Whatta Bunch Of Crap!

[jamesduncan]

again, where did someone say he cant back away?

youre looking for things and problems with the rule that simply arent there.

you can back away, you can leave the bunker, change clubs.

the issue here is that he took practice swings (therefore he was allowed to dig his feet into the suface of the bunker) and then moved closer to the ball and did it again.

thats the violation. you simply cant do that. inches or feet.

and yes that could make a difference, especially depending on the type of bunker.

cheers

[Thrash13]

being able to dig in your feet at various points around the ball is one way of seeing if there are any diviations in consistency throughout the bunker that a player can try.

I don't believe he dug his feet in in any way, shape, or form before addressing the ball. I think he just stood in the bunker and took a couple practice swings. I could be wrong, but I watched it and didn't remember him digging in.

I agree that the player shouldn't be allowed to dig in and get a feel that way. But I don't see how standing in the bunker (not digging in) and taking a couple practice swings would help.

[jamesduncan]

interesting indeed.

can any one post a clip of it?

its so hard to tell sometimes on TV what has actually happened.

reminds me of when jeff maggart hit himself coming out of a bunker in the final round of the 2003 masters.

judging by the TV visuals, it seemed like nothing out of the ordinary had happened (even on the replay). it wasnt until he called the penalty on himself that it became apparent what had transpired.

Cheers

[iammike]

Having reviewed the discussion (not just here, but in every news outlet I could find in 10 minutes), it seems Byrd was penalized for breaking rule 13-4, which talks about testing the conditions of the hazard prior to taking his stance.

Ok so whats the intent of this? Does taking a practice swing other than where your ball is somehow give you an idea of how to hit it better? Is this like something to prevent people from figureing out that their foot my accidentally slip in the sand, and therefore give them an advantage? I don't exactly know the history of the rule, so it just sounds like nit-pickyness to me. Then again i don't seek ways to cheat, so I probably wouldn't think of the advantage this gives you right quick anyways.

[Rafcin]

It was a clear rules violation, and Jonathan Byrd should have known about it....

Great point Cody. Scrolling through all the posts and finally a statement I was waiting for

I can tell you - after all the Wie-haters jumping on the "that stupid teenager should read some rules, she'd know better than touch the moss on the backswing in the bunker" bandwagon... I can't wipe a smile off my face. Where are you all now? Byrd is ok, because he didn't say "rulebook is a boring read"? Here you have a guy who's been on the circuits for years, yet nobody is all over his butt. Does it mean they COULD not know the rules and not being stoned to death for it? Amazing.

[jamesduncan]

Ok so whats the intent of this? Does taking a practice swing other than where your ball is somehow give you an idea of how to hit it better?

i would image the reasoning is that once youre taking a practice swing, youre in effect getting a sense of the firmess of the sand in an area of the bunker other than where your ball is (even if you havent dug your feet in), since youre shifting your weight while in a stable position (as opposed to walking)

personally id see that as an advantage to be honest.

[Thrash13]

The only conclusion I have come to while reading this topic is the fact I need to re-read the rules of golf in its entirety. I'm not sure how many penalty strokes I've incurred this year by simply not paying attention to the situation. I have probably taken a practice swing while standing in a bunker before, although I can't pinpoint any specific case.

I just need to read the rules again. I definitely don't know all of them.

It might be a long and tough Newport Cup for me this year.

[iacas]

I think I heard of an incident a couple of years back when a TV viewer called in an infraction he noticed and got someone disqualified. I don't like this junk. Golf is a sport of honor and professionals as well as devoted recreational players will uphold the rules and traditions on their own. It should not become an interactive media exercise.

My opinion is that a rules infraction is a rules infraction. I don't care who reports it. I don't even have a problem with fans calling in - if an actual rule is broken. I did have a problem with Bamberger waiting for so long - but wouldn't have had a problem if he had brought the issue up right then or even before she was done with her round.

If you break the rules, you've broken the rules. The proper penalty needs to be given. Yes, that means guys on TV are more likely to be penalized by someone watching on TV, but by the same token, what does it change if someone who's five strokes over the cut line on the 17th hole on Friday breaks a rule. Nothing changes (and he's likely not on TV). A rule was broken. Clearly he didn't have the knowledge to call it on himself. Ignorance has never been a good enough excuse to get away with breaking rules. You let it slide for one guy and soon all sorts of people are gonna be saying "I didn't know!"

I've replayed his violation several times. If that is a violation of the intended rule so is walking on the sand or wiggling your feet to secure a solid stance. This was clearly a very bad call.

There's a difference between what he did and walking to your ball.

far from silly, in my opinion anyways.

Ditto. The rules are written the way they are because of certain situations. Testing the condition of a hazard is against the rules for a reason.

This goes hand in hand with someone taking multiple practice swings over their ball when in a fescue-like type lie, in order to try and clear away a better path for their club to hit the ball cleanly.

Among other things, yep. There are lots of ways to push the rules, and many of the rules themselves are not absolute or somewhat of a grey area. Byrd should avoid the grey areas more often. It cost him this time.

As I said before, there's a reason guys take their practice strokes in their address position over the ball or outside the bunker entirely.