf as many days in a row as some golfers do. However, with the use of caddies, I don't think it's much more of an advantage to walk vs. riding in a cart. I know that I personally play my best golf when I walk rather than ride in the cart because I have more time to focus on the task at hand.

I just don't see the big advantage of riding in a cart, but I could easily be wrong in that assumption.

I don't think it's a problem at all for the USGA to allow her to ride in a cart.

I'll go into more detail if I need to.

[Rafcin]

...I don't think it's a problem at all for the USGA to allow her to ride in a cart...

again - it's not her fault, true. It's teary-eyed story, true. But where do you cut the line? what about a really fat competitor (like me) who runs out of breath at 15th tee? What about a player who can't afford "real" golf equipment?

Real question is - where will you draw the line? USGA have to guarantee even field for each competitor, so the competition is reduced to skills vs. accessories. If all players can use a cart - go ahead and compete. If others can't - S.O.L....

[Thrash13]

again - it's not her fault, true. It's teary-eyed story, true. But where do you cut the line? what about a really fat competitor (like me) who runs out of breath at 15th tee? What about a player who can't afford "real" golf equipment?

Rafi, you aren't fat.

Honestly though, someone who is overweight has a choice to lose weight. MacKinzie Kline has no alternative in life. She really can't choose to improve her condition. I agree that the line needs to be drawn somewhere, but I couldn't be the one to do it or the one who decides where to draw it. Call me a softy on the subject I guess.

[slimeberry]

The point that I was making was based on information that I had read in Golfworld Magazine. If they have since given her the green flag to ride, then I stand corrected. The USGA is no longer hanging on to a technicality. I had not heard this, however, as of my post yesterday.

If they have not given her an OK because of when she registered, well, again, I believe that that IS hiding behind a technicality.

I think it is chickenshit to say "Well, you could have used a cart, but you used red ink instead of black on your application." As idiotic as that sounds, that is not any more lame than "Well, you could have used a cart, had you asked for one BEFORE you found out you might die."

That IS hiding behind red tape, IMHO.

But, maybe the USGA went ahead and said OK. I had not heard that, but I do not doubt your information.

And Sorry if I wasn't clear, but no, I did not contradict myself.

[Rafcin]

Rafi, you aren't fat.

thanks for the kind word, but I'm a fat pig

Anyway - this kind of discussion always ticks me off - it's the same thing as some schools forbidding game of dodge-ball, because weaker kids (or the chobby ones) are being doinked on the heads and only the stronger/fitter win in this game. What's wrong with that? It's carts for sick people, who want to play anyway, it's handicaps for less skilled players who want to compete anyway, it's the political correctness that drives me up the wall. Life is tough, suck it up. Oh wait. Here is another dilema. This weekend is my club championship and my lower back hurts like hell, I probably won't be able to play it (or if I do I'll suck ). I think they should postpone it until I'm 100%, right? It's not my fault that my back hurts... Why shouldn't I have a chance to compete?

[Thrash13]

The point that I was making was based on information that I had read in Golfworld Magazine. If they have since given her the green flag to ride, then I stand corrected. The USGA is no longer hanging on to a technicality. I had not heard this, however, as of my post yesterday.

Yeah, the story was on Golf Central on Tuesday, and they talked with MacKinzie's dad. So they just changed their ruling this week.

Rafi, you do bring up great points because it's really tough to tell what is a legit excuse and what isn't. It would probably be easier if they just made everyone walk, but there are exceptions to every rule as we all know. I certainly think this is the time for one. My back hurts all the time too, but I could go to a chiropractor. MacKinzie has to live with her disease no matter what she does.

[thehillgolfer]

i have no information about this whole deal except what i've just read on this thread and i think the usga made the right call. for the only reason being that carts are allowed in this tournament (or so thats what i think i've gathered) If i was another competitor in that tourney i wouldnt mind letting her use one either, do unto others as you would have them do unto you....

[iacas]

I had not heard this, however, as of my post yesterday.

Cody said this in the first post of this thread:

She was originally not granted the use of a cart, but the USGA overturned that decision yesterday much to the pleasure of the Kline family.

If they have not given her an OK because of when she registered, well, again, I believe that that IS hiding behind a technicality.

Yet where would you draw the line? Sure, it'd be a technicality, but another name for those kinds of things are "rules." I tend to like to stick to the letter of the law, even when it's unfortunate, simply because it's a lot easier that way and everyone knows what they're getting into beforehand. The rules of golf aren't "technicalities" any more than the rule the USGA was enforcing before changing their minds.

But, maybe the USGA went ahead and said OK. I had not heard that, but I do not doubt your information.

I had assumed you read the numerous posts that pointed out that the decision had been reversed, in which case your posts made no sense (i.e. "hiding behind a technicality" when they had already changed their minds, etc.

But anyway...

[iacas]

MacKinzie has to live with her disease no matter what she does.

And my position can be summed up as follows: perhaps she should choose to spend her time doing things that don't threaten her life (like golf).

But I've said that already, so, I'll shaddup now.