Club fitting 101

[Kobey]

Warning!  Very basic.

I've seen a lot about club fitting on here but usually it is just advice to get them fit.  Two months ago I didn't even know there was such a thing.  I thought you bought a set of clubs and had a choice, men's or women's.  Even until just a few days ago I thought that fitting was really just something for better players to give them a little bit extra.  I couldn't understand why someone would want to change the length of their clubs unless they were very tall or very short.  After all, in my mind shortening a 3 iron would really just turn it into a 4 iron.  Now I feel like a complete idiot.

So today I took some clubs and checked the angle of the head against a concrete floor at my address position.  The heel was touching the floor but the toe was about 1/4" off the floor.  So I tried choking up on them and that got them level.  Then I tried slow swings both ways.  At full length I was hitting the floor with the heel about 6" behind where the ball would be and choked up I was hitting right where I should be.  That would seem to explain some things:

1.  I have been very inconsistent and sometimes dig a crater way behind the ball.  That makes sense as the heel would be hitting back there and digging the club right in.

2.  My shots were going all over the place, again because the heel hit the ground before the face hit the ball.  There was no telling where the face was pointed after that.

3.  My driving was good and I could hit a 3 wood great off the tee but not in the fairway.  Also, if I teed up high on par 3's I could hit a lot better with irons.  This would be because if I wasn't having to get all the way down to the ground, the heel wouldn't hit the ground as often.

4.  Why people use so many wedges.  I figured that since you can choke up on a wedge or short iron to decrease the distance, there wasn't a need to have 4 different wedges.  Now I think that since choking up changes the angle of the clubhead on the ground, if I choked up on a properly fitted wedge, I would be opposite of where I am now, with the toe digging into the ground and making for a much more difficult shot.

Everybody is probably going DUH about now.  Either that or some of my assumptions are wrong, in which case feel free to correct me and call me a moron.  So I'll leave it at that for now and ask my questions in another post.  I know that this is all something basic that everyone should know, but it just didn't click for me until now, so maybe other beginners have some of the same problems or questions.

By the way, one reason I don't get basic information is that the nearest golf store that does fittings is 1 1/2 hours away so I have never been to one yet.  I  have been getting all my information from here.

[mvmac]

Originally Posted by Kobey

Warning!  Very basic.

I've seen a lot about club fitting on here but usually it is just advice to get them fit.  Two months ago I didn't even know there was such a thing.  I thought you bought a set of clubs and had a choice, men's or women's.  Even until just a few days ago I thought that fitting was really just something for better players to give them a little bit extra.  I couldn't understand why someone would want to change the length of their clubs unless they were very tall or very short.  After all, in my mind shortening a 3 iron would really just turn it into a 4 iron.  Now I feel like a complete idiot.

So today I took some clubs and checked the angle of the head against a concrete floor at my address position.  The heel was touching the floor but the toe was about 1/4" off the floor.  So I tried choking up on them and that got them level.  Then I tried slow swings both ways.  At full length I was hitting the floor with the heel about 6" behind where the ball would be and choked up I was hitting right where I should be.  That would seem to explain some things:

1.  I have been very inconsistent and sometimes dig a crater way behind the ball.  That makes sense as the heel would be hitting back there and digging the club right in.

2.  My shots were going all over the place, again because the heel hit the ground before the face hit the ball.  There was no telling where the face was pointed after that.

3.  My driving was good and I could hit a 3 wood great off the tee but not in the fairway.  Also, if I teed up high on par 3's I could hit a lot better with irons.  This would be because if I wasn't having to get all the way down to the ground, the heel wouldn't hit the ground as often.

4.  Why people use so many wedges.  I figured that since you can choke up on a wedge or short iron to decrease the distance, there wasn't a need to have 4 different wedges.  Now I think that since choking up changes the angle of the clubhead on the ground, if I choked up on a properly fitted wedge, I would be opposite of where I am now, with the toe digging into the ground and making for a much more difficult shot.

Everybody is probably going DUH about now.  Either that or some of my assumptions are wrong, in which case feel free to correct me and call me a moron.  So I'll leave it at that for now and ask my questions in another post.  I know that this is all something basic that everyone should know, but it just didn't click for me until now, so maybe other beginners have some of the same problems or questions.

By the way, one reason I don't get basic information is that the nearest golf store that does fittings is 1 1/2 hours away so I have never been to one yet.  I  have been getting all my information from here.

Kobey, no worries we are all learning, some are just further ahead on the curve than others.

Take a look at this http://www.ping.com/fitting/webfit.aspx

Just to give yourself an idea of what you might need

Even if the club isn't fit for you, you still shouldn't be hitting the ground before the ball.  Ball first, ground second, not always easy to do but if the weight is forward, handle forward, not going to hit behind the ball.

Also if you do get fit, spend some time with the Mizuno Shaft Optimizer to get fit for the right shaft, just as important as having the right lie angle.

[TourSpoon]

You really need to hit balls with shoes on from a lie board.  At address a properly fitted club will sit with the toe slightly up in most cases.  What is more important is how the club contacts the ground at impact.  I have a set that was fit 20 years ago and I can go out to my garage floor with a pair of regular shoes on and nip the painted garage floor with a practice swing and the paint is dead on center.  The garage floor looks like hell but it gives a close approximation.

Also a set too upright will lead to the club face catching on the heel and closing and the opposite if clubs are too flat. The inconsistency comes with the compensations that you have to make to get past this.  The club catching behind the ball is a problem with your swing bottom, not the lie angle.  As Mike said ball first, handle leading, etc.

Additionally, the correct shaft, length, and grip size are other factors that should be considered.  The Lamkin site has a grip size calculation that I found to be dead on with my specs.  Check it out along with the sites recommended above.

[Kobey]

This is what I mean.  The heel is so low that if I hit it fat it digs right in.  It cannot bounce or glide and twists the club face.  In order to hit the ball first I have to hit the ball higher up which gives me no loft.

This would seem to me to be more like what you would want the clubface to look like at impact.  Then even if it isn't a perfect hit, the ball would still go in the right direction, just not as far if hit fat or too far if hit thin.

I'm starting to wish I took up something easier to understand, like Quantum Theory.

[saevel25]

All golf clubs have a bit of there toe in the air, the reason is because the shaft will bend downwards from the weight of the clubhead, and it will create the correct lie. You do not want your club fitted so the lie is were the clubhead is in the 2nd picture.

A lie boards it he best bet for fitting how your club enters the ground.

[Kobey]

Originally Posted by saevel25

All golf clubs have a bit of there toe in the air, the reason is because the shaft will bend downwards from the weight of the clubhead, and it will create the correct lie. You do not want your club fitted so the lie is were the clubhead is in the 2nd picture.

A lie boards it he best bet for fitting how your club enters the ground.

Gee, thanks.  Just when I think I've finally got something figured out you have to go and throw a wrinkle into it.

I still don't understand how the shaft bending will always create the correct lie angle since each shaft will be a different length and have a different amount of flex.  Plus, if I use a half swing, it doesn't seem like the shaft will bend as much as on a full swing so I will still be left with different lie angles at impact depending on how hard I swing each time.

I did some research while writing this post and it seems that the toe should only be slightly in the air at address.  My top picture doesn't look like slightly to me especially with a wedge which shouldn't flex as much as a longer iron on the downswing.

I still think a lot of my inconsistency is due to improperly fitted clubs.  I almost always pull my irons to the left which is a symptom of having the heel lower at impact.  With properly fitted clubs I will at least be able to rule out an equipment problem and go on to my swing faults.  I guess I really won't know until tax time when I can afford new clubs.  Has anyone had any experience with Golf Galaxy?  That is where I will probably end up getting my clubs (In person, not online).

[Kobey]

Next question.  Which is better for adjusting lie angle, changing shaft size or bending the head.  A lot of places seem to advise against bending as it weakens the club slightly.  Pinemeadow Golf recommends that you should only have the lie adjusted once. http://www.pinemeadowgolf.com/golf-clubs-101/3_custom-fitting.html and loft not at all.  Personally, I really don't like the idea of someone bending my brand new clubs.  I know that shorter shafts will decrease my distance but that doesn't seem to be that big a price to pay.  Every time I read a review the people say they were hitting longer and had to go one club shorter than usual so if I get the new clubs with shorter shafts my distances should stay about the same as they are now, right?

[TourSpoon]

Kobey, I always bend my clubs as soon as I buy them. This last set I bent one up and weakened 6-P, kept the 5, and strengthened 3-4.  I have never seen one break nor have I known someone with an issue. Even clubs off the rack should be checked, because I have never seen any perfect yet.  Get your clubs right!

[sean_miller]

Originally Posted by TourSpoon

Kobey, I always bend my clubs as soon as I buy them. This last set I bent one up and weakened 6-P, kept the 5, and strengthened 3-4.  I have never seen one break nor have I known someone with an issue. Even clubs off the rack should be checked, because I have never seen any perfect yet.  Get your clubs right!

I agree. Sometimes it's just a preference and sometimes its a QA problem. For example, I only know two people who ordered Mizuno irons directly from Mizuno. Both guys had to get their lofts and lies done and one of them had to send his back - 1/2 of them had the wrong shafts.

[WUTiger]

Check this site by Ralph Maltby. He's the engineer and golf club designer who founded GolfWorks in 1976. His site has lots of info on how golf clubs work, and how to fit and adjust golf clubs.

http://www.ralphmaltby.com/home

[Kobey]

Thanks Guys